Projects Austin Somerset Gasser Build (DragNasty)

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What kind of crap is that?

 

So after ripping up the internet all weekend trying to find out how thick the stupid MSD Crank Trigger wheel is, I gave up. I was just trying to get ahead on the install to get my belt realigned etc. My best guess came from a couple of articles that eluded to 3/8" but nothing solid. So this morning I called MSD and confirmed. Now in most cases guys are running these on a full on race car. No alternator and electric water pump. For me though I am running an alternator and a mechanical water pump so after the wheel is installed I will have belt alignment issues. I had been looking for water pump to block spacers but MSD confided in me that most people in my situation use water pump pulley spacers.

So I snagged a couple of packs of them which will allow me to build up to the 3/8" needed. So much for the water pump. Hopefully we can jury rig something for the alternator. The blower belt was already off about 3/8" off so this little last minute addition should put it in perfect alignment as well. I will update you with photos when we install the new little toy later this week.

 

The sort of "crap" that it takes to make sure that the entries fit the theme of the race.

Roo

 

Thanks Roo ... actually, I was not going to respond. I am not interested in some crazy argument starting on my build thread about Meltdown rules etc. But if anyone wants to know more about it, here is the perfect thread. LOL
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...hread-what-are-you-doing-to-get-ready.999588/

 

Don't want to start an argument either. Just want to steal your ideas. And some damn good ones at that. See , you can teach an old dog mew tricks.

 

Well the snow is flying is Missouri today and we are making a quick ignition change that should will help the Austin fly as well. The first step to installing the MSD Flying Magnet Crank Trigger system is locking down the Billet Distributer. Since we are triggering on the Crank we will not need the centrifugal weights in the distributor. MSD makes this a pretty simple task. If this was an original distributor we would probably have to do some welding.


Obviously we started by popping the cap and removing the rotor. This exposes the weights and springs etc.


Supposedly there is 25 degrees of timing built into this little mechanism.


We popped off the springs that were holding the weights in place and then lifted them off the studs along with the bushings.

In order to finish the lock down we drove the roll pin out of the gear. This frees the entire shaft and distributor mechanism to lift up.
Before it will move however there is an 11/32 lock nut on the bottom of the mechanism. It has to be removed.


With the lock nut off, we lifted shaft just enough for the mechanism bolt to clear the base. We then removed the bushing and rotated it 180 degrees and dropped it back down into the hole there on the left of the shaft. It is hard to see but the hole it comes out of it large enough for the bolt and the bushing and is oblong to allow some movement. The bolt hole 180 degrees opposite is a perfect fit for just the bolt, so no movement.


After it was in its new hole, we put the lock not back on. Then we aligned the gear and drove the roll pin back in place. Finally we reinstalled the rotor and the cap and it is ready to drop back in again.

 

Well at least the distributor part was easy. Things got a bit hairy when we got to the shop with the rest of it. But how hard could it be? The MSD Flying Magnet wheel came with easy to read and follow instructions.....rriiiiiggghhtttt.


So obviously I took the radiator back out, pulled both the water pump and lower pulleys off and then finally got a good look at where this little toy is going to live.


The mount for BBC from MSD is pretty cool, it is designed to go on either side of the block. But for me that is not an option as the alternator bracket uses the same holes on the driver's side. It also only took a few seconds to realize the water pump outlet was in the way (for the install only) so it had to come off as well.


Now here is where it gets interesting. Looks nice doesn't it? The bracket fit perfectly , the non-magnetic pickup was going to be dead center and we would be sipping sweat tea right now and smoking a nice cigar if the pick up wheel only had the correct holes. That's right. Take a look. It has six holes but the are spaced for a 3 bolt mount placement on a stock harmonic balancer. There is no way the blower pulley was going back on through this thing.

So I called the JEGS tech line real quick since they supplied the MSD Kit. What I found was par for the course with this build. What I had was the only pulley MSD makes for a BBC. They double checked and confirmed it. I said how I am supposed to run a supercharger? They said I would have to have that one drilled out to fit.


Not what I wanted to hear. But after a lot of thought, multiple theories and several expletives, we set about doing what we seem to do best on this crazy build, making it fit. My main concern is the fact that this is, to say the least, a fairly precise instrument. We sat the wheel on the shoulder of the accessory drive pulley and even though it was a fairly nice fit, there was just a bit of play. We had to figure out a way to get the wheel centered on the pulley before we drilled the holes. We finally slipped three .008 feeler gauges in to center it and then tightened up the three bolts in the factory holes (which the pulley also had).


Then we flipped it over and carefully drilled the six holes using the drive pulley as a drill guide. When this thing is installed, there is only a .050 to .080 space between the "Flying Magnets" and the non magnetic pick up so we had to get this right. In the end, measuring from the outside of the wheel to the drive pulley we found only a .002 difference between eight measurements taken from various points.


How we chose the place to drill the holes in the wheel was buy placing it on the pulley and rotating it around aligning the three factory holes and looking in the six supercharger holes for solid wheel (no hole over laps etc.). There was only one position that met both criteria so there you go.


However, in the end, none of the new holes when lined up on the dampner placed one of the "Flying Rare Earth Magnets" in range of the adjustable pick up point. Our hope would have been at 30 degrees of timing, to point one magnet close to the middle of the adjustable mount for the pick up. The pickup mount has 20 degrees of adjustment. However, luck of the draw would either place the pick up all the way at the top at 30 degrees with no room to adjust down or all the way at the bottom with timing set at 25 degrees and no room to adjust the other way.

So after a long afternoon we came in for sweet tea anyway. I sat down at the computer and just for the hell of it, googled MSD Crank Trigger. To my amazement, the first photo that popped up looked just like the damn wheel I just made. To ad insult to injury, after clicking on the image, it took me straight to the JEGS website. Long story short, after double checking on the MSD site, I schooled the JEGS Tech Line boys a bit, have the correct wheel on the way AND they are taking back the one I drilled out!

 

WOW!! That is some adventure you had with the crank trigger. Very interesting about that wheel issue. Good to hear JEGS is going to make it right.

 

This build has become an adventure. I should have double checked myself but usually the guys at JEGS are pretty good. In fact this morning I called about ordering a spacer for the top blower pulley (which is next in line to get moved forward 3/8"). The smallest I could find anywhere was .5" which I am thinking is close enough but the stupid thing cost $125. I just doubled checked with the guys as JEGS this morning and after checking a few things he put me onto a new product from the guys at The Blower Shop. All kinds of new blower spacers (including a 3/8") for only $39.00. Very much appreciated.

 

Just a quick funny story from this weekend. I had a couple of car buddies drop in Sunday. They had not seen the Austin since before we started blowing it apart this past Summer for the final build steps. Anyway we are standing around and one of them says he can't wait to hear this thing run! Then he does his best "Blower Surge" imitation. I sort of laughed and said it probably won't do much of that. He was dumb founded. What do mean he fired back, you don't think it is going to lope around, that is what blower cars are supposed to do!

Actually, I said, that is what poorly tuned blower cars do. For those of you whom have ever wondered, as I mentioned above, that is officially called Blower Surge. It is caused by a rich/lean cycle at idle. As the motor leans out the RPM increases to richen things up, then the RPM decreases and the motor leans out again. The motor then sets there and continues this cycle until its circumstance is changed with the throttle etc. However, with correct tuning, some if not most of the surging can be eliminated.

My friend was dumbfounded. He had always thought the bigger the surge, the badder the car. What he learned was in reality, the bigger the surge the "badder" the tunner. LOL. Anyway before it was all over he said well if it doesn't make blower noise how is anyone supposed to know it has one? I said it only sticks 15" out of the hood! LOL!

 

One of my favorite things, by the way, is to watch for foot feed blower cars at a big cruise etc. You know the guys that are cruising and using the accelerator pedal to make like they have a blower ....you've know what I'm talking about....lol

 

Besides being Idiots, those types are dangerous.

 

Always wanted a "huffer" sticking out of the hood of my '69 Nova SS.
Love this adult science project. He/She needs a name!

JT

 

You know on the subject of naming the Supercharger, I sort of feel like Bill Cosby (the old funny Bill Cosby, not the new scary one). If you remember, he had a bit about what he thought he and his brother's names were according to how his Father yelled at them. Cosby said until he was in high school he thought his name was Jesus Christ. To be honest with you, if supercharges could talk, with all the crazy changes and expletives this thing has provoked, it would definitely think it's name is Jesus Christ as well! ....LOL

 

That is hilarious! Grew up listening to all his records. Although I meant the the whole enchilada..the full meal deal..the car!

 

Oh sorry. Well the same initials might well apply to whole damn car if you want to know the truth. The car's official "Stage Name" is DragNasty. I even own the domain DragNasty.com. But when I sit in the seat, make shifting noise and pat her on the dash...I call her Somer. Short for Somerset of course. It is hard to stay mad at her very long. LOL!

 

Okay let me just say, I am not sure MSD actually has their head on straight. After talking with them and looking at their catalog etc. (as mentioned earlier) I received the corrected trigger wheel today for the flying magnet. It is the exact same wheel that came in the kit. You remember, the one I drilled out. Even though they show photos of a different wheel, they confirmed today that the wheel in the photos is a really old one that they do not make anymore and it was for a Chrysler.

So what I am saying (AND LISTEN CLOSE) there are really 4 main reasons for the Crank Trigger System: High Compression, High RPM (above 7,000), Nitrous Injected and Supercharged. AND for what has to be one of the most utilized performance platforms in history, BBC, MSD does not make a wheel to fit anything other than a stock mounted harmonic balancer. This means if you have a BBC and are running a Super Charger, MSD does not make a Crank Trigger system for it.

SOOOOO....back to the drill press. The reason I was excited when I thought I could order the correct wheel was after mounting this one up and drilling it out, while the holes aligned, I could not center any of the 4 flying magnets in the pickup area. So I guess, this time, I will have to take some time and get everything aligned (INCLUDING) centering the pick up area before drilling. Then even if there is over lap from an existing hole, it will just have to be!

 

So would the Chrysler one work
I think the 6 bolt pattern on the Chrysler is the same as the blower pulley

 

That is exactly what I said when they told me it was Chrysler. I have read about MOPAR guys using BBC dampners etc. because they said they were less expensive and easier to find. But MSD said they quit making that one any way. They said it now has elongated bolt holes etc. and it is only 7.25" So since I have had a free try at it, I now know for sure how and what to do, it is all good.

 

Seen these?
http://www.atiracing.com/products/dampers/damperparts/trigger-shells.htm

It looks like you could replace your ATI damper with one that has the magnets as part of the damper.

 

Good call (hindsight 20/20). I did see them. But I have a lot in that stupid ATI Dampner already. First they are not cheap anyway but after the "blower audible" and changing to a forged crank that was internally balanced, I had to send the the brand new never even installed unit back to ATI for a neutral balance change over. That plus the current MSD investment would be like tossing a grand or so on the shelf plus buying the new one. I think I will just drilled some holes. Famous last words.

 

You know...A quick apology to the HAMB here. I sort of got carried away with the little Crank Trigger Timing SNAFU...so much so that I really didn't think how un-HAMB-friendly it was...it can happen when you get buried in the build. I thought about just going back and taking that stuff out but several people have replied and I don't want them to look silly etc. So I will leave it at that and get back to just reporting the good HAMB friendly stuff on the build and there is plenty of it! Thanks.

 

Throw Back Thursday - LOL

April 2014


January 2016

 

Made it out to shop today and got everything back together up front after installing the you know what...

ALSO I have been looking at the driver's side "A" pillar with disdain since the day we put the top back on. It was out of alignment by 3/16" or so on the outside edge...just enough to bug me.



While I tackled the metal work up front Dad slowly worked shaping the filler out back.

 

Holy cow, I just took in the backside this afternoon getting ready to run the Fuel line. Between all the AN Fittings and braided fuel lines starting at 12 AN from the cell through the pump, 10 AN to the Regulator and then 6 AN to the carbs not to mention an 8 AN return line, I dropped over $400.00. Man, what ever happened to some rubber hose,a couple of barb fittings and some hose clamps? LOL

AND...since there was seemingly money burning a hole in pocket this afternoon (NOT) I went ahead and ordered the sideways carb linkage kit from Weiand. You know Dad and I were looking at this issue this past weekend and thinking how to build something but to be honest, this is not one of the systems on the car you want to skimp on in my opinion. So what are you going to do?

 

I finally got the call today I have been waiting on for two and half weeks: The carbs are ready. I just got back from picking them up and had to pop them on the blower to have a look.


They are an old school "Holley" look but extremely messaged on the inside. Outside of all the little secret stuff he does, these carbs also have boost referenced power valves, adjustable bleeds and teflon coated throttle shafts.


The choke towers are all milled down and we are going to fire the motor and start tuning with #86 jets.


I am excited to get out there tomorrow and try to figure out the crazy linkage and then get the carbs mounted for good. You know me though, before I could go in, I had to drop the bug catcher on really quick and step back and grin for a bit.

 

Well I love a good puzzle, I really do. That is pretty much what I had on my hands this morning when I started installing the carb linkage. Now before I go any further let me point out that I opted to purchase this kit from Weiand especially designed for their 6-71 blower. I know it is from Weiand because I recognized the completely inadequate one page instruction sheet style from the blower kit.


At least there was a photo of the kit installed and with a bit of common cense plus some trial and error reverse engineering from the photo I got the carb portions in place. The rest was clear cut, with the bolt hole spacing, there was only one way the lower support bracket could bolt to the manifold.


However in the one and only mount location, it was clear the supplied bracket was not going to work as supplied.


It basically sat on the valve cover (or at least that arm sticking out there that is not used on this application did). There would be no way to install this bracket and still be able to get the valve cover off.


So I cut the un-needed portion off and then used my grinder to shape that end of the bracket to match the front. It was very nice looking, with a little paint no one would know it didn't come that way...and there was plenty of room to remove the valve cover.


I removed the aluminum blower studs above to replace them with the ones supplied in the kit for this Supercharger. But they were actually shorter then what I already had. PLUS they were steel. I remembered something about these studs on the before mentioned poorly written blower instruction sheet, so I dug it out. Sure enough, it said when mounting the blower to the intake, use ONLY the aluminum studs and nuts suppled, DO NOT INSTALL STEEL. So I ask you, why would Weiand include two steel studs to replace the aluminum ones. It is mute point really as they were shorter anyway (NO WAY they would work on this application regardless of their composition). But it still makes you wonder?


So I just made my own bracket out of .25" steel plate. Being more that half the thickness of the original bracket, it will allow me to use the original aluminum studs and nuts and have enough threads, even with a lock washer to get the nut fully on the stud.


Everything works great. Now I am just going to take the home made bracket it off and give it a nice coat of black paint and then install it for real.

 

The double pumper fuel lines came in today so I decided to pop them on to see how they fit. I don't know why I even thought I would "JUST POP THEM ON" with my track record. The rear fit perfectly but there is a lot going on between the two carbs including the handy dandy linkage kit from an earlier post.




First off the driver's side fuel inlet line hit the linkage shaft. So the entire linkage had to come apart to adjust the heimsend holders. But that made the actuator shaft hit something and not open the butterflies all the way...etc. etc. etc. Any way after about 5 or 6 shots and adjusting etc. both the linkage and fuel lines have their own little space and everyone is happy. LOL!

 

Now I am ready to mount the MagnaFuel regulator and then start plumbing back towards the pump. But first since this little jewel is going to be front and center I am going to do some very careful masking and then shoot it black. Sorry MagnaFuel...love your products but the Blue and Purple has got to go!