If the body came from the factory with waves or some overspray or door gaps that weren't within .005" all the way round, who are you to say its shoddy work? I'd hate like hell to be a car salesman and see you walk into the showroom.
fact is many of those cars have enough points even WITH the flaws to kick some serious ***! I judged for years and damn near every car has a weak spot
Is it possible that some guys have gone to big shows, noticed the flaws and then decided to build a show car themselves. After a while they built more cars, imperfect, but better than the last while honing thier skills and reaching for what the judges gave points for. Maybe those same guys have had their creations win shows, get featured then work as business cards to the well heeled trophy lover so they can build high dollar cars, all somewhat imperfect. Do you think those guys ***** about flaws at pebble beach?
Forget the car, you need a couple layers of gravel on the driveway Spectators are in a different cl*** then the actual players. What seems easy from the comfort of your sofa, or 15 minutes at a car show, is actually very difficult to execute. Like a bad jump shot, or getting tackled on a prefectly planned play, it only counts if you score enough points over the compe***ion at the buzzer. If you don't like sports that have scores, stick to the local burger stand, jiffy wash, and turtle wax...
I worked for G.M.***embly division in Fremont during the late 70's. We built Monte Carlos, Buick Regals, El Caminos, and full size trucks. (The trucks were a separate line which had been named as highest quality of division. truthfully the trucks were put together much better than the cars!) It didn't take long for me to be able to pick out all the defects in any new car: poor panel fit, uneven body gaps, misaligned trim, interior and exterior, poor paint. Of course I would never point them out to a proud new car owner! My Dad was amused by guys spending so much effort fixing up an old car, " Why do they try to get them perfect? They weren't perfect when they were first built!
It was called "customized" when I was a kid. Any slob could polish a turd, but some people (not me) would spend a month on door gaps, metalflake, rainbow dust, etc, etc, so that their car was "custom" and personalized. I know a lot of Dad's who shook their head at sons who took the hubcaps off, and chromed the wheels. They didn't get it then, they still don't get it today. "Because it's fun, and keeps me off drugs for an hour Dad."
Whenever I look at a car, I am attracted to the things I like. Function before Bling. A door that don't fit catches my eye before a run or smudge in the paint. Superficial criticism of superficial flaws? Not.
I've seen a ton of cars at Lowrider Super Shows and shows like that, that I've seen in Magazines or that have a ton of trophies around them but looking at them I wonder how the hell they even got a second look the first time around. Most of the cars that win do so because they have more mods than the other car, have the little extras and have the things that add up in points, not because they are the cleanest. I dont know the exact layout of points on a show slip as I am sure it varys from show to show but I dont think those little things that you mentioned are even on the list most of the time
i used to beat myself to DEATH over my work because in pictures everything looks so darn nice and perfect and i strive to do the absolute best job i can. that was until i started to look CLOSE.... every paint job has some little flaw that you look at and say... "man, how'd they miss THAT" or "how did they let THAT p***"????? some small wave or small patch of peel or a spot where the polish didn't come out even... or i'll look at a super prime striping job and see minor imperfections that i would kick myself over... then i realized that its just part of the work. it actually makes me feel better about myself knowing that things that bug me are par for the course for well respected, well paid professionals. i still strive to do the absolute best i can do, but i realize that there is no perfection. EVERY car is a 5 footer at best. my wife put it into perspective for me... i was nit picking a rather beautiful car. it was a nice piece but i could see every single little thing wrong in the paint and bodywork. she looks at me and says... "only you would notice that stuff, the rest of us just see a beautiful car". all that aside, i believe that at the AMBR/Riddler, there is no excuse. the point is to have THE most well executed piece of work imaginable. for everything else, i say, if the owner let it go, he must be pleased enough. better for him if the judges look past it too. that 58 earned it hands down because of the OVERALL execution. i was so taken by all the engraving and little detail stuff that i didn't have time to notice shoddy body work.
Eberyting me bildz iz perfekt. Phlaw aint in me vokabuelarry. If ya'll seez a phlaw. I waznt theer. Tha dam bodyguyz dun it. I payz lotsa bukz ta getz me ridez perfekt. I hatez tha dam kritikz. All ya'll iz a hurd of dam kritikz..
I think the "in a too big a rush to finish it" comment probably nailed it for a lot of a lot of rigs from some of those done in a driveway under a sycamore tree to those that are knocked out in the high zoot rod shops. Around this area there are some kids who can lay some beautiful metalflake paint but have never had a long board in their hands and may not know what one looks like. How many of us let our primer "cure" for weeks or even months before putting on the final coats anymore like guys I knew used to do.
Common as ticks on a hound. Now lets move onto bigger and better things like uh how can I make my own car better than that and not have time to show it because I'm too busy driveing it?
I completely relate and understand how the original thread starter feels. I am very **** with details and bodywork myself. I also have yet to see a super straight Impala especially the rear quarters. What I think happens is some guys use the DA with the wrong grit and too much pressure causing the sheetmetal to warp. Then once the they prime and do a quickie block sand it may look Ok until they dump 10 coats of clear on the basecoat. I also think the Repop metal from <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comffice:smarttags" /><st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1lace w:st="on">Taiwan</st1lace></st1:country-region> is terrible out of the box but most body guys figure its a new piece and doesnt need much work, this is how they treat modern collision repair. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o> </o> Another thing I see in custom cars mostly from the 30-50s is that granted lots of custom body parts were hand formed which is great but if they arent welded in properly or finished off, loading the seams with BONDO isnt the answer. Wasnt brazing and lead the right way back in the day? Well it can still be done. Choosing the right builder and shop is key but also very difficult because of everyones perception of quality work. So if your spending 100K-300K on a build I would also expect these basic rule of thumb flaws to be non existant. <o> </o> I have come to realize that these cars stock or modified were never perfect and we should all be lucky to have these great pieces of history in our possession. Hey 50-70 years of abuse on ourselves with multiple owners (wives) would sure start to reveal lots of flaws in us right? Ha ha ha
Like i said earlier ,as long as they are driven and cared for by an owner that loves them they are cool to me.Its just funny how people see cars in magazines and ***ume they are flawless.When you see those same cars under artifitial light or in the sunrise or sunset you see flaws.I dont ever bash on anyones car especially if they built ,unless they are bad mouthing other peoples **** .Like i said i can find a handfull of flaws in any car if i look hard enough ,but i dont because i know what it takes to do body work.My 56 is no exception .Its nice ,but its not flawless (to me even though the average idiot at a redlight thinks it is).I did the bodywork on it and it looks great for the most part ,but it has some tiny waves here and there .Its a driver anyway.Its funny the day i brought it home from being painted ,every idiot on my block stopped by to pick it to death.I told my wife to look at them out the window and she laughed.They were on their hands and knees trying to catch the sun reflecting off of it at the right angle ,trying to find something.Then they pointed them out to me like i didnt know .Its just human nature i guess to find flaws in things .Welcome to the real world ...
I guess that means nobody's perfect. I'm not, my cars aren't, and nobody elses is either. I just try to the best I can, given my skills and what I know, if that isn't up to somebody elses, well, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. Particularly when I look at the stuff THEY have built, or are driving. Ninety nine times out of a hundred, the critic is hack. "Judge not, lest ye be judged". I read that somewhere...
I get my body work and paint done because I hate doing it and it doesn't always turn out as expected .A painter friend spent two days prepping a show car that the owner said was ready to spray and he (the painter) still wasn't happy with the results and the owner didn't pay for the extra work.
I like to sit back and watch when my truck is parked. Blend into the crowd and see what people pick apart. It is funny to listen.( My truck was totaly built at home and at my trailer shop. Everything but trans,shortening rearend,and louvers was done by me and i drive the **** out of it.) If it isent perfect who cares. The guy's cicking things apart usualy dont have a car near as nice as the car they are picking apart. Or even a rod at all. And to the point of the original question yes all cars have flaws. Look fore the beauty not the flaws.
At least these cars made it to the paint stage. I'm tired of looking at flat black and tinted primer cars (with $$$ of pinstriping) as settling for "good enough". As for show cars and getting ink in magazines; let's face it, some names will get the spotlight no matter what they build.
Its all adout having fun. My nicely fit finish and painted truck was no more fun than my latest flat finish truck. My next may get nice fit-finish may not. Eather way flaws and all it will be fun.
unless your a bodyman most people dont know what there looken at and i dont care how much time you spend on your body work there is not any material out there that dont shrink so get use to seeing flaws in paint a year down the road ..
Thats the problem, everyone who has no idea the amount of hours of sanding and finishing involved in a near perfect paintjob are thre first people to point out flaws. Every paintjob has some sort of flaw somewhere, I can write a list on every one I've done. They occur because as you spend countless hours on a certain car, perfecting little things that the public won't ever notice, the slightly more obvious things can get overlooked. Ever realize that sometimes a fresh set of eyes can point out the obvious? Before you go around with your head held high at an Autorama or WOW, try painting a near perfect show car.
I doubt if anything 'snuck' past the judges. True car judges, as it is with men that appreciate women, add up the points that they like, the attributes, and toss the negative. Anybody that dwells on the negative will never be a good judge of cars, or women. "Spectator" judges are a dime a dozen. We all are, but when I look, it's more enjoyable to search out the good. He, he, like they think that's a point for negotiating! I was selling a 1984 Toyota Pickup in about 1987, still clean as a pin. Original paint and all. One guy wanted it real bad, but commented that "with that orange peel paint" the price should come down" That's when I came up with my favorite saying when selling something at swaps, works good and don't seem to run the sincere buyer off. My comeback to the petty picking is; "Talk is cheap, what to do, is get a stack of bills, start laying them out and when you get to a point that turns me on, I'll lay down the ***le, pick up your 'firm offer', and walk away!" This brings the discussion full circle, where the facts are, in the art of horse trading cheap talk is,, well, cheap. Hard cash is the only language that counts.
The Jalopy Journal
