Chevrolet 235 12 Port Head

I've thought about posting this, and then I've thought about trying to build one and then if it worked, post photos of it. I've decided to see what you guys think of this idea. It's an idea I got when I learned that Toyota was using GM's good ol 235 block and just made their own 12 port head for it. I have some more specs on it somewhere I can try to dig up but I did my research and I found that several years of the landcruiser had this engine in it and the heads for these are usually $100 or less and easily available.

The head is straight, no pockets, so you can only imagine the compression if thrown on an old 235 block. 12 Ports, all on one side, not passing through like a wayne head unfortunately but also not $3,500 like a wayne head either.

I have another 235 I'm going to rebuild here soon and I think I'm going to try it. All the ports line up on it.

Anyone else every hear of this? Thought about it? or know anyone that's ever done it?

Offy even makes a few parts for that toyota head.

Let me know what you guys think.

 

I think you better corner the market on them before you release word of it working, the price on the heads will go up about 5 times what they are now!!

 

I think that you'll discover that although the Toyota head looks like it'll bolt on a 235, it won't really.

But you could do some clever fakery and halfway disguise the toyopet block as a Chevy block.

 

here's a land cruiser engine, a cutaway, at the Exploratorium in SF.

 

Not all landcruiser heads will work, Around 70's to 80's should though.

Landcruiser has a few difference inline 6's and only the biggest one works, I think they call it a 236 and I can't remember the liters.

 

I'm not crazy
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=94936&highlight=12+port

 

Sounds like you have the 12 port bug too. Are you a huge inline fan as well? I love the hell out of the 235 man but it does have it's share of problems and port sharing is one of them. You and I, and anyone else interested needs to get together for this project and make it work. Then post photos and info on here and list all the problems we ran into to make it easier for the next guy with 12 port stovebolt fever.

First we need a head, I think I can get a good one for $100, I'll snag it if I can. I have another 235 and all the parts to rebuild it real nice. We'll use it and I have a huge big block chevy stand but I still wouldn't trust starting a motor on it so we'll make a low profile engine cart with a gauge panel and all that. If we can't meet up in person we can keep in touch by phone and the internet and share knowledge to make it work.

The most expensive part of it all will be the carbs, I'd like to try 6 carbs, and I'd love to use harley carbs because they look so damn good and the cfm is almost right on. Not even really an intake manifold so much as just 6 adapters so each carb has it's own cylander and 6 pipes coming out and we can throw some air/fuel ratio gauges on each pipe to get her tuned just right.

To start and just get it running we can tackle just getting the head on, making some headers for it and using a stock 2bbl toyota intake.

I have a lot of photos of each head and might have some side by side to compare is anyone is interested.

 

Oh and I know you wanted to make one from scratch and yeah that's awesome if you can do it, I'd love to make some experimental heads as well but the CNC on it is the last of your worries, it's figuring out how to get a quality cast of it first. If you didn't have any water jackets you could just CNC one but I kinda want to drive it on the street, not just strip.

I know it's not casting a custom 12 port head but it's something man.

 

I'm interested, so please keep me informed, with pics and tech. Obviously I can't physically help - but I may be able to supply some techincal assistance, or hook you up with inliners in the US.

Cheers

 

Kick ass. I'll get on obtaining one of these heads and I'll get a cart built. I have another car that I have to work on and get out of the way first then we can focus on it.

 

Man I would go for it, good luck

 

Okay I dug these photos up from when I was working on this idea before.

These are all Toyota Landcruiser FJ40 2F head photos. Late 70's to early 80's I believe. The numbers for this head is 876-780.

Now does this get you fired up like it did me when I first saw it? I've taken the measurements and I've compared all ports and absolutely everything lines up. As I mentioned before, for like a decade Toyota was using the same block that we're running now. Seems they realized what a torque monster the 235 was but also realized it's flaws so they used it from the block down and from the head up they changed everything.

I betcha if you hop up a 235 with one of these 12 port heads and threw on a fancy valve cover, not a soul would ever guess it was a Toyota head. Might even be able to use your old 235 valve cover.

You have the choice of either using Toyota manifolds or making your own, I'm going to make my own. Oh and the rocker assembly will definately have to be Toyota.

I don't know if Toyota used solid lifters or not, it shouldn't matter, if the rods are too long or too short we can find a place to order custom rods or make our own.

The compression could be out of this world, notice the valves are not leaned at all. You could mill down a lot off of this head. with that head you could crank it on up to alcohol only status. One hell of a bonneville runner and show winner.

A wayne head will probably smoke it any day of the week but $100 is a whole lot cheaper than the $3,500 wayne wants. So to even play in the same league for $100, that's nothing to laugh at.

TWELVE PORT FEVER!! AHHHH!!!

I nearly shit myself when I first got this idea and got my hands on all the info I could and everything spelled out "great possibility."

 

Thanks for that - now you've got me feeling as though that Toyota head I picked up a few years ago I should never have been put down!!!

Any chance you could take a pic of a 235 head gasket next to the upturned FJ40 head, as there seems to be some work to be done to get the water ports lined up.

I'll be sourcing my own head if all this stuff comes thru.

BTW the SCTA will not allow this head to run in the XO class, as the design of the ports and combustion chambers differ too significantly from stock. The Nicson head is in the same boat.

 

ah well, one hell of a show weiner then and really just all around bad ass. The first thing I checked out was the water ports and they line up. I'll try to get my hands on both head gaskets, one for the toyota and take one of my 53 chevy ones off of the shelf. We'll wanna run the toyota gasket definately but this will give us a better idea on how things line up. I'll set them in top of each other.

 

This sounds really cool. If there's anything I can do to help, PM me.

Tucker

 

Watching this one closely-looks like it's gonna be cool What sort of hp numbers do you think you'll get out of something like that?

 

This could make a really neat land speed racer.

 

I really don't know, I know using the stock head, block, and crank you can crank out over 350HP and about the same in torque. I'm sure some of these guys have done it.

Looking at the head, I think the toyota head can be milled down, way down, and the water ports reshaped, then placed on a decked block with some high performance pistons and we're talking about a tiny tiny tiny TINY combustion area. You have that long 235 stroke compressing all the way to something damn near as size of a couple of pennies. I see some awesome power out of it. From there it's all in the cam design on if it's going to be a tractor motor or 200MPH motor.

I don't think it will be too much but it may have to run a higher octane, possibly alcohol. I also don't think 6 carbs is too much for it if I use motorcycle carbs.

Thing is, once it's built I don't have anything to drop it in. I'd just have it built on a cart and take it to the local dyno. Might drop it in a bathtub, or maybe a coffin, yeah, make my own version of Dragula! Most likely I'll make a model t frame and just make a simple bucket.

Alright I'm going to shut up now before I keep on yapping and then something end up going wrong and I then I'm stuck with my thumb up my ass. First things first, take my 1955 truck 235, drop a 12 port toyota head on it, with the toyota rockers, intake, and exhaust and just get it to run. If it runs find, good pressure, good coolant flow, good oil flow on the top end (I believe it uses tubing same as the 55 235 head) and all that, then we can start fuckin with it until it's either scary powerful or pukes the crank onto the shop floor.

I'm all fired up about this project. I'll keep this thread updated.

 

Hmmmmmmm.

 

Having said that I'll now say this:

A car with this head will be allowed to run in the XXO class.

Sorry for any confusion.

 

Godddammm!!!!! watchin this one closely - keep up the good work

 

Yanno I had the cash in hand about 4 different times ready to buy a 261 block and a 12 port head from Wayne, every time I tried calling him but he never answers. Even his answering machine stopped picking up. $3,500 is a hell of a lot of money anyway for a head but at the time I thought it was the only option if I wanted 12 ports. So when I had this idea it solved everything. I can make a 12 port 235, and the head is only about $100. Toyota manifolds are cheap as fuck and hell a complete FJ40 motor might be $250 manifolds and all, maybe cheaper if it has a cracked block or something. Once it's working good I do plan putting 6 harley davidson carbs on it but I don't know squat about harley carbs, I'll just have to learn because damn dems sum nice lookin carbs!

Stovebolt says he has a lead on a head, he's going to check it out. I think I know where a few are, I'm going to do the same.

If you're doing your own research to prove or disprove this project, please post your info here.

In the end we hope to have the HAMB 12 Port Stovebolt!

 

How about this?

 

That's awesome, but it doesn't look like it's for a 235 at all.

 

I mentioned this over at Chevytalk.org, and someone said they thought the Toyota block was "reversed" from the Chevy block--so everything's backwards. Not questioning you, drtoner, just passing on something I was told.
This could be really cool...

Tucker

 

Stupid question here....how does or does not this apply to a '63 up gm 6cyl?
Brett

 

Hey I don't take offense to anything man, I need all input. The goal here is to prove or disprove it.

What do they mean by reversed? I don't see what they mean considering toyota was using GM 235 blocks which is why these heads bolt up to a 235. The manifolds and plugs are on the same side as a stock 235 head so what exactly is reversed here?

 

The 63 is a 250 isn't it? This is just for 216/235/261's.

 

I worked in a parts store/machine shop in the '80s, and one day when I walked out into the shop end of the building, I saw what I thought was a 235 block lying on the floor, until I noticed the cast on mount ears on the front side of the block. Yes, it was from a Toyota Land Cruiser. I never paid attention to the bolt pattern of the head, though. I can say that in one of my old Offenhauser catalogs, a dual intake is pictured for '62-'67 Toyota L.C. engines, and it looks identical to a 235 intake. They must have redesigned the head port layout in '68. The good old days, when Japan bought our tooling and patterns when they became (in Detroit's mind, anyway) obsolete.

 

Very interesting info.