Technical EVERYBODY is Stumped with no suggestions

This beats the Hell outa the Motortrend channel
@Gary Kitchens Im pulling for ya
I don’t know a lot about carbs so this a definite learning session for me

 

@Gary Kitchens You have never filled out your profile with your location. That makes it hard for a willing HAMBer to loan you a carb to test with. I am just west of Kansas City, and have a '56 New Yorker with a perfectly functioning WCFB. It's real easy to take off and hand it to someone. Further, it would be real easy to bolt your supposedly malfunctioning carb to my '56 and see if it fails.

I ***ume the carbs may have slightly different jets, etc. in them, but it should be close enough to run OK and determine whether or not yours is at fault.

 

Not a help with your problem, but I had a 54 New Yorker Deluxe back in the late 60's. It was my daily driver in college. From 0 - 35 mph it wasn't real fast. Above that the old car would really move. I think low gear was good to about 65 and the shift to high would really make the old car jump. A friend had a 66 Sport Fury with a 383 2bbl and couldn't p*** me on the Interstate. It was a good old car especially for the $35.00 purchase price.

 

No sir, nobody I know has a square bore in running condition that I can use.

mill have the carb back on in about an hour, I’m going to cut a new base gasket with only the necessary holes unlike the gasket from the kit that fits several base styles,
I’m adding the larger rear jets, re setting the carb to zero blade opening, 3/4 turn on A/F screws, I’m leaving the base timing at 14 until the engine warms up, making minute adjustments until it starts and idles like it did yesterday before I removed the carb.

I will find a way to plumb in a vacuum T to the 1/2” vacuum feed tube for the brake booster, and read the vacuum at various rpm’s.
I bought a new timing light that shows rpm’s and advance degrees so I can track the timing events of both mechanical and vacuum events.

mill have some results in a couple hours.
Thank you all, and I promise no voice typing without proof reading today

 

That’s awesome!! This car is identical except the extra doors.

 

I have been threatening to become a member of the HAMB for over 20 years lol when I first started up with fordmuscle.com back in 2003 or so some of our folks there with love for more than one brand also came here.
I held out because I was sooooo busy.
Now days I’m busy in other ways. I’ll fill in the profile stuff here in a few minutes, but I’m gonna lead off with the picture of my original base gasket between the carburetor base and the float bowls. And a picture of the replacement one that came in the kit from Napa (2-5039A) that cost me $86.

 

I just went to my profile and I do not know how to make it activate so I can list my location and **** like that. None of my ****on pushing gave me anything except my actual profile didn’t tell me how to manipulate it.

I’m in Port Orchard Washington, Kitsap County, the Deep South part near pierce county line.

 

I have a question for you, Jon, why do holly carburetors have 68 jets in the front and 74s in the rear when this one has a 92 in the front and a 62 in the rear? Is it the size of the Venturi‘s that determine the size of the jets? Or is it directly related to Full throttle CFM?

 

Can you remove the secondary linkage and drive the car? Run it full throttle and see how it acts. Sure it won't be as fast as a four barrel, but it could rule out other issues.

 

You mean remove the linkage, controlling the secondaries lock them closed and drive it in to barrel Range only? Yes I could do that. But I will know whether the repair is good or not just from running the motor right here at my shop.

The problem didn’t occur while driving. It always drove ****ty for the lady since she got it from her father she brought it to me to make it run good and I discovered that the secondary’s aren’t working and the plugs were old and ****py. The wires were ****. The distributor was in very poor condition. if it won’t rev free throttle while in neutral, then it won’t rev while driving once I solve that she will be in perfect condition for a road test

 

This is how you access your profile to update it.

 

Because Carter uses metering rod technology (there is a metering rod inserted into the jet on the primary side).

The EFFECTIVE metering of the primary side on the Carter WCFB is (2) times [ primary jet area - metering rod area ]. Note this will give you as many different results as there are steps on the metering rod.

With a 3-step rod, one can acquire 3 separate fuel flows; and a good tuner, with the aid of different vacuum piston springs, can optimize the position of the steps to relate to the vacuum of the engine under different conditions. All of this on the primary side, without having to touch the secondary side.

The SHORT answer on jet size is the jet AREA is initially set based on the venturii diameter, then adjusted based on the type of engine ("screamer" engines have different fuel requirments than "torquer" engines, even if the CID is the same) and other engine variables (compression, camshaft overlap, firing order, intake manifold design, etc.).

EDIT: the throttle body gasket you posted is a universal throttle body gasket that replaced many of the LATER WCFB throttle body gaskets, it did not replace yours. Carter produced more than 200 different WCFB carbs; we make more than 50 different kits for WCFB carbs. One size does not fit all.

Jon.

 

I am at the premier gasket making company of the entire west coast.

just got base gasket between base and fuel brown replicated without the extra holes!

 

The sealing surfaces seem to have deteriorated, may be introducing a leak.

The throttle body gasket pictured is definitely incorrect, but without actually inspecting cannot make a determination if this is a problem.

Another test that might tell us something: disconnect the secondary operating link from the primary throttle. Now you could drive the car with wide open primaries without cracking the secondaries. This WOULD confirm/deny that the secondaries are the culprit.

Jon.

 

yes that’s is logical, but I’m going to take tiny steps, now that Olsons made me a gasket that is precisely and only fitting for my bowl base, I’m a step closer to vacuum leak solving.

stopping at parts store on my way back to get pieces to plum in a vacuum gauge.
Maine serious **** is going down today!

 

These 75–11 06 metering rods I have are not stepped. But that’s the way they’re supposed to be and this particular model, correct? I have seen the stepped ones in some of the other carbs I’ve rebuilt.

 

The Chrysler hemi carbs that I have had used a diaphragm to control the opening of the secondaries. Maybe the diaphragm is bad. I got rid of them as fast as I could.The rebuild kits do not include the diaphragms. You said something about different linkage to the secondaries. Maybe you have this covered.

 

This is earlier, it’s a manual progressive secondary carb.

 

I just remembered something about my old New Yorker. I got it from a guy who had been driving it back and forth to work for 6 or 7 years. He lived less than a half mile from his work. He sold it because it needed an exhaust system and the parts were unavailable (this if before we had a Midas Muffler in town). I repaired the exhaust and got it road worthy since I was going to be going to college about 90 miles away. It drove fine around town, but the first time I opened the throttle wide open, it fell on its face and rolled smoke out the exhaust. Back off and it would run fine. I got on the interstate and got it up to 70, but it still fell on its face if I went wide open. After doing this multiple times, it started accelerating at wide open throttle, but missed and bucked badly. After about 20 miles I turned around and kept up the wide open throttle acceleration and it kept getting a little better. Finally the last time it backfired out the exhaust and took off like a jet. I think it was badly carboned up and I finally blew it out.

Later I got a newer car and gave the Chrysler to my Dad as a daily driver. He never got on it and after a couple of months of his driving it would be carboned up again. He would ask me to take it out and blow the carbon out, which I did. Don't know if this could be your problem, but my old car acted very similar.

 

Measure the rod with a micrometer right at the tip, and again about 1/2 inch from the tip.

Jon

 

That is a fantastic story and probably fairly accurate for this car. But even from idling, the secondary don’t work, I got to get the carburetor to work first before I can diagnose any further issues that may be present in the exhaust.

 

.060 to .059 at the very tip .071 about 7/16 of an inch up right below the cut out or flat spot.

so they are stepped or tapered. Unlike the ones I seen another carburetors that have much larger step or shoulder.

 

Generally speaking, the "screamer" engines have a larger difference in the steps than the "torquer" engines. Just part of the calibration process.

The "flat spot" of which you mention was called an accelerator slot; the purpose of accelerating the velocity of fuel entering the jets. This practice was discontinued in a few years.

Jon

 

I can understand that.
I just finish setting my float levels on the car now the carburetors back on the bench so I can install my accelerator pump and metering rods and snap it all back together

 

This consarned accelerator pump is going to be the damn life of me. I have to take the son of a ***** back apart again because the Excelerator pump won’t slide down into the damn chute! Effing hate the wasted time to slide it back into the friggin cardboard and use a heat gun to dry the damn thing out!

 

Sorry for all my drama I have the heat gun on it now with the sleeve squarshing it.

 

I’m running into issues. I cannot open the throttle fully because the accelerator pump is hanging up on some thing and I noticed that in Mike’s video it says adjust the accelerator pump by flat line and putting it level with the top of that area there, which is almost where it’s at, but the accelerator pump linkage sits on a round shaft with the screw, the set screwscrews into a cut away so there’s only one place to put the accelerator pump position on that shaft, but there is two holes just only one position for the pump lever to rest on the shaft if you know what I’m saying. And if I put it in the other position, it’s down farther in the hole….

i’m gonna take the carburetor top off again and try to get to the bottom of this cause it wasn’t doing this when I first rebuilt it. I may have to spend 89 bucks to buy another carb kit that has another accelerator pump in it.

 

Nope not going to do it. I’m just gonna bend the pump linkage to allow full stroke without bottoming Out.

 

Don't bend it! That will make it worse.

***uming you have a leather cup on the accelerator pump, place a few drops of light machine oil ("3 n 1", neets-foot oil, gun oil, etc.) on the leather cup before you install. Place a few drops on your finger, and wipe it on the pump cylinder.

The reason for the 2 holes is a "winter"/"summer" adjustment.

Jon

 

At this point, may I suggest you contact Jon and see if has the correct stuff that you need?
Only complaint I heard about him is could be “grumpy” which later I found out was a just in fun