Technical Sbc in 1950 ford shoebox tech question.

OK so I'm installing a sbc in my 1950 ford shoebox. I'm using a 1999 chevy block so don't think i can run the nova oil pan as the dipstick is on the wrong side. And i don't want to modify my steering as its new and upgraded. Question is has anyone installed the sbc with stock oil pan and just raised the motor high enough to clear the steering and just rework the floor? Any info on if you have done this and how it worked out would be great. Oh and the stock Pan is about 2 inchs deeper than the nova so I'm thinking raise engine 2" max? Thanks!

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

By Nova style pan from Moroso some other company that sells them. They sell pans to put an other then early block in a Nova. Or you could dry sump it.

 

i put a later style sbc in a `49 Ford , but the car had Fatman mustang II .... so no real help there. what i can say that may be helpful is i was able to use the stock transmission crossmember by notching it a bit and welding on a new plate on the bottom

 

Hummm.. ok thanks I'll look into that. .

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Your issue I believe is that you are running a 1 piece rear main seal?
Try this from Cl***ic Industries
Product #: N130191
Not sure if you will need to clearance the front cross member because of the design.
We are currently installing a sbc on two of our car club members shoe box's but are using the 2 piece rear seal blocks with the OE style Nova pans. Looks like the engines sit rather high on these conversions, someone else might have better information and chime in.

 

Yes I'm using one piece rear main block the nova pan the dipstick is on the drivers side. . Mine is on pasanger side not sure if they're is away around that.

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Call Summit racing and ask them about your pan. It is not that big a deal. Tell them what you want give them your credit card number and wait 3-5 days.

 

So i guess no one suggest raising the engine up the 1 1/2 to 2 inchs to clear ?

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

it's a moot point, but i think a lot of those swaps used to be done with a dropped tie rod, which were widely available. as i recall, the only serious mod you do to the front crossmember is cut a hole for the mechanical fuel pump--which you aren't using!

 

I have done things like that which is why I gave you the advice that I did.

 

Shane, all you have to do is plug up the side of the block where the original dipstick is. The crate motors from GM give you some "blanking" lugs that go into the orifice where the dipstick presses into the block depending on what style of pan is required for the application. You can easily whip out a couple of lugs outta of aluminum or just silicone the hole, no big deal.

1962-1979
OIL DIP STICK DELETE PLUG
FOR ENGINE BLOCK 3/8"

​

As far as modifying the drag link to drop it and use a conventional pan , yes it can be done (that's how it was done back then) but the original design of the draglink in these cars suffers from bump steer and premature wear of the idler arm bushings (every couple of 1000' miles need to be replaced).

The fellas in my club that are doing the engine swap got a really nice replacement draglink and idler arm set up from shoebox central which eliminates the inherent bump steer from the original design, it also uses a modern idler arm and is of much heavy construction vs. the original.
Oops! Just realized that you did mention that you have upgraded your steering draglink!

 

Also, you may already know this; (And at least on the two piece rear main motors)But the oil pan requires a special oil pump, oil pump shaft, and pick up; As well as a SPECIAL BOLT for the main cap to hold the oil pick up tube.

 

Used the front-sump Nova pan on my '59 Ford swap, I had to shorten up the dip stick and tube, but have good access to it.

 

When the modern idler arm wears out, what do you ask for to replace it? Thanks

 

And I did have to add a hole to hold the pick up tube... fun on an ***embled short block.

 

Did they do all this in the 1960s? The first SBC/Ford I remember seeing was in a 1950 Crestliner in 1962

 

The aftermarket early Nova rear sump pans that have the notch, they are meant to clear the centerlink only. Getting a tie rod to p*** through it is a **** shoot.

 

I did a early Nova conversion using a '66 Impala 283, I don't recall needing to drill an extra hole for the tube.

 

@ Manyolcars
Unless you have the aftermarket replacement draglink; it isn't a "bolt on replacement" for the original idler arm. I will get you the part # for the modern idler arm once I get home from work. The replacement draglink is a completely redesigned and fabricated piece.

 

@ bobss396
I like the way you think Sir ! Simple and to the point! (I believe that's how the Chevy 2 Specific Engine Blocks attach the Oil pick up tube )
Or

This bolt is available from Chevy 2 Only Inc.

 

I looked at shoebox central and definitely want your part number Thank you!

 

Thanks for all the info guys looks like the nova oil pan is a option. I just figured motor is already together. Nova oil pan and related parts cost me some money. Probably got s**** metal laying around to fab up some spacers to go under the mount brackets. Guess i was hopeing some one would say they have done that and it worked great. . Oh well may have to look more into pan options.

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

I have cut and welded a pan to move the sump. Cut and welded the pickup tube too. It was free to do that.

 

Been doing some searches on pans . Found some that are real wide at rear and hold 7 qts why couldn't you shortin pan 2 inchs along with pick up tube and widen pan so you dont loose oil capacity? Hummm. Still seems easier to me to just lift engine to clear ...

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Just to give you an idea..
These are the shoebox central (?)mounts with nova pan. About 2" higher (?)on cross member.
I think a member from Australia did use a conventional pan and notched it at the rear to clear the steering linkage.

 

That last picture with the notched oil pan . To me looks like he could have just moved the tierods to the back side and it would of cleared. That looks like the shoebox central steering that's what i got and you can go in from anyway.. i did not mention i already have mount and ****** mount buy they're from jamco. .

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

For what it's worth, I have done several of these swaps. The last one was a cherry 50 2dr sedan. I cut the floor trans tunnel and bellhousing area out. Then installed the engine and trans (ZZ4 and 5 speed) up high enough to clear the tie rod and cross member. Then went to the local wrecking yard and found a floor section that looked close to working. After some hammer work and heat, I had a new floor welded in. To me, the engine then looks proper, raised up instead of appearing to drag on the ground. Also, drive line alignment was correct.
This was more work but the result is really worth it.

 

About 15 years ago I out a 283 in a 50 and had it up high like you describe.

I had to cut out the bellhousing area, trans hump and the entire center of the floor to clear. I bit off way more than I had thought. The modifications needed to put it where it's supposed to go would have saved time, money and the car wouldn't have had the center of gravity so high.

Get a different oil pan and mess with the steering or nearly cut your car in half. Your call

 

Center of gravity to high, What?
If modifying the floor so that the engine can be installed in the proper location is to much work or to complicated, I think Dirty Harry said it right.
"Mans got to know his limitations"

 

That sounds like what i will do. . First I'll remove the center link and set motor and ****** in then try installing center link. . Start raising motor till it clears and see how it fits. I have noticed some looks like motor is sitting low so there should be plenty of room under hood.. thanks.

Sent from my SM-G900P using H.A.M.B. mobile app