Projects Hemi crash course

Hey fellas… got an offer to trade my O/T Dart for a 55 Desoto Fireflite with a hemi… definitely a project car but it looks real complete & says the motor turns over. Looks like it was probably running in the last decade. I’m on the hook, the car is just bad ass and I’ve always liked the look & sound of the early hemi. I don’t need to know if I should do it, cause I already know I should… I just need to know what I need to know, you know? Any wisdom about these would go a long way. Planning to go check it out & try to start it before making the deal.




Thanks in advance! New territory for me!

 

@Hombre, can you give this young man some pointers?

 

Jeezus!

 

Not much or nothing off of Dodge or Chrysler hemi motors fit Desotos....They are separate engine families...

 

Look up Hot Head Hemis for parts availability and if you like the design of the car go for it.

 

It should be (and looks like) a 291ci Desoto. The 345 was only installed in the ‘57 Adventurer.

Nice looking car! HAMB’r @VonDust has a chopped ‘55 Desoto and it is bad ass.

 

Two good sources are TR Waters on here and HemiHotHeads.

Check the number stamped in the block on the ledge just in front of the valley cover.
1955 should have prefix S21 or S22, both 291 c.i.
The 345 c.i. Should have prefix S26A, but is 1957
(@Gotgas beat me to it)
https://www.hothemiheads.com chart
Sequence Year Name C.I. Carb. BBL H.P.
DESOTO:
S17 - 1001 1952 Firedome 276 2 160
S16 - 1001 1953 Firedome 276 2 160
S19 - 1001 1954 Firedome 276 2 170
S21 - 1001 1955 Fireflite 291 4 200
S22 - 1001 1955 Firedome 291 2 185
S26 - 1001 1957 Fireflite 341 4 295
S26A - 1001 1957 Adventurer 345 2-4 345*

That’s a nice car in my opinion, maybe you can negotiate since it’s not a 345
FWIW, both @BANDITBILLY on here and I both are building 41 pickups with Desoto’s

 

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/easy-hemi-identification.5348/ There were only 1649 57 adventures made

 

If it's been parked for over a Decade don't suck anything in the Gas Tank into the fuel system! What about a little Pre-Lube for safety sake. I mean, give it a chance.

 

Thanks for the all the info so far guys. I think the car looks super tuff- most of these have whitewalls and a nice low/level stance, I'm picturing cheater slicks in the back and a bit of a rake... glad to know about the displacement, someone else (not the seller) told me it would be a 345.

Bit worried about parts, I guess I assumed there was some overlap with the other Mopar hemis. The odds are pretty good it needs a full teardown. The Dart is my current daily (though I have a modern car as a fallback) so not sure about that trade if it's gonna be a long expensive process to put it on the road... but I will definitely sell every gun I own if that's what I gotta do to come up with his cash price.

I know enough to bring a boat gas tank and pre-lube it! I also have a borescope for investigating the gas tank.

 

Treat it the same as any ohv motor. Tons of information online. And companies that cater for the hemi.

 

There is a lot of answers on the HAMB, a lot of information on the HAMB, Wisdom? Hmmm

30/30 Winchester, pre 64, nice condition? I like helping car guys, what can I say?

 

Yep, a 291. That's a low-deck motor, in '56 they raised the deck for more stroke and 330CI size except for the Adventurer which was punched to 340 and had dual quad carbs. That 340 carried over into '57 (minus the quads) and one last overbore produced the 345 with the dual carbs. Rebuild parts are no problem, speed equipment however is rare and expensive. As mentioned, very few common parts with the Chrysler or Dodge hemi. I would highly recommend getting a factory service manual, there's a lot of weird stuff on these cars.

Too bad you're not closer, I've got a '56 Fireflyte Hardtop that needs to go down the road....

 

Engine wise they are just engines that are a bit cooler and the rocker arms are a bit more complicated than other engines. Meaning the whole difference between that and another same era ohv V8 is the heads. otherwise it is just and engine as far as working on it besides maybe a few "hemi tricks". The main issue is cost of parts and being able to get the parts. I've had a rebuld kit on my Ebay watch list for the 56 330 I have had for over 30 years and that kit has almost doubled in price over the past three or four years. Still they don't all need a total rebuild with all the parts that kit supplies.
Speed parts including original 4 barrel intakes are hard to find and spendy. If you keep it pretty well stock and just have a real nice driver mechanical wise that isn't an issue though. The carb is easy to rebuild and outside of maybe having dual points the tune up is just a tune up.
I've always liked that body style and it is a hell of a good looking car. A guy had one for sale about 90 miles from me that I had my eye on before he sold it. Not that nice from what I see in the photos and missing the engine. Up to you but figure that parts are going to cost more than for something more common. That's the price of being a bit cooler than the other guy.
I know I'd drive the wheels off it if I had it.

 

That’s a good looking machine,,,you should go for it !

It’s also a Firedome,,,,not a Fireflite .
Firedome were 2 barrels,,,,,Fireflite were 4 barrels .
Unless someone changed out the intake ?
1955 were stamped S21 for 4 barrels,,,,,S22 for 2 barrel .
The stamping is on the front of the block ,,,directly in front of the lifter valley cover .
Here is an example .

Tommy

 

When I decided to build my current roadster, I wanted to avoid all the "cookie cutter" engines out there and revert back to my high school days when people used engines of all ilks. From Buicks to Studebaker and everything in between. I had a rel desire to use a 291 De Soto because I remembered Gene Adams, Adams and Enrides B junior fueler that took no prisoners, ate women and children for lunch, and put fear into lots of AA/ fuelers. After a fruitless search of a year and a half, I gave up and got a 354 that came out of a 58 2 1/2 ton Dodge power master truck. I kept the block and crank and used all passenger car parts otherwise. But, in that year and a half, I learned a very important lesson. It seems like the speed equipment folks overlooked the DeSoto and built LOTS of stuff for the Chrysler and Dodge hemis. Wieand and a couple other off brands made multiple carb manifolds Hilborn made injectors like Gene Adams used, but otherwise pickin's are very slim for De Soto. And, if you can find stuff, it's made out of the rare alloy Unobtainium! I would still like to build one if I could find a good core and I wasn't caught robbing banks to finance the project. All that being said, I think you have a Beautiful car to start with. Hunt down a manifold and regrind the cam and run it. The castings and forging of the early hemis, Chrysler, Dodge, and De Soto are some of the best ever produced for passenger car use ever done by an American automobile manufacturer! Good luck !

 

Do it

 

Steve, if I was closer you wouldn’t have that Desoto for long.

 

Put "Hemi Tech Index" by Scooter McRad in search and start reading.

 

Don't let the concept that its a Hemi so it has a lot of power fool you. Those cars are heavy, and that S22 185 HP motor you have is not powerful compared to todays vehicles. It won't be fast, nor will it feel powerful. What it will be is very smooth in movement. It would be a great road car, as long as you don't intend to pull out and pass anyone on a 2 lane highway, or get up to the speed limit very fast.

My son bought a 54 Chrysler New Yorker 2 door hardtop with a 331 CI, 4 bbl that was a 205 HP motor. It was suppose to be "One of the most powerful production cars produced in 1954." To say he was very disappointed would have been an understatement. He expected the biggest, highest HP Hemi at the time, to be fast off the line but it wasn't. He drove the car as it was designed for, highway cruising, for a year and sold it off. He got his money (and a little extra) back.

I'm betting that Hemi car wouldn't be able to keep up with your OT Dart leaving a stop sign, but it may catch up a mile down the road. As long as you understand that, it will probably be a fun car.

 

My OT Dart is a 71 with a slant 6, so not exactly tough to beat off the line! But I was thinking the hemi would be more of a tire burner than not…

 

Perspective: My son's 54 New Yorker 2 door hardtop with a fresh tune (I know how to tune a points dist) on the 205 HP 4 bbl couldn't keep up with the 175 hp V6 5 speed in my Avtar pictured car, when were the first two cars leaving a traffic light in a 45 mph zone (never exceeded the limit), and I wasn't leaving hard (never spun the tires on the coupe and never powershifted), pretty much just driving normally for me. He was wide open. I had to slow down so he could catch me.
No such thing as spinning the tire (open rear) on the 205 HP New Yorker, and I suspect it would have eaten your 2bbl Desoto alive. I'd still bet on the slant 6 Dart! Your outcome may be different.

 

Lol safe bet the Dart is quicker then. But that's OK too. I'm supposed to go look at the car on Sunday, I'm psyched about it. Hopefully it's the gem it looks to be. I think I can probably come up with the cash and keep the Dart anyway.

 

That car LOOKS fast and powerful enough to suit me.

 

I drive a 97 HP 3 speed manual car pretty much every day and everywhere. I'd be ecstatic to have 205 ponies!!!

 

@trevorsworth, just an idea. There's a running Dodge 360 LA engine and 727 trans 78 miles from you in Clifton, TX for $700 on FB. More modern engine, more power and enough torque to handle the weight of the Desoto. The car has a "cool factor" all its own without the boat anchor under the hood right now. https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/722597479581747/

 

I'm a Mopar guy 100%, but the idea of sticking an LA motor in that DeSoto is absurd. Drive it for what it is, a cool old car with a cool old engine. I don't recall the original poster say he wants to win any races. I mean, why not just buy a new turd plastic hellcat and be the fastest guy on the block? I'll tell you why, because new stuff has no character. That DeSoto is badass.

 

^^^^ Really?

 

You might want to check out vice grip garage you tube channel. Derek revived an old hemi car that had been hibernating a long time and drove it quite a distance home.

 

Good spot... I really like 360s but the 291 is pretty cool, even if it isn't exactly a hot rod. I like the seldom seen stuff... which is why I kept the slant in my Dart instead of putting a V8 in it like everyone told me to. If I was gonna replace the 291 it would probably have to be with another early hemi- maybe a Dodge/Chrysler unit with more speed parts available, but I don't know how much work that would be yet. For now if the 291 runs good it's gonna haul that bucket around just fine for my tastes.

Also that torqueflite is kinda useless if it's not an OD unit... I wouldn't even bother replacing the drivetrain just to still not be able to cruise on the highway (at around 80) haha.

This of course is all contingent on me even getting the car. He might sell it out from under me, or I go to look at it & hate it, or whatever. Honestly if it doesn't run and doesn't look like it can be made to run I probably won't even pick it up... his cash asking price is $6800 which is pretty fair, but I can't afford engine/trans/rear end all at once on something this unusual. Robin and I are gonna go check it out on Sunday... if I like it I'll leave a down payment with the guy and figure out what to do from there.

As for what I want to do with the car, no, winning races isn't on the agenda. But down the road I'm envisioning a big car with a tough stance, a loud hemi with a bunch of carburetors, a Sure-Grip rear end and just enough power to light up a set of cheater slicks... everyone else puts whitewalls on these things and drops them. I wanna go the other way, if just for the look & sound, rather than any real intent to race.