Hey! I've suggested to some buddies (with varying degrees of technical expertise) that I'd like to do a frame-off clear powder coating of a bare metal truck frame. I received a few "no"s coupled with some "are you nuts"s, but when I asked for further explanation, I received nada. What are your thoughts/experiences with this sort of thing? I'm fine with the no, but there has to be something more behind it.
This is a traditional hot rod forum, and powder coating isn't traditional. Nor is the bare metal look. other than that, it sounds like a neat idea, surprised no one tried it yet. Or maybe they did, and the results weren't what they hoped.
I don't know what it would look like I have my chassis powder coated shiny black and love it but I'm pretty sure it would have to be blasted to adhere well so it wouldn't look like shiny steel I think it would look like more like shiny grey I think. If you are looking for the shiny steel look like I've seen a few guys do on body panels, you will probably have to do the scuff with a scotch pad and clear with good clear paint I would imagine.
like Russco said...the metal has to be prepped prior to powdercoating or it will flake off...esentially deafeating the purpose of coating it. So it doesnt make much sense....probably why you received no explanation
Many of the shiny aluminum and plated steel parts on my engine are clear powder coated. Even parts that get pretty hot. So far no complaints, and easy to keep clean.
Jim, I meant no offense. I see so many things under the "custom" banner and have no idea how to determine what is and isn't ok. I appreciate the perspective, though. Likewise, I thought it was a solid idea and haven't even found any horror stories about it. Russco, I've heard the grey thing a few times. Any reason why that may be? Both you and ynottayblock mentioned the prepping for the powder coating process and, as I understand it, its microabrasion rather than a scuffing as a damaging of the visible-to-the-naked-eye finish. And as ynottayblock eluded to, part of the reason for the frame-off powder coat of the entire frame is to essentially preserve the body's condition so, if flaking is even a possibility, it's out of the question. I thought that the process of removing the paint and rust (if there was any) would be sufficient scuffing for the application of the powder coating....
Clear powder coat will give your frame dull grey color. I've tried that trick and that doesn't look good. Also when heat comes into play it will turn yellowish. I would rather do standard color, like black, silver, etc.
Most clears are slightly yellow. There is a water clear powdercoat, no idea who makes it. Ask for a sample.
I have had some of the furniture I make clear powder coated, over a sanded (60 grit on an angle grinder) surface rather than blasted. It does need some bite to form a mechanical bond, so a polished surface won't work. Little bit of a PITA as you need to be scrupulously clean, ideally coat immediately after sanding, and be absolutely sure the part is not touched with bare hands - any fingerprints etc will turn brown. Also powder coating is NOT corrosion protection and rust can develop underneath anyway over time - not recommended for outdoor use. May work on a show vehicle but not ideal that is going to see much 'normal' use.
so much bullshit information being shoveled about. I have always wondered why people feel the need to post up info when they blatantly dont have correct facts. There are so many incorrect statements in this thread, I have to say, contact a coater and ask to see their work etc etc, get some first hand knowledge on the subject.
I guess I never should have powder coated all of the suspension parts on my rock rig. Damn thing has been in fresh water, and even the Pacific Ocean, on a number of occasions. Probably rotted out by now. I'd better check. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
I watched an episode of "Car Hoarders (?)" where the builders took a '69 Charger down to bare metal and powder coated the entire car with a clear powder coat. I don't know if filming the car for TV altered how it would appear in person, but to me the car was somewhat of a satin finish. It wasn't dull but definitely not a glossy finish. They blacked out the grill area as well as the tail lights area and the car looked pretty good. It was very unique, thats for sure.
There used to be a product called Zoop Seal that was a repackaged sealer sold by Aircraft Spruce. It was primarily used for polished aluminum (airplane propeller spinners) but I've been told that it will seal any metal quite well, If you are looking for a bare metal look, you might check it out. http://www.aircraftspruce.com/
In comparison to specifically designed corrosion resistant primers I would expect lower performance from a straight powder coat. There may well be similar options in powder coating? I doubt they would be clear though.....(Perhaps Turboroadster can enlighten us) In my other job, my experience with polyester and other polymers has shown that there is a degree of (microscopic) water absorption or permeability in many materials that would intuitively seem to be totally waterproof... My comment is based on a number of discussions with my coater, as well as first hand experience of various equipment in my factory (Tile and stone processing, damp or wet environments). A number of examples where significant rust has developed under powder coat, often with no signs until it is bad enough to flake of in sheets. My guy recommends galvanising or electro-galv where items will have a lot of exposure to moisture. Guess he has had enough experience to include the comment about corrosion protection in his literature. (Could also be that he just doesn't have the facts too though I guess ) Just saying, YMMV.....
Or maybe they aren't very good powder coaters. Rusting under powder coating is a preparation failure, not a coating failure, unless the coating was flawed. Either way, done wrong.
Barry A, Good discussion. Most powders used for appearance today are polyester. A buddy had a job coating store fixtures and the manufacturer started out as a hippy artistic group that wanted something special for Levi's. Like your furniture they ground finished the metal and insisted on clear powder against my buddies objection. PITA white glove handling. Good quality job and they looked great. A couple of years later there were durability problems, but hey it's time to remodel anyway. I polished the spokes of a steering wheel for another buddy for his drag car. The grip was foam so it couldn't be plated and he clear coated with automotive catalyzed paint. He owns a body shop & builds show cars. A couple of years later he pointed out tiny "rust worms" that were growing under the clear. Any coating whether wet or powder has it's limitations and has it's own specifications for a quality durable finish. You can be cheap and skip a step and be lucky to have it look good. But for how long? If Eye Candy really wants to do this I would recommend he sandblasts the frame and have the powder coater bake it at a high temp to bake out any grease or oil. Then grind, DA, polish or what ever he thinks is a neat surface finish. Don't let it sit around because it will oxidize and show up later after powdercoating. Have fun but don't expect it to look great in five years.
Powder coating coming off in sheets is caused by poor prep. A lot of big companies run the parts through a 5 step spray washer that includes a phosphate coating. Can't get better than that can you? Wrong. Seen a drinking fountain base that was made out of 10" square tube. The coating was coming off in sheets. On the back of the coating was the rusty mill scale. The coating adhered to the scale, but the scale didn't stick to the base metal. Anything that has been fabbed or welded or made out of hot rolled needs to blasted first.
not here at all fishing for your work, but powder is what I know and I dont mind sharing the education if someone needs help. If you took the time to visit the web, you will see, I know what I am talking about, its both a science and art form to me and when someone goes out of their way to comment on a subject with info that is blatantly bunk, just makes me wonder, thats all.
We had a few crazy bare metal garden sculptures done in a special clear powder coating , originally designed as anti graffiti coating. And no it did not cover 100% , well over a couple of years rust spots appeared on crevices and edges, probably much more visible as it was clear coated. Adhesion was good. These parts went from the blaster directly to the powder coater on the same day as we did have a discussion about flash rust. I think off shore powder coating is generally very poor for adhesion and especially colourfastness.
a smidgen of advice: 1. quality prep is critical 2. quality equipment and application in all holiday areas critical 3. buy top quality powders, stay away from the buy by the pound companies, they usually broker cheaper chinese crap powders.
I work on a school bus fleet with powder coating on frame rails and bumpers, both of which come off in heavy rusted sheets after a few winters. Ford trucks also slab off sheets from the chassis. I clear ( powder ) coated all the door knobs and trim on my '37 because I was to cheap to re-chrome them and they still look good 14 years later ( no rust worms on aluminum ), but then these pieces are not in the weather like a frame would be. I have also powder coated aluminum intakes clear, they tend to be a little yellow where the powder is thicker, but they hold up to heat pretty good and stay the same color, till gasoline gets them. I use a Eastwood gun and powder, plus a old stove out in the garage. Joe
Hi. I have never been a real fan of Powder due to some problems with trailer frames that I have. BUT strangely to this thread our Club Chapter of Inliners held its monthly meeting at SPC rods & Customs shop in Montgomery, Terxas (just north of Houston) yesterday and after the meeting we got the grand tour of everything. We met owner David Allison & his 8 employees. Sandblasting, baking oven, powder spraying, paint booth, & the entire restoration shop were toured. It was a real eye opener for me on how one can get real quality powder coating. As a couple of responders above have stated, with powder coating the proper metal prep & oven baking is absolutely needed to have a quality coat. The metal prep varies with what metal it is so either blasting, sanding, stripping might be used but in either case the oven bake must be done or it will not go well. We saw many vehicles in various stage of restoration & each was explained as to how it was being done. This kind of premium work is not cheap just as there are cheap paint jobs that have problems after the fact. Put crap in & you get crap out. The quality of the finish & its durability with either powder or paint depends on the quality of the prep & finish & sealing work done. I think this quality of the finish is why I do not like the powder on my trailer frames as they likely did not have clear over the color. Just guessing on that but likely the trailer manufacturer held cost down to just color & now I have frames looking raunchy. I am already near finished with my restoration & upgrades on my 46 coupe which has a 1990 paint jo but if I were to begin a new project I would not want to begin without at least consulting David as to the costs of his work to compare to equal quality paint work (which he also does). David has a new website coming up & is also getting heavy into social media to really interact with the restoration community. He said that he also coats lots of non automotive items such as firearms & signs, etc. Jimmie
So will it adhere to a polished or semi polished bare metal surface? My buddy has a powder place here. I've asked him about it in the past he didn't think it would turn out well. He does do a lot of race car chassis and parts with color though. and always pre bakes my stuff too. I've not had any problem with rust underneath or adhesion on any of my stuff hes done.
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