Well, at the local swap meet a couple of weeks ago I finally found a manual trans bellhousing for my 351 Cleveland engine, and the local clutch shop says they can get me the clutch, but not the flywheel. So I ask around at some of the wrecking yards that have older stuff, but none of the yard owners/managers can help me with a 351C flywheel and don't know if the small block ford flysheel will interchanges with the Cleveland. Same story with the interchangabilty of a 351 or 400 Modified and the Cleveland, and again with the 351 Windsor. One yard owner ventured to say that maybe you can get the flywheel to bolt up from a non-Cleveland, but that there would likely be an out-of-balance situation, and that for shit-reasons like that one should "avoid the problemmatic, old (and rare)Cleveland "engine! What say you smart Ford oval guys? What flywheel will work with my Cleveland?
I'm fairly certain that any Cleveland, Boss 302, or early 289-302 Windsor flywheel will work, if memory serves. You want an OLD 302 one though...no newer than 77 to be on the safe side (balance changed in 79). 351-400M engines are different...pretty sure those flywheels won't work.
Fat Hack is right. All 289, 302 (prior to '79 or '80), and 351 W flywheels will interchange with the 351C. 351M/400 is definitely different. The "old" (incl. 351C) imbalance was 28.2 oz.-in, while the newer 302/5.0 imbalance is 50 oz-in.
If you have money and are not inclined to sniff one out, Ford Motorsport sells all of the flavors of flywheels mentioned above for a decent price.
I've got a fuzzy memory regarding clutch sizes - I want to say there are two flywheels for the small blocks & you have to match them to the bellhousing, but it's like trying to remember a dream in the morning...it's just fuzzy. But all the SBF will bolt on & all pre-79 will have correct balance factor as mentioned. I'm with Hack - I don't think the M/335 flywheels will work, but I'm not sure.
Ernie, you think there were two size Ford flywheels? I know with the small-block bowtie engine there are two or more sizes of flywheels and you've got to match the flywheel, clutch, starter and bellhousing. I'm kind of sorting that one out too for a 54 Belair project getting a 350 SBC and a Saginaw 4 speed. I brought home a ribbed- aluminum bellhousing for one of those SBCs last night thinking it would fit the large flywheel, but it didn't. Anyway, back to the Ford parts, I didn't realize that with the Ford small block and the 351 C or W there were two flywheel sizes.
I know the automatics have at least two different ring gears that go with different bellhousings, and I swapped one for a 302 onto a 351w and it's fine.
[ QUOTE ] Ernie, you think there were two size Ford flywheels? Anyway, back to the Ford parts, I didn't realize that with the Ford small block and the 351 C or W there were two flywheel sizes. [/ QUOTE ] Again, I'm not sure - it's this fuzzy memory of swapping out flywheels & having starter problems...it just won't come to me. It was a long time ago. Seems like the larger of the two bellhousings will work w/either flywheel...damn, I just can't remember. Sorry, man - I hate to bring it up if I ain't sure, but if it saves you buying stuff you don't need... Dan Williams would know for sure (he'd prolly spout off casting numbers!) - you should be able to hunt him down on google - type in Dan Williams Transmissions - he's a crazy old guy who'll talk your ear off, but he knows his shit...
<font color="red">I was once told that 289-302 flywheels are different from the 351W's. Correct me if I'm wrong(cuz it happens now n' then), but I understood 289/302's were internally balanced and didn't have a counterweight attached to the flywheel, whereas the 351W's were externally balanced by the flywheel weight? As far as starters are concerned I think the noses may be found in different lenghts, which can screw up flywheel-starter gear contact, so chose wisely Fords- Ya gotta luv 'em! </font>
All SBF (221/260/289/302/351 both C&W) are externally balanced. All flywheels will interchange & physically bolt on. The only "gotcha" is in late '79 or so, Ford changed the balance factor from 28oz to 50oz. Another important tidbit, you have to have the harmonic balancer to go with the flywheel - in other words, you can swap early & late flywheels, just be sure to keep an early balancer with the early flywheel & vice-verse. Of course, this may impact your pulley choice, so your parts gathering may not end there... Starter nose cones do vary somewhat - they are all close which is maddening & virtually impossible to tell the difference by just looking (unless they're side by side). When you go get a starter from your local parts house, do it by engine/trans combo (sucking eggs, I know, but...)
I think that we've heard the definitive word on the question. Thanks, Ernie and everyone else. BTW, my son mentioned seeing something on TV (Spike network or some such) earlier today while I was out spraying weeds in the pasture --- where they were building an early Foed pickup with fuel-injected (Hillborns?) 351 Cleveland engine. Rats! He couldn't find me to watch it with him; he says, but he swears that he did look for me. and now I'm eatin my heart out for missing it. Was anyone else tuned in to that build show today? Dang!
FORD ENGINE / US MODEL YEAR / IMBALANCE///FLEX PLATE 221 ......... 1962-1963 ... 28.2 OZ-IN 255 ........ 1979-1982 ... 50 OZ IN 260 ....... 1962-1964 ... 28.2OZ IN 289 ....... 1963-1968 ... 28.2 OZ IN 302 ....... 1968-1980 ... 28,2 OZ IN BOSS 302 ...... 1969-1970 ... 28.2 OZ IN 302 ..... 1981-2001 ... 50.OZ IN 351 W ..... 1969-1997 ... 28.2 OZ IN 351C ..... 1970-1974 ... 28.2 OZ IN IAM WORKING ON A 351C SWAP WITH AN AOD TRANS AS WE SPEAK
There are two different size of Ford flywheels for the smallblocks,one is a 157 tooth and the other is a 164. Autozone sells a 164 tooth flywheel that will accept 3 different clutch sizes for around 75 dollars.
To clarify this; the harmonic balancer and flywheel have to match the crank. The 5.0 has lighter crank counterweights than the 302, so additional weight has to be added externally to balance it.
351 C are 28 oz imbalance 157 flywheels are about 1 inch smaller than a 164. Measure your bellhouseing from the lower mount bolt to the top starter bolt if it's just a little over 1 1/2 inch it's for a 157 wheel 1 13/16 its for a 164 wheel
I ordered the flywheel according to Summit's parts search as I have a Jeep CJ7 with a Ford 302 from a 71 Mustang, of that I am sure as the casting number is D1ZM. However, the flywheel that came in is 157 tooth and i counted the teeth on the current flywheel and it's 164. (C5AE-6380-E)...Perhaps someone can asnwer this question. If this is the flywheel that is supposed to be on there...(157 teeth) is my starter going to engage even though the new flywheel is about an inch and half difference in diameter?
Ive got a flywheel that came from a 300 six powerunit and it has a adapter plate to attach it to a large 330 FE bellhousing. and takes a 14 inch clutch. I installed it on a 250 six. and it didn't vibrate so I got lucky. the early 221 ,260 and 5 bolt bell 289 used a different flywheel than the 65 and later engines.
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