Termites and Bowties- Early Chevy Group

Can you tell I’m working hard?
Tonight after work I removed the final pieces of the Mustang ll suspension. I was very, very careful not to cut into the frame. The frame was a little “wiggly“ even BEFORE I removed that front crossmember. It’s a lot worse now, so I have to be very careful.
After I finish media blasting the frame, I’ll take the frame off the rotisserie and put it on supports and square it up. Then add more temporary bracing. Then I’ll box the frame.
I’m looking for advice about boxing the frame. (Specifically, how to position the plates in relation to the frame flanges.)

 

Jay, excellent work! Wondering if you settled on the early Ford style front end with the springs on the top of the axle? If you did, you may need to extend the end length of the crossmember a few inches. My '31 Chevy frame is wider than the Ford crossmember, possibly your frame may be the same as mine, you'll see down the road. It's up to you, but I would recommend that you extend the width of the crossmember so it locks into the channel until it meets the vertical area of your frame for extra strength. You need not to be concerned with caster angle because it's built in to the Ford crossmember at 7 degrees (at least on mine).

 

Are you saying THIS crossmember will not be wide enough to fit my 34 frame?

 

Why make tour Chevy like a Ford? I know it is easy but......

 

That’s a valid question. I like the look of a solid axle. It’s what I think of when I think of a hot rod.
If I had a good source for front parallel springs, I would consider it, but it’s not my favorite of the two. ( I mean no disrespect to others on this forum who have parallel springs. )

 

Well even Spurgin & Giovanni eventually Fordicated one of the most famous Chevy hot rods ever.

 

I had to do the same to mine as well lol. It hurt me to do so but was easier.

 

It is tough to get a parallel leaf front end low without a ridiculous looking dropped axle. I'm working on it. Low is over rated.

 

since I built my frame it was just easier to go that route

 

I caught my error Jay; I meant to say that our frames are wider than the Ford crossmember. Without knowing what width your frame is where your old crossmember was, I'm betting your frame is wider than the Ford crossmember, like mine. Check your width to see where you're at. I locked my crossmember completely into the C channel once I had added a few inches to my crossmember. You don't have to if you plan to weld yours directly to your boxed frame rails - choice is yours. Here are some specs on an example of an early Ford front crossmember from Speedway:

Material Type - Steel
Overall Length - 24.38
Crossmember Type - Stock | Dropped
Crossmember Style - Channeled
Material Gauge - 7-gauge
Ride Height (w/Stock Spindles) - 1 Inch Lowered
Material Thickness - 0.16

 

Motor doesn’t even have 1000 miles on it and I’m already going for a change

 

This is the cross member I’m running, I have a model a one I thought about running originally.

 

Both our chassis and Jay's has 5" tall rails, Model A has puny 3" rails, so you made the right decision brother on your '32 Ford crossmember. Speaking on your installation, did you weld yours to the boxed rails or extend the ends to lock into your C channel?

 

I believe you have two choices - you can either "step box" them by positioning the boxing plates about a 3/8" or so inward from the top and bottom of the C channel to allow for running your brake/fuel/wiring, etc. Or make the boxing plates flush with the top and bottom C channel. Your chassis book will explain this in much more detail.

 

Before I mounted the frame on the rotisserie, I bolted a brace of heavy steel across the front frame horns to lock them in place. See picture.
I wanted to keep it from spreading because I was going to remove the front crossmember.
Since then, someone sent me a schematic drawing (first one) showing measurements of different frames, (but please note that nowhere on the drawing does it indicate what year we are looking at). It’s possible that this frame is not for a 1934 Chevy Master coupe. However, I think there is strong evidence that it is. The rear crossmember looks exactly like the schematic drawing for a Master. The 2nd drawing is from GM archives info for a 1934 Master but doesn’t show dimensions.
I think some of my measurements don’t match the schematic drawing because prior owners pinched the frame to install the Mustang ll front crossmember. The width at the rear of the frame matches the diagram, but the front of the frame doesn’t match.
That being said, what would you do with the frame at this point? Would you try and return the dimensions to the original?

 

yeah just stitched them to the rails. Originally I was going to run model a horns so I could run a fog light but that changed.. looked cleaner without

 

That being said, what would you do with the frame at this point? Would you try and return the dimensions to the original?

Jay, your frame is in GREAT condition... The most important factor here is that you have a nice steel body that bolts down to your straight frame. Returning your frame dimensions back to original makes no sense, more so that you are focusing on building a traditional hot rod. Looking at your frame in the front, you will need to grind down those original rivets that hold the leaf spring mounts and punch them out to remove them. Honestly, I would save them in case someone "tiquers" may have a use for them. Remove the rear leaf spring mounts for the front springs as well. I hope you have the steel apron for your gas tank. I just searched the net to find a "Master" steel tank and been coming up short for the most part. Holy Christ - I did find a stainless steel tank for a '34 Master and wait for it... $1,200!!!

 

"more so that you are focusing on building a traditional hot rod." Why does this mean it must look like a Ford? Not knocking you guys at all because you have built/are building some really nice cars but bolting a Chevy body Ford running gear or even custom building a chassis for Ford suspension isn't very "Bowtie".

 

Six Ball, you're a cool member here on the HAMB, but you are forgetting what the true meaning of a "HOT ROD" is by definition. A HOT ROD is a combination of particular parts that said owner wants to see on his car, truck, what have you. It's the freedom of choice that every owner has when it comes to their cars. Why do you think that hotrodders place '32 Ford grille shells on their hot rods? Because they look GREAT!!! Same goes for headlights/I-beam axles/taillights/seats, you get the picture. Doesn't matter what make of hot rod that they run. Do you think Ryan (administrator) specifically stated that a Bowtie Chevrolet has to have all bowtie parts on their cars in order to show their cars/projects on any of the threads here on the HAMB? If you're still in doubt, ask him...

 

Yeah I forgot all of that. Don't know what came over me. I should know better than suggest that a Ford front end isn't the only choice for someone building a Chevrolet and posting on a Chevrolet thread. Just thought someone in the process of building a Chevy might want to know that parallel leafs work well before cutting all the spring perches off of the frame. The parts are out there. Sorry to have gotten in your way.

 

If you're looking for a good source for parallel front springs, check out St. Louis Spring, in St. Louis. That's where I got mine. I replaced the original Knee-Action suspension in my 34 Master with a front axle and springs from a 1950 Chevy 1/2-ton pickup.
The problem was that the original pickup springs located the front spring about 2 3/8" too far back in the fender opening. The solution was new 1950 pickup springs with the locating pin moved forward. It took three days from ordering the springs from St. Louis Spring to when they were delivered.

Here's a link to their website. Leaf Springs - STL Spring Company (saintlouisspring.com)

And a link to my build thread to a bit more info and pics. Projects - 1934 Chevy Coupe Build. | Page 3 | The H.A.M.B. (jalopyjournal.com)

By the way, I ordered the springs on the day after Christmas 2023. Also ordered two stock 34 Chevy rear springs at the same time. Total cost with shipping for all four springs was $810. EXCELLENT, EXCELLENT service.

 

Thanks for the spring information. Your coupe looks really solid. Keeping the wood? I'n trying to do that with my roadster but it is a battle. A good thing is that yours is a Fisher body and there are books. A lot of repair can be done if needed.

 

I originally was going to use a front spring from a 50s pick up as well; they were all just a bit too wide for what I wanted my car to look like. Then my buddy sent his axle to sids in oklahoma and it got lost in the mail and that pretty much ended that idea for me.

 

I'm a chevy guy; but it's not that serious to me. ofc It would have been nice to have a whole gm car. But building the frame with the available parts i had near me was more of what I cared about.

 

If . . . . is a little word but really makes a difference.
I don’t have rear leaf spring perches for front parallel springs. If I did, I’d be more likely to consider doing front parallel springs.
I bought this 34 coupe project because it’s a CHEVY. My good friend had just purchased a 1934 Chevy 1.5 ton truck and I couldn’t believe how cool it was when I saw it up close. Then, as if by divine intervention, I saw this 34 coupe for sale. AND IT’S A CHEVY.
So, my buddy and I are both working on 1934 Chevys.
I appreciate the wisdom shared on this Chevy page. I’m a member of some 1960–66 Chevy truck forums and there certainly is a variety of opinions on how things should look. I have not made any final decisions about front suspension. However, I purchased a very nice CHEVY rear axle tonight. It has 62 inches between the WMS and a 3.23 rear axle.

 

That rear end is awful wide for a '34. I have a 2 wheel drive S10 under my '34 Master. It barely fits 9 inch rims inside the fenders. Too wide of a rear end on a fender less ride puts the tires too far from the body IMO.

 

It depends on backspacing. My wheels have 4.25” of backspacing and with tires mounted it comes to 5”.
Here are 2 pictures of my 34 when it still had the Corvette C4 rear axle with a 62.25” WMS width. I thought it looked fine. If I think this rear axle is too wide, I can get something else later. https://youtu.be/SbTOs_mFW0o?si=2EUD5AnAdDBR6U4o

 

I have a 9inch under mine and it’s pretty much what I wanted as stance/look. I think there are some variables of the tri 5 Chevy rear ends that could work as well. I don’t think I have many pictures of how well the rear tucked into the whee well

 

Wheel backspacing is a very important factor.
Snoop, Would you mind measuring the width from inside one rear TIRE to the opposite TIRE? Based on pictures you shared, I’d say your wheels don’t have as much backspacing as mine. Just sayin’.

 

Jay from inside tire to tire it’s about 53 inches.
I’m running 40 wheels on the front and back. 16x4.5 on the rear and 16x4 on the front.