Hot Rods Chevy drum question

3am insomnia is a PITA. Woke up thinking about the dilemma I have, and decided to take it to task, at least for a while today.

Some of you may have seen my other thread where I discovered how my dad had found a way to mount a 5-lug wheel to a 6-bolt drum on our old '54 3100. I won't go into the details, but it's less than ideal, and I'll leave it at that.

The input received catapulted me headfirst into finding a 5-lug hub for the front from a similar year p***enger car to get back to the more standard 5x4.75 bolt pattern. I found an old car salvage place here in the PNW, and I asked them if they had a set of hubs. They said yes, and even said they'd throw in some drums. I even ordered some modern tapered bearings to put in them. What I didn't realize would happen was this:
They sent me hubs alright, but they're clearly seized together with the drums with years of rust, which, ok, I get it...should've expected. I'm naive. I'd roll with it, clean them up the best I could and just leave them be, but one has a broken stud, and without getting them apart, I have no idea how I'd replace that stud. I started soaking them last night with penetrating lube, but I have a less than optimistic feeling about this. Any tricks, or is this simply a bad idea and I should talk about sending them back? At this point, I'm wondering if I should've gotten a 6-bolt disc conversion kit and just ran spacers/adapters to get back to the bolt pattern I want.

 

Older hubs and drums are or were riveted together so first grind off the rivet heads and punch out the rivets. Prior to that or in conjunction you can press out the studs as well. This will leave you with the hub seized at the center only in most cases. Some heat while in a press with some pressure on the hub and a few shocks from that bfh and the hub should drop out.
I have never worked on an older Chevy but have done the same treatment on a set of early Buick drums/hub.
Then blast everything up, turn the drums, add new studs and bearings and you should be good to go.

 

Looks to me like there is rivets holding them together.

Pat

 

Ah, got it, rivets. Thanks for the input, guess I get to get out the grinder and propane torch and play for a while.

 

Grind the rivets flat. Take 1/4 inch drill bit. Drill a dimple in the rivet. Use a punch to knock the rivet out. That's the easy part. Soak the area around the hub and lug studs with kroil are PB blaster. Then start trying to separate the drum from the hub. Careful with heat. If the drums are worn so bad they need replacing the tri five chevys will fit.

 

Hello HCTJ,
You might want to go to a place like Henry's Machine Works in So Cal. I am sure you can find a similar place in your neck of the woods up where you live. There was this place in a small building in Long Beach back in the 60's. They did a lot of machining work for many drag racers and it is worth it to have someone knowledgeable doing the work.

In 1964, I had my 58 Chevy Impala drums and axles re-drilled with a Buick bolt pattern so I could install some Buick Skylark Wire Wheels I had just purchased. After the machining, they fit perfectly. (no ring adapters or J.C. Whitney bolt pattern add-on plates.) In 1964, I had a finned head on a Greeves 250 cc motorcycle machined to accept another spark plug.

This was done to allow me to finish several non-stop long distance races out in the desert Hare and Hound events. It allowed me to continue on when one plug got fouled. I could just switch over to the second plug without me having to get off to change the fouled plug in the middle of nowhere.

Before this newly milled head, I had to stop in the middle of El Mirage in the dry, hot, dusty course to change a fouled plug to keep racing. That was not fun. With the new machining by Henry's Machine Works, I just flicked the lever and the whole electrical system went over to the second plug in the head just sitting there waiting its turn. What happens if that plug got fouled? (which it did) just another flick of the switch to get a newly cleaned (from combustion) original plug for continuous running to the finish line.

Jnaki
Your truck is powerful enough to require stopping power and a professionally installed set up will enhance your safety. or...you could install discs all around. But, any qualified, automotive machine shop should be able to clean up those drums and get you back on the road safely with a new bolt pattern and lugs.

 

Hey, gang, thanks for the responses. Good info. There's lots of metal on the drums, but the moderation on the heat is a good point. As it is, I don't have an awesome garage setup, so I may take it them to a local shop, have them separated, and have new studs installed all the way around since they're 60+ years old. Will give it the old college try before going that direction though. Not an experienced hotrodder like y'all, just want to get the old girl back on the road.

It'll never go that fast, just a cruiser, so I don't see the need to go to discs. Thanks again for all the responses, I'd buy you all a beer if I could. Love the HAMB.

 

Well if you plan on new studs it's even eaiser. Put a socket are pipe that will let the base of the stud set in it. Put a nut on the lug. Take the BFH and remove the stud. Get all five out and begin to separate the hub. It will be much easier now. lots of kroil are blaster.

 

You can probably get the rivets out as suggested by grinding flat then drilling, and get the studs out by backing up the hub with a piece of pipe or a deep socket, and driving them out with a hammer. Also back up the hub with the pipe while driving out the rivets. You don't want to bend the drum, by having it be the only thing supporting the hub while you're driving out the rivets and studs.

Also, the drum is easy to find a replacement for...the hub, not so much. I would keep the ball bearings if they are in good condition, because the replacement roller bearings are kind of strange...they don't have as many rollers as normal tapered roller bearings, they're expensive, and you can't find them at any parts store. Besides, the ball bearings work fine, I have some in my truck that are almost 60 years old, they still roll. But I know the temptation to try to improve things that already work fine, is hard to resist

 

Squirrel is right, there's nothing wrong with the ball bearings, but they are a little different as far as adjustment goes. There's an article at an early Corvette site specifically about correct adjustment for ball bearing hubs, they were used on Corvettes until '63. I'm pretty sure I found it by searching "adjusting ball bearing wheel bearings" or something like that.

 

another thing about these hubs/drums...the studs are NOT swaged over the drum, you don't need to get the studs out to remove the drum from the hub. If you remove the rivets, and the drum is not stuck to the hub at the center hole, it will come right off.

 

Duly noted, thanks. I just know that if I want to use a stud removal tool to get the studs out, it'll have to have the hub removed from the drum, no?

I'm currently soaking with PB Blaster, and reapplying often. Seems pretty corroded at the studs AND at the hub, one is worse than the other. Starting with the better one first (not in pictures, studs actually look damn good on the better one) and trying for success.

 

I the "stud removal tool" is a cutter to remove the swaging, then you don't need it. If it's a press or a big hammer, then you can do it with or without the drum on the hub.

 

Ball bearings look rough, found a good deal on tapered ones, figured might as well upgrade at the same time of replacing.

 

Forgive the question, what is swaging?

 

How are the bearings in the old 6 lug hubs?

 

Stud removal tool I'm thinking of is similar to tie rod removal tool, I think.

 

Swaging is when the outer edge of the shank of the stud is deformed over the hub, to lock it in place. Common on Ford and Mopar drums.

 

Not sure, at least 45 years old, dad hadn't replaced them since before I was born, to my knowledge.

 

Have no idea then, would that be visible?

 

It's a chevy, it's not swaged.

As for the bearings...old is not a really a "condition", you have to look at the bearings to see their condition. If the races and balls are smooth and shiny, no fllakes or pits, then they're good to keep using.

 

Why are you separating them?

 

A very good question

 

Because one stud is broken. And if it's so corroded that I can't get the hub/studs out of the drum, I can't imagine I would be able to pound the stud through both the drum and the hub with all the corrosion resistance. But I can try.

 

Oh...that's all.

Just put a short piece of pipe, or a deep socket, under the hub, so the stud can drop into it. This will support the hub. Make sure it supports the hub! so the drum is not laying on the work bench, (or floor or wherever you are doing this). Then use a hammer and punch, and drive out the stud. No need to take the drum off the hub for that.

Rust might keep the drum from coming off the hub, only at the large center hole, where it fits tightly over. It won't keep the studs (or rivets) from being removed.

 

Got it. Can the drum be turned with the hub still attached? The surface is pretty rusted.

 

I have a wire brush attachment for my drill, could go after it with that and see how it cleans up.

 

The drum can be turned with the hub attached. But having rust on it might screw up the cutting tool on the brake lathe. Might want to see what the shop that would do the turning, thinks before you get too far.

The drums were used for many years on Chevy cars. Readily available new (probably made in China) for a reasonable price.

If you decide to get new drums, you'll need to get the hubs off, which means grinding/drilling/punching out the rivets.

 

If I recall right, ball bearings must be adjusted with a trace of play in other words just a touch loose. Enough to allow 1/32" movement of the tire tread when you wiggle the front wheel.

There used to be an accessory called an "educated nut" which was a replacement for the wheel hub nut that had a vernier adjustment. Today we would do the same thing with a nut, and a tin cage with graduated cotter pin holes.

Would this be a worth while change to allow more precise adjustment of the bearings?

 

tapered roller bearings have a trace of play, ball bearings have no play