Technical Axle/Spindle Fitment Help, Please!!!!

Need a little ***istance, please....

Model A axle, dropped 2.5"
Everything else is '40 Ford

Mounting the spindles went well, for the most part...



That is until I turned the spindle...




I'm thinking I'll need to hack off the '40 arms and use these...



Is there a way around this modification??

Thanks

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heating and bending steering arms has been going on as long as there have been dropped axles for hot rods. Pete & jakes shows how in their catalog. i have done it dozens of times

i prefer the look of heated and bent arms over bolt on ones

 

I think the only fix is with a torch and a pipe wrench. Duplicate the profile of the aftermarket arm. the process is mentioned in the Bishop/ Tardel A v8 book. I personally have not performed the heat and bend.

 

Thanks for the input, guys!!

The Bishop-Tardel does mention the process...just a mention, and then only about tweaking to get under the wishbones!

One the I didn't mention is this is going on my FULL-FENDERED '31 Tudor, so form isn't quite as critical as on an open car. Function is foremost with this application!!!


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Had Okie Joe drop my axle and while he was at it my spindle steering arms


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you will want to wait till you have it all together for tie rod/wishbone clearance too. if it is not on your axle yet.

 

I guess this will brand me as an old guy, but when I started building an oxy/acc torch was a necessary tool. If you didn't own one you hoped a friend did so you could cut steel, bend it to shape a bracket or pedal and most importantly adjust steering arms to clear a dropped axle and correct the Ackerman.
I'm not here to sling mud at Sid, because he does a beautiful drop on his axles and no doubt the steering arms will clear the axle too when he bends them.
On the other hand why do some guys have a $2000+ tig, a high end band saw, and lots of other great tools but torches are considered by some to be from the dark ages?
For a website that prides itself on traditional style and methods how many here took the easy way out and used bolt on arms? Some are cast, some are forged or maybe even flame cut, but no matter which, is your Ackerman correct? Or did you even check?

 

Hmmm... What are the potential problems when welding, heat or force is applied to steering and suspension components?

I've always been concerned about changes in metallurgical strength - ductility - etc?

 

I'd be more concerned about the metallurgical strength of the new arm. Is it cast? Is it as strong as Henry's steel? And what about the bolts?

I was driving a Model A coupe that had bolt on arms installed by the previous owner. We noticed a s****ing sound and pulled off at a truck stop. Found the bolt that holds the arm onto the spindle had backed out and was rubbing on the caliper. I felt real lucky the whole rest of that trip.

 

@Fordors Thanks for your comments! I have very few tools and even fewer skills that I am supremely confident in. I have learned a ton from reading and asking questions, but the first time I do something, I appreciate someone looking over my shoulder! I have started piecing together an Oxy-acetylene kit, but don't have everything I need just yet. Maybe I will by the time I get my parts ***embled and under the Tudor. Then I'll find a mentor....What are you doing in June?!?!

 

Believe me, I wish a road trip to NC was in the picture, I wouldn't mind helping. But on the other hand you seem to be on the right path. Tools are important but so is knowledge and even then recognizing your limitations.
If you do decide to heat and bend the arms it can be done without a rosebud tip, I just used the largest tip I had but I kept it moving until I heated a large enough area and a dull red will be enough, no need to heat it really hot. Look where the interference is, heat, bend, check and once it clears you want them to slow cool, for sure no water quench or even compressed air. Next move on to the Ackerman. I won't go into that here as there is plenty of info available on line, but basically you need axles mounted on the frame and squared up to the centerline, some string and a plumb bob. Knowledge is power, you can do this!

 

I have used the Magnum (bolt on) forged dropped steering arms with their 4 in. dropped axle for the last 17 years with no problems. When installing the arms be sure to use grade 8 bolts, flat washers - trimmed to fit (if needed) and BLUE Lock***e. Be sure to make sure the bolts DO NOT bottom out inside the steering arm and that the head of the bolts sit completely flat against the inside spindle surface. If you don't do this the bolts can work loose. Car is a 40 Ford. Here's a good article.
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...nstallation-tech-article.187846/#post-2025972
You may want to buy a longer grease fitting for the spindle as the stock ones may be too short when using the dropped spindles. You can buy them on-line..

 

Brett, Do you have any of the Vern Tardel "let me Help You" series of books? I have all of them and there is a good one on just spindle modifications. I can copy it and send it to you or even just mail you the book to use if you want. It goes through the right process of modifying the steering arms to clear a dropped axle. Here is a link to the spindles book. I got all of them in a package through the Rodders Journal.

Don't go cutting the steering arms off good round back spindles. If your gonna cut the arms off try and find a set of 46 48 square back spindles. I might still have a set I would trade you for them.


https://www.verntardel.com/collecti...pped-spindles-creation-installation-1928-1948

 

heat and bend the original steering arms. That is the better solution of your current options.

I would do it on the vehicle not before hand but that's just me.

 

Well, I am an engineer, and I am not.

If you do this properly, there is no issue. As has been mentioned, if you are working with aftermarket components, of dubious origin, you are far more likely to have issues than if you are starting with Ford River Rouge Steel.

I heat and bend all sorts of steering and suspension components. I cut and weld pitman arms. I have created spindles nearly from scratch (used a few off-t******lf parts). I have made adjustable width center links. Not a single one of them has broken, not even on a compe***ion level off road rig.

 

Got it all pieces together and all the bolts snug-ish.





Giving it a once over, I'm now wondering if I can sneak the tie rod between the frame and wishbone, with the ball up, if I drop the arms a bit when I make clearance bends...



Thoughts?!?!


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Thanks.

Sounds like there are no issues with making modifications. That eases my concerns.

 

@brett4christ if you can wait till may or June I can pack up my torch setup and come down there and help you get those arm bent. The original ford ones are the best. I have the bolt on ones on my roadster and they work fine but those were Pete & Jake's spindles so they didn't have any. Just hate to see round back spindles cut off if not needed.

 

Sounds like a deal, Jason!! I'm in no rush on this one! My priority at the moment is getting the truck on the road. We will plan something for June...my baby girl graduates from college next month, so we will be busy all May!!


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Here's my '35/'36 axle with steering arms bent in and down.

 

Get after it with the torch, no big deal. PLEASE don't cut the arms off, if you do have to go the bolt on arms route sell the spindles and but aftermarket ones.

 

Yeah!!! What he said!!! Bolt on arms look **** ugly and scream 1-800-ChineseParts.com


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Other problem is the bolt on arms still won't clear a 28-34 wish bone

 

Thanks for the example pics, 117Harv!! That's the best progress shots I've seen to date. So when the arm is heated closest to the spindle boss, is the arm pulled around on the same horizontal plane more than it is rotated down away from the axle? Does that make sense? Nice polish/chrome!!

 

That process is very well described with all the separate bends and clearances and areas of heat shot from multiple angles in the Tardel Spindle book. I think the inadequate one described was in the axle book.
https://smile.amazon.com/Dropped-Sp...8&qid=1492104232&sr=1-12&keywords=tardel+ford

 

About 70% away from the axle and 30% down. . Let the first heat zone cool a bit so it wont move when the next area is heated and bent. I had a measurement from the rear face of the spindle flange to the center of the tie rod hole, checked that it was the same and level as all was bent. It really helps to have someone helping as this procedure is done but can be done alone. Also, make sure you have all needed tools at hand before you start heating things up. That pic is bare metal.

 

Here is a shot of one arm bent and the other in stock shape.

 

Here's some pics of the last one I did.