As we get deeper and deeper into the financial meltdown, most people are having to adjust their situation to the new reality. Time to re-evaluate and reset the clock. In our autocentric world, this means getting back to basics - whatever that may be for each of us. It strikes me that this has and will remain a core value of the HAMB and that the time has never been better for the HAMB philosophy of creating something out of nothing much and, in the main, eschewing all this consumer driven technology. Personally, I am hoping that this will be the kiss of death for the billet infested, gaudy, multihued clownmobile movement, spawned by the likes of Boyd Coddington and multiplied by a bunch of copycat builders, touted and talked up by the media into a feeding frenzy of bad taste. I am hoping too that it will remain but a nightmare, seen, tongue in cheek, as the epitome of tack and trashiness - kinda like the '70s! The austerity after WWII gave a huge boost to resourcefulness and hot rodders used what they could find or make into something. Working with what they had or could get hold of cheaply or for free, adapting or inventing stuff for their own purpose. Learning new skills out of necessity or a desire to do it for themselves. In this vein, it is my view that the HAMB's time has come and is spot on for the times in which we now live. A time to get back to basics, eschew rampant consumerism and focus on the same values that created the nascent hot rodding movement during the Depression Era and the post war years. Simpler times may also mean a cleansing of the high dollar lawnchair 'park 'n brag' billet egofests and a return to the local free cruise, hangout, drive in type get togethers. A return to real cars and real values - a spirit of cameraderie. Maybe a few picnic car club organized type family shows, where the costs reflect the amount to put it on and not the ever escalating rampant greed of the past couple of decades. Where everything does not have to be a 'Business with a capital B', but is done on a 'for fun' basis. To my way of thinking, this may just be the best thing to come out of this mess that we have been involuntarily forced into through m***ive incompetence, lemminglike consumerism and naked and ever escalating greed.
Well stated, friend. My father always worked on his own cars, simply because he didn't have the financial means to hire the work done. I am a product of that upbringing. I've had to learn as needed, just to keep my cars on the road and that has culminated into this hobby/sickness that we call rodding. I believe that the current (and near-future) economy will force most guys to either abandon the hobby or will force them out into the garage where they belong. The few remaining 'rod shops' will be the ones with the skill and reputation worthy of weathering the storm. To those shops, I say "God speed". To the hacker shops that will inevitably close their collective doors, I say, "Good riddance". The days of mega-buck 'bought rods' are numbered and the pride of craftsmanship will once again return to the individual. Austin Speed Shop and others of its caliber have nothing to worry about. They have the skill and reputation to be around for many years to come. There will always be the wealthy enthusiasts who want their talents and can afford them, but the average Joe with the average budget will need to put up or shut up at the local cruise night. I see this as a positive thing for true hot rodders everywhere.
Something to think about there. Some additional commentary to consider would be that the "billet infested, gaudy, multihued clownmobile movement, spawned by the likes of Boyd Coddington and multiplied by a bunch of copycat builders, touted and talked up by the media into a feeding frenzy of bad taste" had/has a lot to do with the success of hot rods/customs these days. While many of we minimalists do not "like" the look or appreciate that section of the auto community, as minimalists, we do not drive the markets (because we're not spending the big bucks). We minimalists, do-it-ourselfers produce work to be admired and proud of. However, Average Joe Public is generally not drawn to our type because as minimalist do-it-ourselfers, we have a different mind set than AJP. Once we've banned the "gold chainers" who spend the big bucks, what will drive the old car economy? What will keep the big draw shows going. This is important because it keeps the focus on what we're doing. However, as minimalist do-it-yourselfers, we're not really focused on our egos and most aren't doing what they're doing to stroke their ego, hence, the need to exhibit crowd drawing non-functional jewelry is really beyond our thought processes. In short, we need all types in the hobby for a variety of different purposes. We might need to lean out the crowd, but we might not also. Loss of revenue in any hobby is seldom good for the entire hobby.
I can see your point, JDHolmes, but how many of the "bling rod" crowd will now be parting with their easter eggs to pursue other interests? That may just open up many doors for guys who couldn't find good bodies, frames, etc. With a glut in the market, the average guy may be able to finally afford a project that needs to be saved from the early 90s styling and given back its dignity. Just a thought. You do, however, make valid points.
I like your p***ion but see a flaw in the logic. Anymore, billet and traditional are the same build price. Fully finished traditional cars that is. There's a lot of uncompleted traditional cars claiming budget superiority, clouding up the whole issue. Billet's been around long enough that it's staples are available cheaply new and used. To be quite honest, billet actually adheres closer to the heart of budget rodding by utilizing cheaply available late model junkyard components, even though it's dressed in bling. Seriously. I guarantee you I can put 17" torque thrusts & lo-pros on a car for the same price as steelies, caps and wide whites. Engine and trans? For the price of a sorted out flathead I can do a whole powertrain out of belly****on parts, with a ton of chrome to boot. Traditional cars are awesome, I'm just sayin......all that glitters is not gold
I also see a flaw in the logic. All be it Gold chainers with their bling rods. Hey different strokes for different folks. I personally don't want to blend in with the crowd. Isn't that why we build hot rods/ customs and street rods? This kinda goes back to the Ford and Chevy wars. I don't want to be like you and drive what you have. That being said there are some builders that make a living constructing these BLING rods. and I concur with Shifty.......$150 buck for s damn steel stock rim is ********.
So ... throwing hundreds (maybe thousands) of hard working fabricators, welders, machinists and entrepreneurs out of work is a GOOD thing? Can we finally get over blaming "gold chainers" (your words) for ****ing up hot rodding? That's like blaming wealthy people for ruining the home building business. Builders only build what buyers want. All successful businesses simply fulfill market demand. No body shoved billet down anybody's throat - It was just the "New New Thing" for while, still for those who actually like the look. Now, the "gold" is buying Period Perfect Traditional Replicas 'cause it is the New New Thing. Think of it this way - You're a starving artist so your paint to please yourself. But other artists choose to paint art that matches some rich guy's sofa, so they can live a little better. You're still an artist. And they are business men filling a market demand. The two are totally unrelated. As for greed - the guys who ****ed this country are WAY above our little world and should be in jail. But most shop-built rods get built for people cashing out their home equity, life insurance or retirement accounts (kiss that good by!) Just one man's opimion.
Weazel, sorry man, very flawed logic as most have mentioned already and for reason I totally concur with and was thinking as I read your statement....except... I don't agree with this though....MOST is a very strong word and I don't think the folks that spend that kind of money to have a shop build them something are stupid enough to pay for it thru the means you've listed. At least not the one I know that have had shops build them something over the past 10 years.
Agree, the guys that I worked with as shop customers were hard working SMALL BUSINESSMEN. Some got their start as bricklayers, carpenters etc......they built their businesses to the point that they could pay us since they were too busy running their operations.
I think your logic is flawed. I think you're a little caught up in what some might call "wishful thinking". A guy that can afford to have a $100,000+plus toy car built for him, that essentially sits next to his $40,000+plus custom Harley & his $150,000+plus boat (in the garage of his million dollar home) is not the guy that is most affected by the current economic crisis. It's mostly the little guy living check-to-check on a modest income that is suffering and having to sell his stuff, not the guy with the expensive toys, the big house, and the hot wife with fake ***s. And it seems that you really harbor quite a bit of resentment for people who dont share your taste in cars, and successful people who can afford to buy whatever they want. You might consider the fact that to a lot of people, old cars are just fun toys that they enjoy bombing around in occasionally, and not a defining statement of who, where, and what that person is. Despite what a lot of guys think around here, "checkbook rodders" are not bad guys, they just aren't necessarily like us. I hate to tell you this, but we do not "own" the car hobby. If those guys with the pastel-painted billet-wheeled digital-dashed street rods want to play, they have just as much right to be here as we do. Am I into their cars? Not in the least, but since I am not consumed by jealousy and resentment, I also realize that not all of them are greedy, braggarts, lemmings, or any of that other ****. Some of them are actually just nice guys who want to be part of the hobby, but don't eat, live, and breathe cars.
The "garage builders" will always exist, just because they have the p***ion to create their own dream rods. The "store bought group" will always exist because they have the urge to be different just like every one else. As long as the two can realize that in reality we need to co-exist for the hobby to truly survive the world will be fine for us, but when the money goes away, the politicians will legislate us out of existence. Not having the financial means, I have always been and will always be a "garage builder". Besides, it's more fun to know that what you drive is a personal creation.
strange thoughts indeed.... as if a traditionally built car is cheap and everyone builds thier own with cast off parts. the bad economy is not good for anyone, whether traditional, high tech or somewhere in between. it costs money to build these cars. money that will now be spent on day to day life, or saved rather than spent until things pick up again.
Okay, Lady C, "most" is based on my own knowledge of six cars that were bought or built with "tax break" home equity loans. And the small business men are certainly a big customer base. But don't under estimate the stupidity of "home owners" - ****ing equity out of their homes for b*** boats, Harleys, etc. is one of the big reasons for forclosure right now. Back to Weasel's rant though, It's become damn hard to get by for working people in America much less to build a few nice cars. I understand his frustration with the situation and I didn't mean to dismiss it. I wish I had the answers.
A big surprise about those oh so hated and reviled "goldchainers" is in store for you in the real world. A whole lot of those tattoed, chaps-wearing, dew-rag covered, HD-riding, rat-rod owning, traditional hotrod and custom collecting crowd are doctors and lawyers and Indian chiefs and butchers and bakers and yes even candlestick makers in disguise! Yep, the goldchainers have infilitrated the ranks of tradition, cycling and everything else. Can it be possible? Look here, the goldchainers you have so much against are the guys who have kept this hobby going for the last 40 years or so. Goldchainers are the guys who started the NSRA, which "saved" the hobby and old car industry. Goldchainers are the guys who kept Bonneville as Bonneville. Goldchainers are the guys who worked on their cars themselves for years, started and made successes of many of the old car businesses in parts and fabrication. Goldchainers have been the heart of the business and the hobby 'cause they earned the wherewithall to MAKE IT HAPPEN and DID! Sure, there are the newbies in the goldchainer ranks who just bought their cars, don't know anything about them, and don't care to. They just want to drive them and have fun while being "admired and worshipped", they think. Guess what? There are a whole lot of the no-chainers that just bought their cars, don't know and don't care to know anything about them and just want to drive their cars and be "admired and worshipped" too! It's a cross section of the American pie, the hot rod and automotive/cycle world we have here. Enjoy it for your own reasons and don't get jealous, one day YOU may be standing in Jared's looking at gold chains and thinking, "Well, why not, I can afford it!". By the way, the gold chain thing is a holdover from the Disco era. You should be happy they gave up the polyester and platform shoes OR that's what YOU would be wearing today! HAHHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHAH And always remember the rich who are smart don't let economic problems affect them too much, it is the little guys who lose their hobby to pay the rent and the heating bills and the kids dentist, it is not the landlord, heating oil distributor or dentist. Don't wish ill on anyone except the s*** who hoodwink and cheat the foolish and gullible.
BRAVO There is nothing wrong with borrowing on a home equity loan to build a hot rod as long as your smart enuff not to get in over your head.. I did it quite a while ago .. It was cheap interest and i knew exactly when id have everything payed back. No i didnt go the 15 or 30 years i payed it off early and that was my plan... I could have done it other ways but the low interest and also deductable interest was inviting and it worked.. The bottom lone is you gotta be smart . even the rich borrow money... Ill never get the gold chain stuff... Some people have more money than others and prefer to do things differently bit that doesnt make them bad people. Dave
Isn't this how the "restorers" and "hot rodders" came to hate each other...sounds like another go-round of the same old story: "Us" vs "Them", "Haves" against "have-not", rich vs poor, ad ifinitum... How can people carry around so much jealousy and hate and still live a life...??? R-
I don't think the economic situation will be the biggest threat... I think being legislated off the streets will be the biggest problem... Ain't nobody gonna build nuthin', no how if you can't actually DRIVE it someplace... Even $10,000 is gonna seem kinda steep for a garage decoration that takes up 7'x15' feet of floor space. The fewer car guys there are of every ilk, the fewer voices there are to protest attacks on the hobby by "enviromentalists*" who believe that we should roll back the clock on earth to 1952 B.C. We should never try to discourage anybody from building, or having a car built, no matter style it is. The more the merrier. * The kind that think the human beings are the scourge of the planet.
I'd like to chime in here, there are some vaild points being made, but the one thing that stuck out to me as i was reading is that IF the "gold-chainers" as they're being called decide to pull out of this hobby it will yet again put good hardworking talented americans out of business. in a world where everything is shipped overseas to be manufactured quickly and cheaply; we still have rod builders that can [regardless of your personal style] build amazing cars blending technologies of new and old right here at home. regardless of your personal stance on billet or 'bought rods' or anything like that i don't think anyone can disagree that some of these high end builders build amazing pieces of machinery. that blowfish cuda that troy built that ran a couple hundred miles an hour on the salt with a turbo'd 4 mopar 4 banger? amazing. the one thing we cant afford to lose is good honest american labor. the end of the world? legislating away the use of something old. I'm sure people are familiar with the switch to digital TV broadcasting; 10's of 1,000's of 'old' perfectly functional TV's are suddenly worthless (unless you buy the converter box... clever) because they don't pick up the new signal. The possible amount of waste produced by this just boggles my mind. If we're trying to be such a 'green' society why is it so hard to just use what you have? It's all a marketing scam. if cars go the same way we're going to be in a lot of trouble. sorry for the rant.
When did it become an offence to be wealthy and have a kool car Isn't that part of the American dream Paul
What started in the hot rodding world - traditional style, old school, rat rod, back to basics, low buck, building a car within your means, build it with what ya got, etc, - the style of cars that takes imagination, blood sweat and tears, instead of big money, has now come full circle in the way we live. As an experienced poorboy, I have no issues with this way of life. You sleep so much better when life is simple. Plus, you have no need for alarm clocks. I love it. Mikey www.MikeysPinstriping.co0m "I Do Bad Things to Money"
Weasel ... thanks for this thread ... I may not agree with your logic ... but I appreciate your p***ion ... and I am enjoying reading everyone's opinions on the topic ... we don't all have to agree ... but it's nice to finally see some civil discussion on the HAMB without all the name-calling ... this is partly what a message board like the HAMB should be all about ... Damn, did I just say that? ... strike that, the HAMB isn't the "Oprah Book Club" for Hot Rodders! ... now back to our regularally scheduled program ... damn gold-chainers! ... damn tractor grille shells, iron crosses & spiderwebs!
Thanks for this. I hadn't put my biking together with my car thing but my best riding buddies, hard drinking, hard...very hard riding, hard partying guys have an average annual income of about $250k. I hadn't really thought of it til you mentioned it because they are just guys...friends to me and we seldom, if ever, discuss wages and buying stuff. Many of the great car guys I know now are rich, love their cars and treat them well, be they Street Rodder (ack..yes, I did say it) or Hot rodders or just muscle car guys. One of the best, nicest guys I know is on a mission to have 52 cars in his freshly built (he built it with is hands and with friends help) shop/storage. On the other hand, I know ***holes who are poor, rich, and middle income too.
this is one "WEIRD" post!! i guess i dont even know what a gold chainer is!? anyone with a super straight shiny red car? anyone who spent some money on their vehicle? anyone that owns/drives a deuce? people with billet on their cars? do they wear gold chains on their wrists, necks or both or? anything that looks like it might have cost some money on their vehicle makes them a chainer? --what ???? -- i dont know?! "im not afraid of these so called gold chainers whomever they are!" what happens when they show up, do they steal your wives/girl friends? do they steal all the attention from your cars? they wont stop & help out if your broke down at midnight sittin along side the road? i dont get it?????????? is traditional taking over the WHOLE car hobby? do i have to sell my chevelle i love & have had for 28 yrs. & dig something out of a hole somewhere, hack & whack, dig & scrounge, get it going with an antique obsolete motor in it & skinny little bias ply tires or im not cool or what?? i really really like traditional BUT there are other styles i like equally as well & im not giving any of them up. ive liked all this stuff including traditional long >>>LONG before the HAMB came around! If there are going to be rules lets start eliminating vehicles/members of this board that DO NOT meet the qualifications of a "Traditional vehicle!"
I like to build things myself in the cheap old fashioned way, here is a pic of the SBF in my Track T: But I also get payed to build high end billet ridden cars too. Here is a pic of the engine in a '68 Chevy C-10 I am building for a customer. There is more money in the stainless steel lines and plumbing on this truck than there is in my whole car, but it is still an 8-71 blown, 502 big block powered truck that will shread the 18" wide tires at any speed, idle all day in 100 degree heat with the A/C on and stop, steer and handle like a new truck, plus it gathers a crowd anywhere it visits. Is it a Hot Rod- YES, would I own one just like it-YES!! It takes all types in this hobby.
The switch to digital from ****og broadcasting has nothing to do with the FCC wanting folks to buy new TV set and everything to do with digital takes up less bandwidth then ****og therefore more frequencies will be available now for more channels and it's actually the consumer that is demanding more and more programing. I can't remember what the ratio is off the top of my head but it's like 10 to one or something like that, for every one ****og station that we (cable company) no longer carry, we will be able to subs***ute 10 other channels in it's place. Yep, just what the consumer wants.....more mindless TV programming.
The Jalopy Journal
