Register now to get rid of these ads!

Projects International KB 7" chop

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by 55willys, Aug 29, 2015.

  1. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Thanks for all the complements guys, the feedback helps me to stay at it. Just chopped the rear window during my break at work. I will post pics after I download them from my phone and resize them.
     
  2. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Here are the pics of the rear window chop. I chopped it 1 1/2" and set the lower bead the same height as the side windows above the belt line. I think it came out nicely, still need to tack it in place when I get the welder back over here. IMG_20150831_144037703_HDR.jpg
     
  3. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

  4. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    IMG_20150901_190356975_HDR.jpg IMG_20150901_190412046.jpg IMG_20150901_190424878.jpg IMG_20150901_190436738_HDR.jpg
    I have never been a big fan of the mail slot rear window. I like proportional sized windows
     
  5. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I picked up my new Thunder Bird Turbo Coupe rotors today and they fit perfectly on my Mustang II 8" rear end. They are 87-88 Turbo Coupe only. Now I need to order the calipers from Rock Auto. I use them to buy calipers outright because the core charge is usually not that much compared with most auto parts stores. I like to shop at my local auto pats stores when I can to support the local economy but some times it is not cost affective. IMG_20150901_183505141_HDR.jpg IMG_20150901_183517361_HDR.jpg IMG_20150901_183526837.jpg
     
    brEad likes this.
  6. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    It looks like I can move the outer bearing area in until the back of the seal area is in line with the edge of the of the dropout hole. Then I will machine the bearing area on the axle over about 1 1/2" closer to the axle flange to move it closer to the differential so that the inside edge of the rotor is in line with the edge of the dropout. This will give me a center section that is 15" flange, I can't go any narrower without interfering with the rotor and housing.

    The track width of the rear of a 65 Corvair is 55" and the track width of an early Ford wide five is 57 1/2". With my wide five adapters and covers on the Corvair rear it will be 1" narrower than early Ford wide five. My adapters are 1/2" thick and the covers are 3/16 thick at the wheel mounting surface. The wheel mounting surface to the center of the inside u-joint on the Corvair half shaft is 24". That times 2=48" leaving 7" for the center section u-joint center to center. The 8" Ford center section will be 15" from flange to flange plus the adapter for the inner joint of 3/8" on each side giving it a measurement of 15 3/4" plus the u-joint drive flanges at 1 3/4" each side gives us a total of 19 1/4".

    19 1/4" minus the 7" for the Corvair center section and 1" for the overall narrower rear gives us 11 1/4" divided by 2 is 5 1/8" that each half shaft will need to be shortened. I might need to shorten the lower control rods by a similar amount so that I don't get too much camber change during cornering. I can most likely get away with widening the rear track width to offset the amount that the half shafts need to be shortened. Lots of measuring and math to figure this out.
     
    brEad likes this.
  7. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I found a Spicer 1310 yoke flange #2-2-1379 has a 4.25 bolt pattern. With a slight modification it will bolt directly to the 8" Ford axle flange. I ordered a pair of them from Summit Racing. They originally were on the driveshaft on an 8.8 Ford rear end.
     
  8. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Went to Jantz Engineering (the guys who built my Dana 60 full floating disc brake five lug rear for my Willys wagon) and laid out what I wanted to do with my Ford 8"/ Corvair independent rear. We decided to use A10 bearings out of a mid 70's Ford pickup along with a bunch of other manufactures. They are a caged tapered roller bearing that will take the constant side load that the half shaft imparts on it ( I didn't want to be replacing bearings once a year) . I will order those from my local Napa store Tuesday.

    I ordered a pair of 87 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe rear calipers from Rock Auto. Napa wanted $61 each with a $67 core charge that would have made them $128 each. I got them on a close out for $38 each with no core charge at Rock Auto with shipping it came to about $100 delivered to my door. I like to shop local but sometimes the deal is too good online.

    Tonight I dismembered my good 8" rear and cut off the ends and tubes getting it prepped for narrowing. This one has a 3.55 gear ratio and the housing was good. The other 8" rear I had was bent at least an 1" on one side and even though I was going to cut it up I was concerned that the bend might have distorted the center section seal area. I also would not trust an axle that had been hit that hard as I have seen an axle that ended up with a hairline fracture that will fail at some point. I will get some pics of the rear as I go.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2015
    volvobrynk likes this.
  9. volvobrynk
    Joined: Jan 30, 2011
    Posts: 3,587

    volvobrynk
    Member
    from Denmark

    Where are your pictures of progress? ☺ :) :-D
     
  10. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    On my phone, I have to download them to my laptop and resize them before I can post them.
     
  11. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Here are the pics of the rear end parts so far. IMG_20150906_111750412.jpg IMG_20150906_111759942.jpg IMG_20150906_111811798.jpg
    Left half of the Corvair suspension
    IMG_20150906_112108524.jpg IMG_20150906_112215543.jpg IMG_20150906_112246170.jpg
    Spicer drive flanges that fit 8.8 Ford rear, they take the 1310 u-joints that the Corvair half shafts use and have the 4.25" bolt circle that is the same as the as the Mustang II rear axles. I just have to enlarge the holes to 1/2"and bore the centers to fit the axle stub.
     
    brEad likes this.
  12. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    The dismembered 8" rear IMG_20150906_112337737.jpg IMG_20150906_112432052.jpg IMG_20150906_112511143.jpg IMG_20150906_112752804.jpg IMG_20150906_112810801.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2015
    volvobrynk likes this.
  13. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    the rotors might get turned around backward to give the differential room, not sure yet. IMG_20150906_112922867.jpg IMG_20150906_112928011.jpg
     
    brEad and volvobrynk like this.
  14. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    The calipers finally showed up Saturday so I could do a mockup and I bought the A10 bearings and seals.So far it looks like I can get the center section down to 13 1/2" wide but at that point the rotors will not fit because the calipers hit the differential. I tried to turn the rotors backwards and that gave me enough space on the diff but the caliper bracket hit the rotor hat. So I did a search for all cars that use a 4x4.25" (or 4x108mm for those who use that system of measure) bolt circle. Then I went to Rock Auto to find a rotor that would fit the parameters of the project. The diameter needed to be larger and the hat offset smaller. So far I found a Volvo rotor that looks like it will work and a few Audi rotors. I would like to use an American rotor but none will do the job.

    I drew my center section to scale on graph paper so I could see if it would work. That is how I came up with the 13 1/2" width measurement. I hope to be able to install the rotors the correct way but if not the larger diameter and less offset will let me use the Turbo coupe calipers with the rotors turned outboard. I have also been researching IRS setup and geometry. When you shorten the half shafts/upper control arm it causes excessive negative camber gain. I have also been looking at using early Ford bones for part of the trailing arm. It will lengthen it from 18" to at least 36" and that should also reduce the squat under acceleration along with looking good. I will get some pics this week and post them.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2015
    brEad likes this.
  15. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Friday I got measurements off of a 65 Corvair for all the pick up points for the suspension. I can now start to draw it up with the modification's necessary to make it work properly.
     
  16. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I got a Volvo rotor and it will fit turned around backward and the diameter is large enough that the caliper bracket clears the hat and the inside is just big enough to fit the u-joint drive flange inside. Looks like a winner. Now I need to get the housing bearing ends done and the axles shortened and resplined.
     
    brEad and volvobrynk like this.
  17. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I worked on figuring out the rear end stuff and mocked it up to look at it. IMG_20150927_182502966_HDR.jpg IMG_20150927_182453157.jpg IMG_20150927_182717888.jpg IMG_20150927_182813575.jpg
    This is the Volvo 850 rotor, Ford 8.8 drive shaft flange, and Thunderbird turbo coupe calipers that have parking brakes built in. The rotors are 1.02" thick and the calipers are designed for .95" rotor. They fit fine and it is only a .07" difference. The drive flanges have 7/16" holes in them that need to be opened up to 1/2", but the bolt pattern is the same as the axle and rotor.
     
    volvobrynk likes this.
  18. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    These are of the rear end and adapters. The center section is an 8" out of a 77 Mustang II, and the half shafts on out are 65 Corvair. The wide five adapters are from the last of the Spadaro units in 5x4 3/4" that I had modified with a stud recess that makes sure that it doesn't have brake drum interference. I have at 1 pair of the Spadaro 5x4 3/4" left after these and I will be having more made in a week or so. IMG_20150927_182940228.jpg

    The center section will be 13.5" plus the .25" thick rotors and the 1.625" from the flange to the center of the u-joint for a total of 17.25" center to center of the u-joint. The original Corvair center to center was 10.75" so the difference is 6.5". So I need to shorten the half shafts 3.25" per side. The Corvair also had the wheels offset 1" inboard with a track width of 55" at the rear so the axle flange is actually 57" at the wheel mounting surface. Add 3/4" on each side for adapters and covers and you end up with 58 1/2" at the WMS. The width of a 39 Ford rear with wide five pattern is 57 3/4" at the WMS so I came out pretty close at 3/8" wider on each side. IMG_20150927_182247410.jpg IMG_20150927_182827566.jpg

    I plan on using a Model T rear spring and am not sure how it will fit yet but this is the mockup idea. I would like to have it just ahead of the half shafts and I hope to be able to run the calipers on the front side as well so we will see how much real estate is left. I have also thought about using a pair of 41-48 front bones for the trailing arms and running them longer under the cab to negate some of the squat that is inherent to the Corvair design. The plan is nothing but the rear end behind the cab to mesmerize anyone behind me.[/ATTACH]
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2015
    brEad and volvobrynk like this.
  19. Cusco
    Joined: Nov 10, 2010
    Posts: 64

    Cusco
    Member
    from Europe

    Subscribed!
     
  20. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I am in need of a grill for this project. Locally and reasonably priced would be good, it doesn't need to be perfect as I am going to modify it anyway. Here are a couple pics of what I am looking for but don't need the fenders. Upper parking lights would be good as well.
    181302014_ihc-international-truck-grill-solid-1949-49-1948-48-1947.jpg m9sZTAj2-GiYX2eih3p8MjQ K series grill.jpg
     
  21. I'm gonna' go ahead and say it ... 'cuz I feel safe in knowing you will pull this off ... but you are a bad ass. I can't even dream up sh#t like that rear set up. Pbbbbtt ! Wow. That's it.
     
    brEad likes this.
  22. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Thanks for the complement. It comes from doing it professionally for the last 10 years and the fact that I started out young when my dad gave me 2 T-birds at the age of 9. A 61 and a 62, they were rusted out and he paid $75 for both. I got one of them to run. A big part of it is God given abilities (because I didn't study that hard) and my ADD brain that has an insatiable appetite to learn new things. I research a lot and only get 4-6hrs. of sleep a night. Just a slave to my brain.
     
    brEad likes this.
  23. I like the mixing of parts to create your own IRS. I suppose you know the 3.55 is a pretty rare gear for 8-inch Fords. Most are the 2.80 or 3.00, with a few 3.25 on some older 60's stuff. The 3.55 is the lowest factory gear.

    Also, nice job on that rear window, looks nice where you placed it and the amount you took out.
     
    brEad likes this.
  24. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 32,355

    The37Kid
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Nice project, I like the chop. Bob
     
  25. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    Thanks for the complement. The rear end was out of a 77 Mustang II, I bought it for $50 about 23 years ago with this independent rear application in mind. The gear ratio just happened to work out. I also just installed a 3.40 geared rear in a friends Model A Sedan
     
  26. czuch
    Joined: Sep 23, 2008
    Posts: 2,688

    czuch
    Member
    from vail az

    You are a magician. That is one of the most innovative ideas I've ever seen.
     
  27. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I picked up my prototype disc brake adapters from water jetting at Mechanical Specialties Friday. Here are some pics of how they will attach to the wide five front hubs.

    Rotor adapter minus holes and support ring to keep the rotor hub centric.
    IMG_20151004_072644001_HDR.jpg

    Rotor adapter on back of two piece wide five front hub.
    IMG_20151004_072956129_HDR.jpg

    And with the rotor.
    IMG_20151004_073024467.jpg
    IMG_20151004_073039380.jpg

    This will end up being my wide five disc brake kit that I will be selling but for now it will be developed and tested on my truck. This should complement the rear brakes on the IRS. After I get the rotors mounted to the hubs I will be able to get an accurate measurement for the caliper bracket.
     
    '52 F-3 and volvobrynk like this.
  28. jazz1
    Joined: Apr 30, 2011
    Posts: 1,591

    jazz1
    Member

    You may find that some of the K model complete grill is chrome UNDER the factory paint. I have one from a Canadian built '42 K2 but its really beat up. Had it a couple years before noticing some chrome where paint had flaked of.
     

    Attached Files:

  29. 55willys
    Joined: Dec 7, 2012
    Posts: 1,715

    55willys
    Member

    I got the inner studs to mount the rotor to the adapter plate and will pick up the wheel studs Monday. Bought 20' of 2"x3"x3/16 wall box tube today to make the frame rails. I went with 3/16 wall because the height is only 3" and I don't want it to flex. I will get more pics tomorrow and post them.
     
    brEad, volvobrynk and Martin Harris like this.
  30. '52 F-3
    Joined: Sep 30, 2007
    Posts: 961

    '52 F-3
    Member
    from Central PA

    great ideas and skills.......
    keep the pictures coming, plan to follow this build
     
    volvobrynk likes this.

Share This Page

Register now to get rid of these ads!

Archive

Copyright © 1995-2021 The Jalopy Journal: Steal our stuff, we'll kick your teeth in. Terms of Service. Privacy Policy.

Atomic Industry
Forum software by XenForo™ ©2010-2014 XenForo Ltd.