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Technical Cured My Flathead’s Occasional Overheating (The Hard Way)!. Updated 1-6

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by hotrodA, May 28, 2022.

?

Which project?

Poll closed Jun 17, 2022.
  1. 40 coupe: Replace blown flathead with on hand 283 and all the parts. Drive by Aug.

    42 vote(s)
    68.9%
  2. 41 pickup: Get back on Desoto hemi powered pickup and let coupe sit. Drive by ???

    11 vote(s)
    18.0%
  3. Have a pre-estate sale and take up model railroading.

    8 vote(s)
    13.1%
  1. joel
    Joined: Oct 10, 2009
    Posts: 2,586

    joel
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Not that this is important, but I and many others went to aluminum covers ( Corvette was the cheapest)
    because the tin covers and cork gaskets leaked. Chevy even sold some stiffener bars to try yo spread the clamp load on the gasket. Get some of those bars and use them with your covers and you would really be period correct. With some of the new materials in gaskets, they might not leak.
     
    Bandit Billy and Algoma56 like this.
  2. Thanks @joel
    I have the long stiffener bars, plus the little OE triangle shaped and short straight bars..

    Even after reading ALL the valve cover painting threads, the task of painting the script is/was a PITA.
    FWIW, the stencils on the market don’t work. Don’t match the script nor seal tight.
    I’ll try regular masking tape next go. Just wanted something a little different.

    If that doesn’t work, it’s time for aluminum.

    ANYBODY DO THIS ON THE SIDE? OR AS A PRO?
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2023
    Bandit Billy and joel like this.
  3. The only masking tip I have is to spray a layer of clear first as this will seep under the tape and not show and seal the tape edge at the same time so you get a sharp, bleed free line when you pull the tape/masking off.
     
  4. swifty
    Joined: Dec 25, 2005
    Posts: 2,386

    swifty
    Member

    Best solution for your valve covers is to strip them back and paint them in your preferred base color then take them to your local signwriter and get him to do the script. May cost you a few dollars but you get a proper job.
     
    treb11 and Algoma56 like this.
  5. Thanks for the tips!
     
  6. VA alternator piece came today! Got it mocked up; nice piece!

    Now for paint and maybe some speed holes in that front piece.
    20230109_164336.jpg
     
    D-Russ likes this.
  7. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,893

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My 442 has chrome covers that leak like a SOB! Tried everything and they continue to leak and persaonlly I think they are destined to leak and that is why Olds put 10 bolts in each one!
    Olds stuff is not popular, so I put a wanted ad on our classifieds and found an old pair of M/T aluminum covers for a C note shipped. They even have baffles in them. I dropped them off at the chrome shop last week, once done I will install and seal up that damn drippy olds.
     
    Tim likes this.
  8. Good point, BB!
    I was saving the aluminum covers for the day that the C4B and four barrel went on.
    Lot of wasted work painting the script if they leak all the time. I do like the look, though.
     
  9. Finally got the crusty oil pan spotless inside and out, got the oil pump pickup cleaned out and got it all together with one of those fancy FelPro one piece gaskets.
    Looking like an engine at last.
    20230111_144216.jpg

    20230111_151427.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2023
    Desoto291Hemi likes this.
  10. Anybody seen my fuel pump pushrod? Always something!
     
  11. gary macdonald
    Joined: Jan 18, 2021
    Posts: 397

    gary macdonald
    Member

    Awsome thread and progress . I’m considering the same in a 41 tudor. Have everything already eve the correct pressure plate . Running electric fuel pump , short water pump , 70 ish corvette air pump(?) bracket for alt . Ac to come , needed down here .
    Keep up the great work .
    Gary MacDonald
     
  12. Thanks, Gary!
    Being a Cracker, I don’t miss Florida all that much. Born there in 46.
     
  13. Back on this after 3 weeks of the plague.
    Finally felt like exerting some energy.
    Got the 283 bomb off the engine stand, on to the test stand
    and the freshly turned flywheel and new Ft. Wayne Borg and Beck clutch on!
    Hallelujah, Julia! Ready for some 283 POWER!
    6F2E523D-D29E-4CF3-BF30-B31147A930A0.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2023
    Tim, SS327, anthony myrick and 4 others like this.
  14. wheeltramp brian
    Joined: Jun 11, 2010
    Posts: 2,960

    wheeltramp brian
    Member

  15. Well crap!! And other, more descriptive adjectives.
    Put the 283 back on the test stand and fired it off. Got a hard knock from something, so shut it off.
    Sounds like a something hitting in the bell housing area. Now I have to pull that off and start looking.
    This is such a PITA! Hopefully something simple.
    F84B20A2-C82F-46C6-A8A7-138ECBB87FE8.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2023
    Tim likes this.
  16. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,893

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Ooof, I can't hit the like button for that. But I feel ya!
     
  17. Thank you, BB! Doesn’t make any sense.
    Pulled the bell housing off, checked flywheel and pp , nothing loose. Used OE bolts so they’re the right length.
    Put on a block mounted starter, with the bell housing off, but same noise.
    I’m so far behind on this, I’m dreading having to put it back on the stand and pull the pan.

    Wait a minute here! I Just had a brain spark. :eek:
    Could it possibly be a ignition timing knock? Even though it’s very loud?
    Haven’t set that since it was making such a loud racket, but it cranked fine. Just dead set it on No 1, and it fired right off.
    DOES NOT knock cranking with ignition off. Light it off and it knocks.
    Maybe I panicked and am over thinking this.:rolleyes: HHHMMMMMM.

    Ran out of gas for it so I quit for now.
    Try that tomorrow.
    Over and out.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2023
    Tim and Bandit Billy like this.
  18. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,893

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    And check that dampener up front. I had one on a car I bought that was nearly out the keyway on the crank and it was thumping around. Sounded like a rod knock. Took it off, put the key back in the crank, slid it on correctly and problem solved. Best of luck on yours!
     
    hotrodA likes this.
  19. The dampener was a press fit going on. Warmed it with a heat gun and drove it on until it bottomed out. No threads in the crank for a bolt. Keystock is in place. More fun tomorrow.
     
    Bandit Billy likes this.
  20. It's hard to imagine a spark knock without any load on the engine.

    Have you verified the valve train is fully clear of the valve covers? I've seem them where they make contact (you could actually see the valve cover deflecting).
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2023
  21. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,893

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    On the internet once I saw this guy starting his bike while (unbeknownst to him) his old lady banged two wrenches together behind her back. The faster he revved it, the faster she banged them. Drove him nuts.

    Make sure you are alone.
     
    The 39 guy, alchemy and SS327 like this.
  22. The crazy thing is that before it ran great. No knock, noise or anything.
    Before video: https://1drv.ms/v/s!AmJTGXDnSfv5vSgqw_pNka609M5m
    No video with the knock. Maybe if it continues.
    Sounds like a small hammer hitting the bell housing. Rate goes up with rpm’s

    Here’s what was done:
    New timing chain and gears
    New clutch, flywheel surfaced. Old fasteners used.
    Rebuilt OE Delco single point distributor with Bosch coil.
    New cap, points, rotor New Moroso wires
    New fuel pump and new pushrod.
    New gaskets
    Nothing was changed or taken loose in the bottom end except to clean the oil pickup screen
    Intake stayed on. Carb rebuilt.
    Same crummy rocker covers as before. Valve train untouched.

    .
    More sleuthing required.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2023
    SS327 likes this.
  23. Here you go @Bandit Billy ...Makes me laugh evertime I see it...

     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2023
    big duece, SS327 and INVISIBLEKID like this.
  24. I understand changing the fuel pump,,,,,but, was the pushrod bad too ?
    Could there be a difference in the length of the fuel pump arm,,,or new pushrod ?

    It would be nice to have a video with sound of the noise .
    If in doubt,,,,,use a stethoscope,,,,,it will pin point the location for you .

    Tommy
     
  25. Love that video, also!
    I miss placed the original pushrod when I pulled off the old junk pump. DUH.
    New pump is Carter for that engine, and pushrod is Dorman, same SBC.
    Warmed up some, test run tomorrow.
     
  26. Well miracles happen I guess.

    Fired up the 283 and the knock was now intermittent in frequency but same noise level.
    Then it gradually settled down and went away!
    I then set the timing and the idle.
    Quiet as it was in the very first video!
    Never found the source.

    BUT THEN…...
    I noticed an oil drip on the floor, which was coming from the Chicom valve cover, even with new gaskets. (@Bandit Billy was right)
    Throw on some new gaskets and better covers, right? Problem solved?
    Not so fast there, Kemosabe.

    Got three rocker arms not getting oil.
    Pulled one and the pushrod was open and clean, as well as the rocker oil hole.
    Guess the lifter feeds are sludged up?
    They pump up ok, no ticking.
    Evidence is that they were getting oil, no burnt or discolored pushrod, pivot ball or rocker/valve stem scoring.
    Just no wet rockers like the others.

    Any thing that I can add to the oil (MMO, ATF) that would help?
    Or do I go ahead and pull the intake and replace the lifters . GROAN!!!!

    OR… oil them up, run it for awhile and check for flow again.

    I need to get this thing ready to put in the 40!
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2023
    Bandit Billy likes this.
  27. wheeltramp brian
    Joined: Jun 11, 2010
    Posts: 2,960

    wheeltramp brian
    Member

    I would personally get a steel valve cover and chop the center out so that no oil goes anywhere but you can see what's happening. I would then run it and see if those rockers get oil eventually, may take a while but you could add a little bit of oil while it's running too so they don't dry up. Just my thoughts
     
    Crusty Chevy and hotrodA like this.
  28. Thanks! I think that I will go that route.
    Stay tooned for results.
     
  29. Well, here’s an update, of sorts.
    Drilled and filled an old valve cover.
    82624812-0572-47EB-924F-751118E1ED74.jpeg
    Pulled the dry rockers and pushrods and made sure everything was clean and clear.
    Fired it up and let everything warm up.
    Backed off the dry rockers one at a time and ran it with a good 40 psi oil pressure for about 30 minutes.
    Slowly but surely the rockers got oil to them, then a strong flow.
    Thanks for the tip @1971BB427!

    Then things turned to shit. The left side started SMOKING!!:eek:
    Hook up a vacuum gauge (?) tomorrow and see what it reads.

    Model railroading is looking better and better.:(
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2023
    SS327 likes this.
  30. Update of sorts. Not so good.
    Got all new valve oil seals installed, oil to all the rockers, valves adjusted, dwell and timing set at 30 and 8 BTDC. idle at 700 rpm. Oil pressure at idle 40 psi hot.
    BUT…..Still have a light puff of oil smoke opening the throttle, plus a low knock that goes away with open throttle. Can’t pinpoint it except midway the engine. Hasn’t gotten better or worse with an hour of running.
    Can anybody give me an educated opinion?
    It’s not coming from the flywheel, balancer, water pump or fuel pump.

    So do I cross my fingers and go ahead with the swap?
    Run it some more on the stand and look for changes?
    Swap it in and drive it (f**k it) until something happens?
    Presume smoke is from worn guides and put on another set of heads?
    Start over, put in my rebuilt 350 and hope the 41 trans stays together?
    This is getting REAL OLD! For an engine that ran great at first. I’ve used up a lot of time.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2023

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