Art & Inspiration Shortage of Shops to work on Hot Rods

Oh boy ...

 

mcpherson.edu
Pretty amazing automotive restoration college out at McPherson Kansas.
I know it's not the average trade school, if there is such a thing, but this place is very serious about training those that are serious enough and able to commit to a 4 year program.

 

100% agree.

 

Interesting and 100% accurate. Guys talk and the one's with a bad reputation to work for are all known.

What I think is missing from some of the auto programs is some type of basic business classes as well. The most talented guy in the world will have a hard time going out on their own if they can't even understand the basics of a balance sheet.

Not saying you need to be an accountant, but you need to understand the basics of business 101 before hanging your shingle out front of your shop.

 

This is the reason I do all my own work, except paint and upholstery. Every time someone I know mentions buying an old car, the first question I ask them is, "Who are you going to get to work on it?" If they don't know, they shouldn't buy an old car. It's hard enough to find parts when you know how to do your own work.

 

People have shops build cars instead of building their own? Is this a thing?

 

It's not that kids don't want to work on cars anymore, but they don't want to work on OLD cars anymore. You can buy a cheap Honda sedan, chip it, make some modifications in a weekend and it will go faster than most of the HAMB era cars... and still have money left over for paint. You may not like tuner cars, but they are the hot rods of today. There, I said it.

My kid just signed up for auto body in high school, mainly because they want to learn paint and wraps. The school is separate from the high school and kids are bussed there from high school and back. The auto body teacher said that he can't get anyone to sign up. I think he has 17 kids with space for 50. No wonder high schools are dropping these programs.

 

I have 50 in my body shop class.
Probably at least 400 students in various shop related classes.
Another 200 in non shop classes.
And we still have the threat of closure even with a new facility planned.
The only number that factors in is $$$$$
The funny thing is I recruit new students with the few old cars we work on.
I attend job fairs at schools and show things we build at local shows.

 

WSJ had a big story this am on gen z passing on college and applying to trade schools.

 

Generally old people drive old cars and too many old people are still under the delusion that things should still cost the same as they did 20-30-40 years ago and because of this they also think that anyone trying to make a decent wage out of working on these cars these days is ripping them off and refuse to pay what it costs. You see the complaints about what shops and various trades charge on forums (again mostly populated by old guys) all the time.

You're not getting a tune up for $50 anymore at a decent shop that is running above board.

 

Makes sense. I have another 71 Barracuda (this one a hardtop) and it’s very tempting to leave the exterior in its original ratty form. Save me tens of thousands that can go into the mechanicals and into a nice interior.

 

Around here, there are no shortage of shops to work on old cars. However, the quality work that many of these shops offer comes at a price. As a previous thread discussed, shop rates for quality workmanship generally start around $100/hour and go up from there. This goes for mechanical work just the same as body and paint.

I don't buy the notion that shops are dying off, because any time I've enlisted the help of a professional shop for an issue or aspect of my build, the shop was busy and there was a wait. I waited around 5 months to bring my Olds in for paint, which was exactly what was told to me when I approached the shop about the project. But other shops in my area like Old Stillwater Garage, Rob Ida Concepts, Valhalla, and so on, are all busy and thriving.

There are definitely some smaller home shops around that take on a variety of automotive projects. Some are tremendous. Some should not be in business. That's the risk the customer takes when trying to cut corners on price. There is no licensing body for automotive restoration shops that I'm aware of, so literally anyone can hang a shingle and hold themselves out as experts in a given field. You have to do your own research, check references, and make an informed decision.

 

In my area, anything with a carb bamboozles them! Gone are the days of mechanics that can work on and tune them.

 

The last cars with carbs were in 1989, 35 years ago. The big 3 went to PCMs starting in 1980, 44 years ago. For a visual, next time you drive around, count how many cars with chrome bumpers you see. Why learn outdated and niche skills? Do you expect (and pay for) a blacksmith, tailor and cobbler too?

 

We don’t teach lacquer anymore.
haven’t for decades
But if you can spray the new stuff, lacquer is EZ
Why are we worried about tuning a carb?
The info on how to is at your fingertips.

 

I recently had enough of the rat race(medical device repair) and went to work for a small place that restores european cars pre-1990, basically we try and stay away from the "computer" controlled stuff. Although we do old school electronic fuel injection.

I am one of two mechanics (my counterpart is 73) we have 5 guys in their 20's whom all started "green" no experience at all. They show up on time and are enthusiastic but I do struggle when I see my boss let one of them spend too much time on a task that a customer is paying premium rates on so they can get "educated". Watched one spend a month rebuilding a simple open diff solid axle with disc brakes! All work is T&M. So customer is subsidizing these young guys education.

I love the idea of hanging my own shingle but cannot fathom the cost of a building here in west Michigan.

 

ALWAYS. 100% of the time.
Management is quick to take credit, and $$$, when things go well.
And quick to point fingers when things do not go well. Never their fault, just ask them.

 

How did every single mechanic learn how to fix stuff back in the day? College degrees and working for free? No, OJT used to be the way. Business used to bear (and pass along) the costs of apprentices, journeymen and experts as how to keep the knowledge and talents in-house.
I bet you weren't an expert when you started in medical device repair. I also bet you weren't working for wages that required outside help to survive.
Sounds like your boss should be better at time and skills management if you could have shown how to do it and get the job done (and the knowledge passed along) quicker. Don't blame the apprentice for the failings of the owner.

 

Learning stuff the hard way, is the SLOW way.

Of course, if the kid is making $10/hr and the boss charges $100/hr,
who benefits when it takes forever ?

 

I kind of agree. Like so many things there are those that bust their knuckles working on stuff for the love of it, and those that pull $100 bills out and throw them at someone to do it for them. Well, because they love them too. They just have the money to buy the best of the best. I came out of Advance Auto a few years ago and there was a nice street rod sitting there, not a HAMB car per say, all new cool stuff. The owner came out and I asked if those were real Boyd Coddington wheels. He said they were, and so was the car, he won the car in a $100 raffle. I wanted to hear the car, he got in and nothing happened. I got in my 65 Fury III convertible and asked if he wanted me to go home and get my trailer. He said no, he had AAA. At least I would have asked the guys at Advanced, they are pretty good at old carbed, points cars, and would have checked a few simple things? He just got his cell out and staired at it?

 

“No one wants to work” actually means “no one wants to work for me/us”
The other common denominator for poor management is worker retention.
Every business has turnover but if there are no long time core employees, I guess “no one want to work anymore” is easier to swallow than “no one wants to stay here because of me”

 

Hot Roding started being a build it yourself deal. It developed skills how much do you learn paying some one else to build it .To me the build is hot rodding
'

 

Yep.
I’d bet the number of pro shops in 1955 vs 2024 would be a huge advantage towards the later date.

 

You are a good young welder. Do you work in the oil fields with a tough boss and long hours or at a shop where you have a tough boss and normal hours?

Another true axiom is People don't quit jobs, they quit bosses.

 

Why would anyone gain or maintain those skills and tools?

The last car to be sold in the US with a carburetor was in 1991.

The last truck in 1994.

The average age of a car or light truck in the US fleet is about 12, sold in roughly 2012.

Vehicles with carburetors are a vanishingly small statistical outliers.

I haven't been asking to build an "hood down" old car without EFI in a few years.

 

Truth. That's the only reason I have left shops.

In my experience the "nobody wants to work" bosses have wanted to pay me $15-18/hr to build cars for them (where fast food pays $22.50, and has benefits).

 

I rarely see a carburetor when I visit custom shops.
I’ve seen more y-blocks, FEs and even a cool straight 6 jimmy. No carbs on em

 

Pay is very important
Most dont want to work for a dick no matter how good the pay is

 

The current engine in my 1960 Falcon was EFI from the first computer controlled spark, after building it.

My blown Hemi in my A, too.

Lots of people try to make the claim that analog stuff is more reliable.

Faults-per-fleet-mile-traveled statistics have long proven that to be false.

 

One is a leading-indicator of the other.

If a boss wants to pay you dick, chances are he is one.