I need to replace my original manual master cylinder. I'd like to replace it with a dual master for safety reasons (please no debate about this). While I'm at it I'd like to add a power booster, looking at a single diaphragm 7" which won't give tons of boost which should be good for a 4 drum car. This is what my own research tells me, looking for first hand expierence with adding a booster to a manual 4 way drum car. Also did you change (increase) the master bore size at all? 59 Ford Galaxie 500, 352FE. Thanks and feel free to add any input!
take a look at dearbornclassics.com - expensive set up but, should help you narrow down what you need
The single 7" booster is marginal at best. Go with at least a dual 7" or larger. Keep in mind the pedal ratio will have to be changed from the current manual ratio.
It's not a Ford, but on my '49 Chevy I went with an under-floor booster and front disc brakes. World of difference! ABS Power Brakes, Inc. (Not sure if they have a bolt-on for Ford).
52 , F1 , - I changed from stock to , Horton Hotrods part # MC1322H with 1 inch bore as the master cylinder and a 7 inch dual diaphram booster . I added an adjustable flow valve in the rear line . Left the pedal travel the same and I am happy with the way the brakes work , not a super boost but just about right .
'65 Chevy short bed, drums all the way around towing a 3700# stock car,no trailer brakes. After the first pucker I got a booster. If I remember right I just unbolted the M/cyl. and put the booster between it and the firewall then lowered the rod to the other hole in the pedal. A larger diameter M/cyl. will shorten pedal travel and decrease pressure at the wheel cylinders.
I've been reading of the possibility of overboosing 4 way drums. Is their truth to that? I'm trying to save money on not converting to front disk, also not a mountainous area or lots of stop and go. Would a dual 7" booster and move to 1" bore be about right? That's the direction I'm leaning toward as of now. Getting all the front end and breaks in top condition right now. Been holding out on doing the M/C since I don't want to do it twice. I've driven an overboosted brake car and it was not fun!
I have hydroboost with 4 wheel drums with Kevlar shoes in a 54 Chevy truck-will stand you on your head and no fade yet.
Seems to me the 1956 fords, (like the 55-57 birds) used that little remote mount unit in the fender well. Single circuit, but it wasn’t very big. They didn’t use a separate pivot for the pushrod either. They worked pretty good on 4 drums, so I suspect a 7” booster might be ok if you’re worried about too much boost. Lots of early power brakes seem overboosted by today’s standards.
What function do residual pressure valves serve. I'm finding so much conflicting information. The master is well above all the wheel cylinders, what I've seen is that the valves are to keep minimal pressure so fluid can't siphon out of the resivoir. What function do they really serve, and most importantly do I need them?
Drum brakes should have a 10# residual valve front and rear to hold the fluid against the return springs on the shoes. Without them the springs will force fluid back to the master cylinder and the next time you step on the brake you have displace that much fluid before the shoes hit the drum.
I adapted a Mustang II dual diaphram booster to my 55 using the mounting bracket from a mid 70s F150,it took a little grinding on the bracket and works great. Its all OEM parts so they can be found easily.
Just buy a dual master cylinder from a drum drum car and it will have the correct valves already installed.
I bought the Corvette style dual master, 7" dual booster, and hanging pedal assembly from Speedway and used them in my 47 Linc. I have the stock Lincoln 12" drums in front with 10" {I think} Fairlane drums in the rear, and it stops fine, never feels like it's too much boost, more like driving a 60's or 70's car. I also put in the Speedway adjustable prop valve, but it wasn't needed, I run full pressure front and rear. With the master on the firewall, the residual valves aren't necessary, you only need those if the master is mounted lower than the wheel cylinders, like under the floor.
Redo, could you explain that a little more? I thought the springs returned the shoes to a mechanical stop every time you let up off the pedal.Bones
The mechanical stop is when the plunger bottoms out in the wheel cylinder. If the shoes are in good shape and the self adjusters work it is usually not a problem. If the shoes are worn and no self adjusters then the the wheel cylinder has to move the shoes farther. The volume of 4 wheel cylinders could conceivably exceed the volume of the master cylinder in a mismatched system. Can you say no BRAKES. Pump them real fast again. So as BJR said a new drum,drum master cylinder should have the proper residual valves installed internally. But with all the mix and matching going on today I would check to be sure.
I saved my 48 once by using the old combat boot I had laced and bolted to a piece of angle iron used a lever through the floor . Just jerk back on it in a panic and it would be like a seat of the pants kick to stop ! LOL ! Correct size MC vs WC is the key to good working brakes . A booster is defined as a “Booster “ , I put my vote in for hydra boost and a shoulder harness , because your goin to need it after the install in a panic stop or a friend in the windshield business to call after the knot on your head moves away from hitting the windshield .
No magic required and also no Kits that cost a Zillon Bucks. Use all new or rebuilt over any parts house counter and and some very basic Hot Rod skills and you can do it. These are parts I've used many times and currently am installing them on two of my 57 Fords. The mount up stuff will be the same for your 59. Get a Booster for a 1974 E-150 Van with a 302 in it. I believe the first year for Drum Drum and dual chamber master is 1966, get that and the factory recommended Brass control valve. That's all the parts you need. While your at it buy yourself a Brake Spring rebuild kit and change it all over to self adjusting Drums. The master will bolt right on the Booster but be sure to adjust the push rod, also be sure the Master is for Power brakes. The Booster to pedal push rod will connect direct to your Stock 59 pedal. What you will need to modify is the firewall to accept the new 4 Stud pattern for the Booster. It's Kids play, but with a slight W,T,F. You will find the two lower mount studs hit the firewall right at an angle in the Firewall. You can deal with that in several ways. I isn't rocket science . I made a spacer cut at an angel to match the firewall on both sides with a 1/2" id hole then took a tall nut and turned it down to just under 1/2" stud with 3/8" hex left and was done. I know this is way cheeper than any Kit out there and works like it was factory designed being it actually was just not on the 57-8-and 9 Fords. Here's a photo of it installed.
This subject comes up often, so I'll just post a copy part of a thread I made some time back. Below is an explanation of residuals from a brake service manual and the 4 major vehicle application's from '68 to near the end of their residual usage. View attachment 3807991 View attachment 3807993 View attachment 3807995 Using a residual on later drum brakes may not be needed, but will help 'tighten" the pedal and causes no problems. Modern disc brakes (no return springs) never used residuals because their usage began after master cylinders were commonly mounted high on firewalls. The 2# residual is strictly aftermarket and should ONLY be used with discs when the master cylinder is below floor mounted, or lower than the calipers.
Thanks all for the great input! I'm pricing out the stuff now from local NAPA. I like the idea of all off the shelf stuff. Are most of you running carbon-metallic shoes with good results? Any need or advantage to any other brake lining materials?
Myself I use the cheapest pads and shoes on the shelf. They will stop under normal driving just fine and if you pay attention you won't even need to turn the drums when you replace the shoes. Metallic linings destroy drums and rotors on heavy cars. Not so bad on imports. The Wizzard
This is a '68 Galaxie master-booster combo, picture is wrong but ad says drum-drum. The price is very right. https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=258415&cc=1128439&jsn=472&jsn=472&jsn=472 This one is on eBay I was watching for my '59 Ford. It says drum-drum or disc-drum, but it shows how it is spaced from the firewall. Essential on the old Fords. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1961-1972-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l9372 Mine is disc-drum and manual, all Rock Auto parts out back and it stops great. I have a SSBC proportioning valve, wide open, never had to touch the adjustment. I have about 8000 miles on the swap. I have to keep it non-power, my clutch master shares a common plate I made up that also holds the brake master.
The reason I use the E-150 booster is the push rod to the pedal is adjustable in length, the others are not and that causes an issue. Also size matters depending on what motor your running and who's custom valve covers you have. They all do the same job more or less but they are not all created equal. The Wizzard
So it looks like a 1" master is what is recommended for drum/drum applications if I'm reading correctly. 1-1/8" is primarily for disc caliper volume of fluid. All I need to look for is a master which came on a drum/drum car and the RPV's will be built into both chambers. The rest is simply making it fit and bolt up. Is this all good info? Gonna pull the trigger on this finally! Want to get this girl on the road!
You are correct. The RPV's are built in and unless your going to add an Idiot Light to tell you you need to look at your brakes you don't even need the Brass Valve for what your doing. For your application all it really is is a manifold, more fittings and a Pain in the Ass. The Wizzard
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