Is there any more differences in shoebox inline 6 vs. V8 engine trims, beside engine and gearbox? Does I6 add more value to the car as its less popular trim option? Or its just less cylinders and nothing more in it?
It’s 95hp vs 100hp stock the radiator sits out further than the V8 and is a less popular option but I kinda like them myself. Speed equipment is out there but not that easy to find like the V8s. As far as value goes it depends but not very appealing for buyers so they do not bring a lot of money. Now if you find a 1951 Woody with a 6cyl in it from the factory you can break the bank because only a few were built.
I remember a 6 vs. V8 road test in one of the magazines (maybe Mechanics Illustrated), and the 6 outran the V8 up to 80 mph.
I assume it was a flat six? Could a Ford with a flat 6 back then even reach 80 mph? Maybe not to 80, but Chevy’s with 235’s and 3.90’s (TF era pickups) would get well ahead of the FH V8 pickup of the similar era. But as I recall the Fords pulled up and away around 30-40 MPH. Just recounting my dad and his friends tales. I wasn’t there.
In 50 the 6’s were quicker faster…..Ask Karol Miller. The best thing on a 49-50 was the bullet in the grille had a “6” in the middle and you could turn in over and have a “9”.
The 6 is less common but definitely also less desirable and would hurt the value of the car somewhat. Not that they're a bad engine (not at all, in fact) but the buyers are going to want the V8 engine, or a discount on the price. Definitely a case where more rare does not translate into more value.
I bought a 1951 Ford 6 cylinder, 226 cubic inch business coupe when I got out of the army in 1961. It had a big dent on the driver's side just behind the door, but it only cost me $ 65.00 at the time. I never, and I mean never, lost a light to light race with it. A lot of V-8 owners were very unhappy, and embarrassed when I popped the hood. Chop50 here on the H.A.M.B. has a nice chopped 1950 6 cylinder tudor.
So how does I6 with less power can be faster than more powerfull V8, If everything else was the same? I dont want to believe that, I6 was so much lighter and that made the difference. At least, rear end must have different gearing to accelerate faster, or there must be more differences between them.
In high school my buddy had a 47 Ford coupe with a flathead 6. We use to do stoplight to stoplight drags as we cruised through town. He put a exhaust cut out on it which was half open. At a stop light he would pull out the choke a little to get a lopey idle. He was fast for a block. A lot of guys with faster cars wouldn't race us as the lopey idle and partially open exhaust made them think there was something pretty hot under the hood. I remember getting the old car up to an indicated 90 mph, but it really quit acceleration much after 60 mph. Later I helped him put a 53 Mercury V8 in the car. I never thought it was all that much faster. I think he wound up with a Y block before the got rid of it.
Rich B is correct, simplistically. It comes down to the area under the curve. If you can find it, look at a dyno curve of a flathead V8 vs the inline 6. Sure, the V8 has 5 more peak Hp, but I bet the 6 has a flatter torque curve, and hence more area under it between 2500 and 4500 RPM (the range most people do their flathead street racing in). The area under the curve is equivalent to the energy capacity of the engine. And the more energy you can put to accelerate a car, the faster it will accelerate.
The person who mentioned different rear-end gears may be on to something. I've been a "Shoebox" guy for over 65 years, but they have all been V8's. I will admit that I have no idea whether the sixes came with lower gears than the V8's, but I wouldn't be surprised. I do know they can make a huge difference. In 1967, I bought a new Corvette coupe with a 4-speed and 3.70 rear end gears. A friend had purchased a new coupe a year earlier. Both were equipped with the L79 engine option (327/350) , but were otherwise very similar. The one option that was different was that he had ordered his with the 3.08 rear end ratio (fuel economy? in a Corvette?). I drove both cars several times and can tell you that the 3.08 equipped car was an absolute slug at anything lower than highly illegal speeds. My friend even got beat in an impromptu drag race against a '62 Impala with the 250 HP 327 and a Powerglide! So gears do make a difference in acceleration. This would also explain the tales of the V8 walking away from the six at speeds over 70. Also, the Ford 6 was a ten year newer design than the V8. I would expect that the Ford engineers learned something between 1932 and 1941.
If your 6 had an over drive the rear gears were 4.11’s and I believe the non-OD was 3.70. The 6 had 180 torque at 1200 and the V8 had 195 at 2000. The big difference was the stroke. The I-6 was 4.4” and the V8 was 3.75”. Remember we are talking stock. I’m also guessing the cars in the Mechanic Illustrated were bone stock. The V8’s exhaust system was really bad also. If you find an illustration the left side exhaust float thru the right side manifold to exit at the rear.
I heard a story that originally the 6 and V8 were rated at the same horsepower and Ford upped the advertised power of the V8 by 5 to give the V8 buyers the illusion of getting more for their money. They were very close to the same displacement, not surprising they'd make similar horsepower, and inline engines do tend to make a lot of torque low in the RPM range, which would give some credence to the stories of them being faster initially from a dead stop. Still, buyers are going to pay more for the V8 car than the equivalent flat 6 in an early Ford, mostly due to parts availability and the legendary status that the flathead V8 has earned.
I'm having to think that the six may have had more crosswalk to crosswalk grunt in low speed street races with stock shoeboxes. Remembering that a lot of the time that was the whole "race". I was surprised a few years back when I saw the Ron Dunn shoebox in the raw at the 2014 Portland Roadster show. Stock as a stone flathead six in it I've got one that is going in my very slow moving speedster project just so it has a flathead something in it. It should be plenty fast for what I want and it is about it looking like an authentic engine in and early 30's 2 seat race car.
The 6 had better torque and would run up through the gears faster. Top end was a different story as the V8 would run it down and pass it. The L6 sweet spot was red light to red light. That is if the column shift wasn't wore out.
I was born and raised at a time when you had to have a Ford V8 to be cool. Don't try and confuse me with facts. Henry was a God and the V8 Ford was King.
Steve Danish diehard Chevrolet 6 racer, he started with truck 235s he converted to full pressure later changing to the 261. 1953 New York State NASCAR Sportsman Champion 1953 Fonda Speedway with a record 12 feature in a row! Championships at several other tracks At Langhorne Penn. Note 8 NASCAR win stickers above the rear window, and NASCAR sportsman Champion below the trunk lid. Steve Danish with the New York State NASCAR Sportsman championship trophy The watch he was presented with from NASCAR for winning the 1953 championship. Danish was still racing and winning with Chevy 6s (261) into the Small Block Chevy era- Note the Chris Drellos owned Falcon in the top right.
What I remember.. I read an article somewhere about Holman-Moody-Stroppe back in early 50's were building 226 Ford 6L for boat racing and doing quite well. The 6L are a 12 port block and probably flowed better than the V8's at least in the exhaust ports. Ford engineers approached them and wanted to know what they were doing to the engines because they would start into destructive harmonics at 4400 rpm and they [H-M-S] were running them up at 7000 rpm. H-M-S just said that we don't run them at 4400 but pass through so quick that we have no problem!
I6 has a bunch of low end grunt but doesn’t have long legs. My 235 Chevy pulls nice but you aren’t supposed to go past 4500 rpm.
I had a 65 Comet 200 6L that was good to 4500 rpm, at 4700 the lifters would pump up and end any acceleration! There was local [CT] Sportsman car that was called the "Silver 6" powered by a 320 GMC, did pretty well against the v8 engines.
I think the six is heavier to be honest. I know it’s a lot more awkward to move by yourself and don’t ask me how I know…….
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