Thanks for that one colesy, I've never seen it before. I can hardly remember the car running SS/T at all. Don't even remember what the engine combination was, probably only a cam and springs added. The Hampp's bought the 1970 Camaro SS 396 for C/S when it was still new (82 miles on the clock). It must have been built over the winter of '70-'71 and didn't run as a stocker too long before it was in SS/E by 1973.
Happy to see that you guys have kept the thread going. Here are a few more Bill "Redman" Floyd photos. N/SA '57 Chevy H/S '62 Corvette
Here's some Witchcraft history. In the summer of 1965 I was working for A&P in Rehoboth Beach, DE and had to drive by a junk yard/used car dealer and noticed a 55 Bel Air that had been sitting for a few weeks. One day I decided I would stop by and ask the price. It was a complete, original 265 3 spd with a enamel repaint. I was even told that it had been owned by a school teacher. The price was $110. I offered $100 cash and the guy said he had to call his father for approval. I can still remember the phone conversation, "Daddy, they's a man down here that will pay $100 cash money for that 55 chivrowlay." "Daddy says you can have it." Six weeks later I got "Greetings and Salutations" from Lyndon Johnson and gave up my plans for the car. I sold it to Charlie Hampp a few months later. This is how it looked then parked behind Charlie's Hi-Po 289 Mustang. Notice that Charlie still had not removed the snow tires!
I too sold a nice 55 Chevy when it became obvious Uncle Sam wanted to send me away. I'll bet thousands of tri-fives changed hands because of Vietnam.
I had a strange feeling when a few guys came up from So. Jersey to look at my '61 Belair. Call it intuition or just hopeful thinking, but I thought maybe they really knew something about the car or recognized it. Well, they bought the car and picked it up today. After the deal was done, he said, "I have something to tell you". I said, "I had a feeling, I'll bet you know the car or owned it". Then he told me he had bought it from the original owner and made it into a race car. He raced Junior Stock with it with a 283/170 (when 4-spds were allowed). So, now I feel much better about letting it go, because it's back with the guy who first raced it. It was called the MouseTrap. He eventually put in a 270hp 283 and ran it in SS/X, then sold it to a guy named Don Weber. He's getting more photos of it, but here's one from back in the day, after he sold it to Don who put another 170hp & powerglide back in it to run Stock. I couldn't feel better about the way this turned out!! I'll be keeping in touch and getting more photos and history. I'll be happy to share them if anyone's interested.
This car is why I bought the Vette I drive. I seem to rember that car being a 56 and the VIN tag aswell as the mirror on the dash being changed to make it a 57 for the class. I always wondered how those guys got awat with the rear spring shakles hanging down like they did ? The old Vettes had the shackles runing up from the rear crossmember to the springs, maybe NHRA didn't know ?????? Bob
WoW ... I JUST got back from spending six hours on the New Jersey Turnpike ... oopps, I mean The New Jersey PARKING LOT and I read this post! I'm soo happy for Verne and his 'REALLYHADAHISTORYAFTERALL'61!' .... I figured that 170 HP/283 'played a part' in the 'story'!
There will be more to come, I'm sure. Please be patient. I asked him if he was responsible for the dent in the back of the trunk lid and he said yes. He had put a 409 and 4-spd in it soon after he bought it but it caused nothing but problems and he had to push start it many times. That's when he put the 283 back in it and started to race it. He said the gold, red and blue on it was Candy. It's really nice when something like this comes full circle. I couldn't be happier that he has his old race car back.
"Alex Jarrell (remember the Farm Wagon 56) built the engine which features a Moroso deep sump pan, Racing Head Service heads and Stahl adjustable headers." We used to go up to visit Alex and his family just to BS. On one of our trips to Alex's, he told us that John Dianna's stayed with them for a weekend. John did an article on Alex and his engines/trans. I have a vague recollection of a semi-circle group photo of some cars that used Jarrell engines. Alex's wife, Jeanette, told us that John thought Alex was weird for eating crunched up saltines in a bowl with milk and sugar..... until he tried it. It must have been after that article was written that the collaboration on the Corvette came about.
Although they built some good stuff, I have bad luck with the crate motors. When I first started my business in 1982, we bought two 350 Chevy's and a 400 small block. I installed one of the 350's in a 1978 G10 van. It developed an oil leak at the galley plug on the LR of the block. It was trapped under the edge of the head and could not be removed to reseal unless I removed the A/C compressor and head. That lost me a days work. The other 350 was installed in Dave Bishop's 1976 G20 van. On his way to photograph a race at Delmar, the engine lost oil pressure with only about 30 miles on it. We pulled the pan and found the mains eaten up, obviously from debris remaining from the machining. I had to remove the engine, crate it and ship it back to Memphis. A week later they tell me that I must not have pre-lubed the engine and they would not pay any labor, but would repair the crank/bearings. That was about a two day R&R lost. The 400 was a little better as the only problem was the harmonic damper ring coming off on the highway and beating up the underside of the car along the way. We must have made the purchase before they got their shit straight!
Question ... RE: Stock Class Weight-break (classification) 'progression.' I know many of the folks enjoying this thread understand exactly why a specific engine/car combination will be identified with (often vastly) differing class designations from one image to another, but some of the other guys might wonder why. So, I thought it could be useful to share the 1961-to-1970 Stock Class Weight-break progression with the forum's members. I'd be be happy to post what I have. 'Down South Racer' sent me a couple years I was missing, but I'm still lacking the somewhat dramatic 'change' ('69 or '70?) that occurred after 1968. Does anyone care to share (post) 1969 or 70? Here are the 1968 Stock Class *'breaks' *Pounds per rated horsepower. A/S or A/SA 8.00 - 8.49 B/S or B/SA 8.50 - 8.99 C/S or C/SA 9.00 - 9.49 D/S or D/SA 9.50 - 9.99 E/S or E/SA 10.00 - 10.49 F/S or F/SA 10.50 - 10.99 G/S or G/SA 11.00 - 11.49 H/S or H/SA 11.50 - 11.99 I/S or I/SA 12.00 - 12.49 J/S or J/SA 12.50 - 12.99 K/S or K/SA 13.00 - 13.99 L/S or L/SA 14.00 - 14.99 M/S or M/SA 15.00 - 15.99 N/S or N/SA 16.00 - 16.99 O/S 17.00 - 18.99 P/S 19.00 - 20.99 Q/S 21.00 - 22.99 R/S 23.00 - 24.99 T/S 25.00 - 26.99 U/S 27.00 or more
Thanks for the insight guys!! I'm building a '65 GTO to appear much like a circa '68 modified production/ super stock car, including era-specific wheels and tires. I'm not about to put my 7.75-15 coker redlines on the back and try to launch it, but I get your meaning.
Thanks Steve for posting the weight breaks. The other thing I seem to remember about the horse power to weight break is that the organizing bodies re-factored HP ratings of the engines as the cars got faster. Someone can elaborate on that, I don't know when this started, Henry.
Anyone know the specific rules of a '60s Jr. Stock Chevy 283? The "regulations" on the mill if you were to go racing back then, what could and could not be done... -Dean
I have original NHRA rule books from 1959 to the present...whatcha need exactly? [And for anyone reading, I'd *KILL* for an original '58 NHRA Drag Rules book...!] The reproduction Polyglass tires aren't that bad actually...in fact, they hook up better than an equivalent "normal" radial tire. Our Camaro has run 11.7s @ 118+ in Pure Stock on our F70-15s, with a 1.85 60' time...and the current record holder in the "Stock Appearing" class is a '69 L88 Corvette that has gone 10.30 @ 132 on a 1.50 60' time, on an F70-15 Polyglass tire!
A car's 'factor' was determined by taking the manufacturers submitted weight and dividing it by the advertised horsepower, which gave you it's horsepower to weight factor...you'd take your factor, find where it falls in the class guide, and you have your class. Take the *minimum* hp/weight factor of your class (say your hp/wt factor is 8.31, so you'd use 8.0), and multiply it by your cars rated horsepower, then add 170lbs for driver weight, and you have your minimum weight...but, if the NHRA thought your combo was underrated horsepower-wise, then they'd add horsepower to your combination, effectively adding weight, and adding parity.
It was not until sometime in the 80's before 170 lbs for driver weight entered into the rule books. Couldn't adjust weight to class minimum either. Car had to weigh shipping weight without driver. Smartest car owners had jockey sized drivers!
Back in the mid 1970's there was a pint sized driver, whose name I can't remember, who qualified several cars at the Gatornationals. If I remember correctly, the cars ran stock, super stock and modified. He had some talent as well as being light. On the subject of horsepower factors, there was always grumbling from the racers. Whenever a combination won too much or lowered a record, you could count on being "factored". I remember Tim Bishop complaining about his 1968 Z-28 having to run against 428 Mustangs. The cubic inches were hard to beat on the top end.
Thanks to an email I got from 'Fast Freddie' AKA 'Down South Racer' Here's the 1967 NHRA Stock Class *weight breaks ... *Pounds per rated horsepower. *Sorry guys, but I'm not exactly sure how far 'down' the AUTOMATIC classes went in '67, but I 'think' the automatic classes stopped at I/SA. I'll edit this post when someone verifies it via checking their 1967 NHRA rule book. By the way ... notice how (compared to the 1968 'breaks' re-posted below) seemingly 'illogical' *some (*for example C/S and D/S) of those 'breaks' were. I bet a few of the guys know exactly why! A/S or A/SA 8.70 - 9.49 B/S or B/SA 9.50 - 10.59 C/S or C/SA 10.60 - 11.29 D/S or D/SA 11.30 - 11.88 E/S or E/SA 11.89 - 12.49 F/S or F/SA 12.50 - 13.99 G/S or A/SA 14.00 - 14.99 H/S or H/SA 15.00 - 15.59 I/S or I/SA 15.60 - 16.99 J/S 17.00 - 18.99 K/S 19.00 - 21.49 L/S 21.50 - 24.99 M/S 25.00 - 27.99 N/S 28.00 and more ... and here again (for easier comparsion) are the ... 1968 NHRA Stock Class *weight breaks ... *Pounds per rated horsepower. A/S or A/SA 8.00 - 8.49 B/S or B/SA 8.50 - 8.99 C/S or C/SA 9.00 - 9.49 D/S or D/SA 9.50 - 9.99 E/S or E/SA 10.00 - 10.49 F/S or F/SA 10.50 - 10.99 G/S or G/SA 11.00 - 11.49 H/S or H/SA 11.50 - 11.99 I/S or I/SA 12.00 - 12.49 J/S or J/SA 12.50 - 12.99 K/S or K/SA 13.00 - 13.99 L/S or L/SA 14.00 - 14.99 M/S or M/SA 15.00 - 15.99 N/S or N/SA 16.00 - 16.99 O/S 17.00 - 18.99 P/S 19.00 - 20.99 Q/S 21.00 - 22.99 R/S 23.00 - 24.99 T/S 25.00 - 26.99 U/S 27.00 or more
Please stay tuned 'Chevy454,' as some of us think the idea of building a 'fantasy' 1960s-style Junior Stocker 'might be' a fun on-line 'project.' If the idea does 'go forward' we will all certainly need some input from your most-valuable resources! PS: Here is an interesting eBay item I just spotted---> http://cgi.ebay.com/6/7/63-Mid-East...0?IMSfp=TL081130113001r35037#ebayphotohosting
Tom, You might be thinking about Cotton Perry who ran an H/MP Chevy II and also drove Jim Danuel's SS/L '66 Chevy II at the 78 Gatornationals. Bob Rice
No problem...I've got some other NHRA *junk* laying around here as well, so feel free to rattle my cage!
The Jalopy Journal
