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Millermatic 140 and Aluminium

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Buick59, Feb 16, 2008.

  1. Buick59
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 1,995

    Buick59
    Member
    from in a house

    Just bought the aluminium spool gun for my Millermatic 140. Holy shit welding aluminium sucks. Has any else tried mig welding aluminium? What were the results. My welds were horrible it boogered up or just burnt right through. Could not get a solid bead.
     
  2. 50dodge4x4
    Joined: Aug 7, 2004
    Posts: 3,534

    50dodge4x4
    Member

    Yep, aluminium welding sucks.

    Aluminium needs to be clean to weld. I usually hit it with the 80 grit sanding disc before I weld it. It also has to have the right gas, needs to use straight 100% Argon. Also need to fee the wire in pretty fast, I feed the wire at about 2X the wire speed of steel wire the same guage. Welder polarity has to be correct also. Then after all that, not all alloys of aluminium can be welded. Other then that, practice, practice, practice. Gene
     
  3. Also, try preheating when using a 140amp machine.
     
  4. jj mack
    Joined: Mar 22, 2007
    Posts: 735

    jj mack
    Member

    clean then clean again...
     
  5. i weld aluminium all the time im my opinion its easyer tHen steel to weld.yor using a spool gun did you switch your gas to pure argon? or did you keep the 75 / 25
     
  6. Buick59
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 1,995

    Buick59
    Member
    from in a house

    I just bought the gun and gas yesterday (100% argon). I sanded down my test(18 gauge) piece, but maybe I need to use some thing to strip the metal. Will break cleaner in a can work? I'll keep at it, but Im almost wondering if I may have better spent my 380 bucks.

    I tried several different wire speeds, with mixed results...none of em good. How bout the wire tensioner?

    I never thought about pre-heating...I'll give it a try.
     
  7. Buick59
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 1,995

    Buick59
    Member
    from in a house

    Oh yeah what about wire size? I bought two spools of 30. Smaller size better or bigger?
     
  8. mungo
    Joined: Jan 4, 2007
    Posts: 72

    mungo
    Member
    from Australia

    Welding aluminium is easy once you get the right settings-wire speed and amps,start welding and turn the controls while your welding and you will soon see which way to go,wire size will only require a different setting
     
  9. Unkl Ian
    Joined: Mar 29, 2001
    Posts: 13,419

    Unkl Ian

    "Clean enough to eat off of" isn't clean enough for welding aluminum.

    Aluminum Oxides melt at a higher temperature than the bare metal,
    which makes burn through more likely.
     
  10. Crusty Nut
    Joined: Aug 3, 2005
    Posts: 1,834

    Crusty Nut
    Member

    18 G is pretty thin to do with a spool gun.
     
  11. hoarder1212
    Joined: Jun 1, 2007
    Posts: 156

    hoarder1212
    Member

    We used to weld with a miller spool gun quite a bit. The gun we had was very fussy about the way that you held it,If the spool was resting against the spool cover it always welded bad. If you flipped it the other way and the spool layed against the gun it worked pretty good.I dont' know maybe ours was just worn out. We only use Tig now.
     
  12. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

    i weld Aluminum tankers all day. try doing 2 passes. a high wire speed very fast first pass, then turn the wire down very low until you get spray transfer, and the trick is to weave the gun back and forwards about a quarter inch as you go. i don't know if that makes sense to you, but pretty much move forward 1/2 an inch, then go back a 1/4, and so forth. you'll avoid burn through and get a nice even bead that looks kinda like a tig weld.

    hope that helped ya.

    Cheers

    EDIT. The time honored rule for aluminum is also, Hotter-Faster.
     
  13. rstanberry
    Joined: Dec 22, 2007
    Posts: 202

    rstanberry
    Member
    from terrell tx

    Tried it with my little 110 v Lincoln. Looked like a dirt dobber trying to build a nest.
     
  14. Buick59
    Joined: Mar 3, 2001
    Posts: 1,995

    Buick59
    Member
    from in a house

    Thanks guys, Im going to keep plugging away at it and see if i cant improve my skills. Sounds like I may need to clean the shit outta the aluminum.
     
  15. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

  16. jj mack
    Joined: Mar 22, 2007
    Posts: 735

    jj mack
    Member

    Front and back (if you can get to it....)
     
  17. JESSEJAMES
    Joined: Aug 15, 2006
    Posts: 339

    JESSEJAMES
    Member

    Aluminum wire feed in my opinion is one of the hardest forms of welding there is. It is ment for high speed production work and uses very high heat levels. The wire speed is commonly 4 to 5 times as fast as the wire speed on steel mig welding ...Also If you are trying to weld material under 1/4 inch thick? Its going to be tough... Just getting the fragile aluminum wire to feed at a high speed through the long lead is damn near impossible with out jamming every 20 seconds. This is why most aluminum wire feed welding is done through a spool gun like an Airco Midget.....

    You should try Gas welding it....Or borrow sombodys TIG machine....

    what are you trying to weld?


     
  18. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

    you can't gas weld aluminum...
    and its not 4 or 5 times more, its about 1.5 times more.
     
  19. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
    Posts: 8,130

    Rootie Kazoootie
    Member
    from Colorado

    You better duck P/B :)
     
  20. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

    i weld Aluminum for a living. Aluminum Oxide melts WAY hotter then Aluminum, the outside will oxidize and the inside will become liquid aluminum, almost like a bag of hot metal. thats why you can't oxy fuel cut aluminum, an dyou need a plasma cutter.

    3/8" Alu is welded at 28 volts with wire speed set at 7 on miller cobramatics.
    3/8" Steel is welded at 31 Volts with 4.5 wire speed on miller cobramatics.
     
  21. JESSEJAMES
    Joined: Aug 15, 2006
    Posts: 339

    JESSEJAMES
    Member

    Cleaning Aluminum....

    * Make sure you Scotchbrite off the film left from the Kilning process. This film is super hard to melt and will give you trouble starting your weld puddle.

    *Use Acetone Only(No oil base cleaners i.e. paint thinner or Laquer thinner)

    *Clean your welding rod(you'll be surprized how much crap is on a brand new piece of rod)

    *Dont use carbide wheels or sanding disc's to clean Aluminum, Carbide will impregnate itself into the Aluminum and never come out. Makes for a crappy weld.

    *Clean gloves on clean hands.

    *Clean welding surface...Aluminum or copper surface works best.

    *Aluminum welding will suck in all the impurities around it so make sure everything is clean....

    Just my 2 1/2 cents......


    [​IMG]

     
  22. JESSEJAMES
    Joined: Aug 15, 2006
    Posts: 339

    JESSEJAMES
    Member

    Funny I've been Gas Welding Aluminum for 15 years?.......Wierd?


    maybe its illegal in Canadia??
     
  23. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

    show me 1 picture and i'll beleive you.
    edit.
    ]
    are we talking BRAZING or welding?
     
  24. Some of my tricks.... something I avoid is using is a steel type wire brush. Stainless wire brushing seams to work. Also... with every type of spoolgun I have ever used I notice that they get hot and you will experience what is known as burnback where the wire will melt inside the tip and plug it up because it gets too hot. I have been told that some folks will stick the tip of there spoolgun in a cup of water in between welds.
     
  25. dirt t
    Joined: Mar 20, 2007
    Posts: 5,337

    dirt t
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    1. HAMB Old Farts' Club

    Go to covell.biz to learn about gas welding aluminum. It can be done my friend!
     
  26. Rootie Kazoootie
    Joined: Nov 27, 2006
    Posts: 8,130

    Rootie Kazoootie
    Member
    from Colorado

    WELDING! http://www.tinmantech.com/
     
  27. Harms Way
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 6,914

    Harms Way
    Member

    I learned how to gas weld aluminum in the late 60's, I learned how to anneal it, shape it and gas weld it,... I learned from Frank Mack,... maybe you should Google Myron Stevens,... He built the Miller aluminum bodied race cars,......

    I guess you can learn something new every day ,......:cool:
     
  28. PsychoBandito
    Joined: Oct 9, 2006
    Posts: 216

    PsychoBandito
    Member
    from Montreal

    well, you learn something new every day, i was always told it wasn't possible.
    sorry to doubt you, i guess it's just a rare art form not many people use.
    i haven't been welding for 25 years, but i do weld aluminum all day with mig on large tankers.
     
  29. JESSEJAMES
    Joined: Aug 15, 2006
    Posts: 339

    JESSEJAMES
    Member

    Kinda hard to pop off pic's of myself welding...

    But!....

    Here's some pictures of the 10" tree stump I shot through with my S & W .500 Mag. from 50 yards away....


    [​IMG]

    ENTRY....


    [​IMG]

    EXIT....

    [​IMG]


     
  30. Harms Way
    Joined: Nov 27, 2005
    Posts: 6,914

    Harms Way
    Member


    :D:D:D:D:D ! Can't do that with a Millermatic 140 !
     

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