60'-70's Vintage Oval Track Modifieds

These are the last of the 60s pictures I have.

 

oops forgot to upload the pictures...

 

I spent my early years in Elmira,NY.I remember going to Chemung Speed Drome,the track owned by Geoff Bodine's parents.At that time,the track was approximately a 1/3 mile banked dirt oval. The dominate car in the modified class in the early sixties was an open wheeled,scratch built car put together by the track owners brothers.
The interesting thing about the car (it was #88 I believe) was that it was powered by a Mopar slant six while the rules allowed ohv V8's in the class.The blue car was driven by Maynard Bodine.Being a kid ,I thought the Maynard name was cool,associating it with the Maynard T.Krebbs character played by Bob Denver on the Dobie Gillis tv show.This car was wrecked hard at least once and put Maynard in the hospital with a punctured lung and other injuries.This was a clean looking machine for the time and was on display periodically at Elmira Chysler Plymouth.In the mid 70's I ran across the chassis for this winning machine stored in a shed in Pa.The then owners of the frame told me the reason for the cars dominance was that it had a hidden tank for either nitro or some other power adder.If this was true or not,I don't know.I would love to see a picture of this car.
Steve (V7)

 

This will probably make me a bigger "dick" but flemington&middletown can,t hold a candle to lebanon valley or FONDA!

 

lot of cool pics here http://www.retrorockets.org/home.htm

 

Why did they ever put the engine in the back?

 

I've raced at all four of these tracks (although only on Flemington's paved version). Everybody has their favorites...usually based a lot on where you grew up and what tracks were local.

They're all a little unique to themselves and it's hard to really say one is significantly better than another. Flemington, in it's dirt days, was known for lots of side-by-side, power sliding action in its four distinct corners. Middletown for its fast and wide turns and ultra hard clay surface. Lebanon Valley is famous for super high banking and super high speeds and Fonda I think is just a track that takes some BALLS to run well at...that 2nd turn -back stretch- 3rd turn "D" shape is treacherous.

I've managed to participate at dozens of tracks over the years and they vary quite a lot in thrills provided, skills required and "raceability" in terms of how hard or easy to actually challenge to pass. It's hard to pick a favorite, but Middletown ranks at the top of my list. It suits my driving style (which was formed racing there). Drivers who are used to different styles of tracks probably have differing views regarding their own favorites.

 

John, just seeing who's awake tonight,they are all great tracks. Never drove,wrenched for the "MONK" for about 6 years!

 

Brabham, Clark, Chapman, Hill.

 

Love all these old pics.

I swear I was born at least twenty years too late.

Here's what passes for a dirt modified around here (Missouri, Iowa, Kansas, Illinois, etc):



I would have loved to have been able to run open wheel supers before it became mostly about who had the most money.

Even these IMCA/NASCAR/UMP Modifieds have gotten ridiculously expensive to run. Long gone are the days of the home built chassis running junkyard parts and used tires. Replaced with purpose built CNC machined featherweight parts, $40,000 motors, and $200 tires that you run for 25 laps and throw away.

The douche bags with more dollars than sense can and will ruin every sport they set their eyes on. I just wish they'd stick to things I don't enjoy doing.

 

I guess....so the Hot Rodders wouldn't be interested anymore????

The Indy Roadsters were really cool cars. Too bad they don't run a companion event to the current Indy 500 races. It could be a 100 mile race for front engine cars. Sure would be interesting, huh?

 

Those are Bad Word--go wash your mouth out

(I must admit those first rear engine ford mills sounded sweet)

 

man... this is easily becoming my favorite thread!!.. Can someone tell me what kind of tires these guys used. i mean they're slicks right, but look like on 10inch or 15inch wide rims.. was there a certain name for the tires or are they same slicks you would use to drag race?
-Anthony

 

Don't kill the messenger, as Jack Webb would say: "just the facts"

 

That's the "Twister" and the driver is Hank Arnold from Tucson AZ. Hank was killed in this car at Manzanita Race Track in Phoenix. They still have a Hank Arnold Memorial race every year. The car has been restored and is at the race. The most memorable thing that I remember about it was the sound it made down the straight away. Nothing else like it. I was a "grunt" on the car when I was a young kid.

 

Goodyear and Hoosier mostly.

The slicks are not drag slicks, purpose built for roundy rounds. Dirt tires are very soft, grooved in various patterns (too many to list), and were made mostly by Goodyear, Hoosier, and McCreary. Most of the dirt tires will have a very thin (usually two ply) sidewall to let the tire stretch and give to protect the contact patch. They leak like a sieve, but they sure are nice on a slick track.

We ran McCreary tires on that modified for many years, and it only took about ten laps to wear the raised letters off the sidewalls, they lay over that much.

Other brands have come and gone as well, but those are the majors.

 

In the early days of stock car racing, they ran street tires...often snow tires because they were softer compound. Then some retreading companies started making race developed recap tires. They were on street casings but had wide caps that were "slick" for pavement or drag racing and the dirt racers would groove them up for traction.

Later, actual racing tires were made available and the width, tread designs and rubber compounds were constantly developed and marketed to racers looking for the "edge" on the competition. The tire sizes maximized in the late 70's with some as wide as 18" and circumferences as large as 104". In the 80's most tracks instituted rules that limited tires to about 15" or less.

In the 90's the practice of tracks "specifying" a certain tire size, brand and composition became popular and in attempts to reduce costs and limit horsepower, the maximum width was reduced again to the 13" range.

Years ago, tires would last half a season. Today's racers are so willing to overspend to win, many are installing new tires for every race night.

 

A harder compound than drag slicks. In the early 70s some of the outlaw dirt sprintcar guys actually did start running drag slicks on the r-rear, and these were known as "humpers" as they could roll over the ruts and clods better than the available oval track tires but blistered pretty quick.

 

..........................................................................................................You are correct. When IMCA came out with the open wheels they were cheap and fun to run. Mine got parked and now I use it for a place to lay things on. I am going to modify it into a street stock for next season. Anyway I have more fun with my vintage jalopy stock car ts a 34 ford flathead powered ..

 

Yeah, a blower will do that.

 

Yup, money and time constrains pushed me out too. I've got two of those chassis setting here at my shop, collecting dust now, as the prospect of spending $40k-$80k to run a full season is just too depressing to consider.

The late model guys around here spent their class into oblivion. There were nights where they just ran a five lap dash to set the field, because only eight cars showed up to run. They just got to be too expensive for folks in this part of the country. Finally the tracks just stopped having a late model class at all. The fastest thing around then became the A modified class.

So, those five or six late model teams that were left dropped back to the open modifieds (which were far beyond IMCA rules by this time anyway, alum heads, groove and soften tires, $20k motors, no min weight, etc), and then proceeded to once again spend the competition into the ground.

New tires every night, $30k motors (swap to a new one at mid season), titanium and aluminum parts (no minimum weight). Hell, when the ASA went to the GM crate motor, we had a guy that bought a half dozen of those V6's and ran them, because they made a buttload of horsepower, and weighed like 100 lbs less than a V8. He broke four of those motors that season, and didn't even flinch. It would actually take longer to spend the money if you were lighting it on fire one $100 bill at a time.

The weight thing got to the point that some teams were building/buying full chrome moly small tube chassis that would fatigue and go away about 1/3rd the way through the season. No big deal, just buy a new chassis every ten races and throw the old one away once it started to flex and crack. We used to joke that they bought them by the six pack to save money (and what a hellacious plastic band thing it would have taken to hold that package together on the shelf ). I think the tracks finally stopped allowing the small chroem moly stuff in the cockpit cages after a guy got killed in one of those tiny tube cars. Turns out that chrome moly isn't a magic bullet after all.

How do you compete against people like that? In fact, I often wondered (and still do to this day) how the hell anyone can afford to do that at a Sat night short track that pay $500 to win, $50 to start in the A-Modified class. Spend $100k to win $13K (assuming you won every single race in a season). As my old man would say, them numbers don't jive.

For my part, we just couldn't, and then later, wouldn't. A car that would have won races and championships ten or fifteen years ago now will barely net you a top ten finish, and then only if you're a sneaky bastard.

Sad deal. I really miss the racing, but without another alternative, me and everyone like me is left on the outside looking in. Oh well, maybe those FasTrak crate motor late models or modifieds will catch on around here, they might be a hoot if the rules are handled correctly.

At any rate, enough pissing and moaning from me, back to the cool old race cars.

 

It was the best of times
It was the worst of times

 

My dad builds models of all those old cars - models of the real cars that raced back in the day. He went all over in the northeast to races - Syracuse, Oswego, Fonda, Nazareth, Reading, Orange County among others.

 

It was also the.................???? well, uh, it was the 60s man.

 

cool hand your post about the cost of racing reminds me of the saying, "how do you get a small fortune from stock car racing?..... Start out with a large one !"
I too have that 20 years too late feeling with stock car and drag racing. The time of experimintation is over, we now have to step aside and let the people with the big money race with the proven formula.
The other thing that is killing all local motorsports is location. Our old track here in missoula now has 50 houses built on it- the infield is still there, it's a park. they shut it down in the 80's when people started moving close to it. I went to a track in south austin when I lived there, it's last year in existence, same problem what was out of town is now in town, and land out of town is too valuable to waste on a motor sports complex.
I live on the wrong coast... but I would love to start up a TRADITIONAL modified circuit, 50's to 70's style cars, dollars and tech,with the only modern nod being to safety. Something that would be fun to do every weekend and wouldn't break the bank.
here's some pics of the nvra guys from ga., and nc.

 

Jalonies!

 

<TABLE id=HB_Mail_Container height="100%" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width="100%" border=0 UNSELECTABLE="on"><TBODY><TR height="100%" width="100%" UNSELECTABLE="on"><TD id=HB_Focus_Element vAlign=top width="100%" background="" height=250 UNSELECTABLE="off">What a cool thread!! Click on one of John56h photos and it will take you to Web shots and you can see cool stuff till your fingers wear out. I was hoping to see some pix of Speedy Bills/Speedway Motors super dominent purple 4x! Maybe xderelict photos had it. I couldn't open these photos. The great Lloyd Beckman was a fab driver who kicked ass on most !! Thanks to all who contributed to this fun expo!!-Sololobo/Roadburners of Omaha
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Man I loved the Hurst Side pod car.
I used to go to practice every day after school to watch it run.
anything with Hurst on it had to be cool--Smokie was the real deal

 

Now that was racing!!!!!!!!!!!!!! unlike nascar and arca now, you ,well at least me, I can't tell one car from another without seeing the sticker on the nose....I've always loved those old race cars......This reminds me of that 70's movie with Richerd Prior "Greased Lightning".......

I wish they would come back with some sort of vintage circuit with the old tin racing either dirt or asphalt......that would be something to see.....

 

All the cars you pictured are SC cars and of the bunch only the red 99 and blue 550, in the backgrounds, are built the oldschool ttraditional way. I know, I have raced against all these and I'm part owner of the #44. The 44 is on a late 70's chevy frame, the roll cage was done by a friend that helped design the COT chassis for NA$CAR. The engine is a 390 FE. That little white 50 ford #sr22 is a late model racer with the 50 body fit to it. The #15 followed the oldschool direction using 55 chevy frame and body but assembled and set-up used modren knowledge. NVRA started out to show folks what the old cars used to be like, But has quickly become a bunch of money racers. Althought there are more cars running each event (30+) there are very few built like they were in the 50's and 60's.