Pontiac an Orphan

So do you own a SAAB (a GM product) or a Subaru? Do you know what you own?

72 Le Mans emits less emissions that a new anything? Are you on Crack? Seriously. Detroit didn't get screwed by the EPA, every manufacturer had to meet the same emissions law regardless of where they were made. What the hell are you talking about?

The US cars of today are FAR Superior to anything Detroit made in 1974

First where are all those old imports? When was the last time you saw a 1972 Civic on the road? How about an early Celica, or anything that said B210? Those were some of the worst built cars ever, they have all rusted out and returned as recycled Toyota and Nissan's of today.
The reason cars have 20 cup holders and DVD players is because John Q. Public gets interviewed in Focus Groups and this is the crap they ask for.

 

actually there are a lot of these old imports on the road still, you would be suprised. I don't hate american cars in any way, i just don't like what the corporate boardrooms seem to think I will want. I will buy one when they come back out with a back to basics one.

 

let me edit this post, actually i'm looking for a 69 buick special deluxe to come around, everytime i see a good one something happens and the funds aren't there. I love these cars, grew up riding in one. someday. I just don't want people thinking i don't like american cars when i do.
just not a lot of the newer ones. we had a buick just like the one in the pic,dog dish hub caps the entire deal,don't know all the details but one of my relatives had changed the motor to an olds 455 rocket motor. I don't know the entire story, but i know it was fast. I was just a kid. it got passed down to my parents, I remember my mom being terrified to drive the thing. northern ohio winters got it though, bottom of the car looked like it had been dipped in acid, quarters gone,frame gone,trunk floor, everything. no saving that one. I really am sad that all these makes are gone, but the fact is people weren't buying the cars, and instead of finding out why,they just kept cranking out the same things. making cars is a buisness, you can't keep filling the stores with products people aren't buying, or you will go out of buisness. they have had decades to fix the problems, but kept dragging their feet.

 

enough of the imports are superior statements allready!!!! Yep, Im back on my soapbox again.....

After a few posts of "real life" experiences at cant hold my tongue another minute...As for the statement about Old Imports....RARELY do I see ANYthing older than 1990, on occaision youll see a 260 Z or a late 80s Celica but thats about it.....And I dont recall hearing about the 72 Corolla found setting in a Barn, have you, NO, 'cause NOBODY CARES.....these cars were used and abused and rusted and crushed....they were cheap and they were easy to work, but rusted bad, must have been using the same steel as the Vega...Think about it, they were competing with small car america.....Not the bread and butter 4 dr sedans. And crash tests....put you 70-80s corolla up against any big 3 four door, yep Id fell safe too.

Just like other news, the media portrays whats better in "thier" opinion, and that leads to this percieved notion that imports have less problems, I dont knwo why, but its true, maybe like every other industry in the world they are run by $$$$$....

for instance, if an american car company has a recall its front page top of the hour news, if an import does its buried back on page d-7 and you may see a scrolling blurb on the bottom of the tv. Did you see any "real" coverage of Toyota recalling trucks ddue to frame rust? maybe you did, maybe you didnt.....but everyone knows about every other recall any American car company has had, just pick a make and you can come up with one.
I grew up in a family where Chevy was the only make to have(even though my father owned a very cool 57 Fairlane droptop prior to my birth). I was outcast by my father with the purchase of a 65 Fairlane after owning a 68 RS camaro.....even though at that time he drove a toyota diesel truck to work. We later worked that out. Anyway, I wrenched on my neglected Ford and even helped a few guys I ran with, we all owned American cars.....thru the years I have worked at various dealerships, Ford, Dodge, Chevy, Mitsubishi, Toyota, Mercury, Hyundai, Mercedes, Porsche, and VW. Both as a tech and a service writer. They all have JUNK, some less than others, some due to lack of maintenance, some due to piss poor design, and some due to pisspoor quality.
In the late 80s the Toyota was the easiest car to repair as a tech....less emissions BS to deal with, you all know what I mean, when you lifted the hood you could actualy see the engine, not a jungle of hoses wires and electronics. Now, not too much difference between Japanese and American makes, hell half the time you cant even see the spark plugs!
Fact, the alternator for my Daughters Eagle Talon(mitsubishi Eclipse) was $400, the alternator for my Dodge Omni $72, this was several years ago.
Fact, my taurus has nearly 300,000(yes thats right) miles on it and has only had 1 major issue, trans needed rebuilt, at 200,000 and its still dependable.
Fact, if you beat the hell outta your car, or, dont maintain it, be prepared to pay the consequences when the time comes, dont blame the auto maker for building junk.

My stepson thinks that Hondas are the greatest thing since sliced bread, even though nothing we have has ever had any major problems....why, because he beleives his fathers judgement is better, his father has had several NEW hondas, and hasnt had any issues...while his Mom and I have used cars that may have....My suburban had a cracked head, and her sable needed a rack&pinion, both of which were boght used, and who knows how they were maintained(And I beat the hell outta the sub, speeds above 60, towing, stump pulling, junkyard crawling etc etc etc). BUT, I didnt pay $30k for the 2 cars combined....$3200 for the sub, ad I think she paid $11k for the sable when it was 2 years old. AND THAT IS ALL THAT WENT WRONG, sounds like $$$$ in the bank to me....

I dont know what an automaker gets paid, and I dont care, why is it thier fault??? They were hired to do a job, and at the time they accepted it, they were given a rate of pay, no different than you or I. Do thy make too much, hell I dont know, but I think Politicians make too much.
Is it because of the Unions, hell I dont know, Im not in one, I do know that they stood behind my dad when he was hurt on the job due to another employees negligence. And that as an organization they get a chunk of $$$.


Its easy to find fault in anything, just depends on how you spin it. But you, the car owner, must take some responsibility, if you DONT maintain your own car.
A $40 oil change is cheaper than a $8000 engine(parts and labor).... a $70 fuel filter is cheaper than a $700 fuel pump(parts and labor)........

I agree with others on the board, dont percieve how good a brand is based on here say........I hear lots of things but make my decisions based on my life expierences and facts....

I hate to see Pontiac go, I hate to see any US Icon go, but, as I said before Im part of the problem, I DONT BUY NEW, I buy old and drive it.......

 

Hey Guys,
Here's your chance to pick up an inexpensive ugly duckling "runabout". Drop that sucker, add wide whites, horizontal bar grill and fender skirts and it's not half bad!
Peace,
Chaz

 

I hate to see Pontiac go to, but agree that real pontiacs haven't been made since the late 70's when they had a REAL Pontaic motor in them. As far as letting the big three fail, or any "big business" as far as that goes (banks included) I say let them go! Their will always be a need, so there will always be someone supplying! Did the government bail out Auburn? how about Cord? what happened to Willy's, Kaiser, Whippet etc. etc.? When they failed, another one filled the gap! It sucks for the employees, (I was working for a downstream supplier, unemployed now) but people will manage, and other jobs will come along. The problem I see is the government puting so many environmental caps on everything, that they are sending jobs overseas where no one gives a damn so it is MUCH cheaper to manufactuer anything! Not saying the environment isn't important, (without it where would we be able to hunt all those tasty animals!)but, chasing manufacturing to someplace that doesn't give a s$%t about it doesn't help the environment either!
As for me, I think my next new car will be a '32 Vicky built by ME, so I know the quality and where it was built! (maybe I'll have to shoe horn an old Poncho motor in it for the hell of it!)

 

i can see where this thread is going,so i will push it over the edge.UNIONS AND GREEDY CEOS ARE THE BLAME FOR THE AUTO INDUSTRIES GOING BELLY UP.THEN WE GET A BUNCH OF IDIOTS VOTING JUST FOR "CHANGE".NOW WE ARE SEEING JUST WHAT "CHANGE" LOOKS LIKE.HOPE THEY ARE HAPPY.

next time you may want to listen to the right wing crazies instead.


ANYBODY WANT TO BUY A HYBRID/BIO-WHATEVER RETRO-KIT FOR YOUR HOT ROD? IT'S COMMING,JUST YOU WATCH!

help,i've fallen off my soap box.

-danny

 

I'll give my Pontiac a pat on the dash today. It now joins it's two Oldsmobile brothers in the garage as orphans. I'm accidently collecting orphan model lines, maybe I should go out and start looking for and AMC or Nash....

 

HAHAHA....nice one Danny ! Can't say I disagree what whay you are saying either !!

Well over here in OZ it more of the same. MB's reputation has been tarnished with some quality issues on NEW cars, mosly electrical issues. BMWs less so but they have had some issues as well. AUDI/VW is selling a lot of cars and perception on the market of them here is one of quality, as is Toyota.

Holden, Ford and Mitsu are doing it hard.....in fact it looks like theyre in the shit too. Not because the product is crap - the market here is way smaller and cheaper imports have taken a large slice of the market The three maufacturers based locally sell mostly mid size to larger cars which buyers have stepped away from due to perceived fuel economy issues as we are being ripped off by the Feds here for our fuel.

Holden is owned by GM and Ford by the Parent company in the US - they might be OK.

Mitusbishi here are screwed.

Rat

 

In many ways yes, but who give a crap, newer are cars are wicked gaytard.
Anything after '72 is dead to me, Mister Angrypants.

 

they spend way to much effort trying to make vehicles like ugly vans and sport vehicles because other manufacturers sold them. they lost their identity
long ago. losing the firebird, GTO and bonneville to sell ugly designed tin boxes to drive thru the forest. Please somebody just make cars again.

 

The old cash cow got milked to death. Blame everyone who "got milk".

 

The Solstice was'nt to bad,,and yeah after 73 or so it all went to shit..and the reason you see less imports is simply because of that they were imported and there were less to begin with.

I still see lots of old imports and american cars on the road around here,,its all also relative to where you live... No one forgein or US makes as good a car as they use to.

To many people want there living room in there car ,television,video games etc,,,i see some of these claims for the mileage some are boasting and remember the same adds for lil hondas back in the 70's

maybe a better car will come along out of all of this

but its 2009 and im still waiting for my hover car

 

Orginally posted by Hotroddork:


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Hey! I want one of those too!!!

I want the red ragtop model. Planning on sliding a Viper V 10 in between the frame rails. Drive shaft will be about 4" in length. With the built in MB roll cage, it will be like driving a V10 powered bowling ball.

The graphics have to go, I can only do flames.

Little Wing wrote:

Yeah, by this time I thought we would be in flying cars. Probably won't happen until the year after I die.

 

yeah, people treat cars like an appliance anymore, all kinds of features that have nothin to do with driving and more to make the drive like being home.
my dad would pile us into the car crank the windows down and go for a drive for the sake of driving, not as a time to talk on the cell phone , check e mails and watch movies, we went to the drive-in for that. I'm just gettin old and there is nothin new on the road that turns my head and makes me say I wish I had one of them.

 

Seems like we all have the same concerns about home family. This whole thing is rocking our world. We grew up hearing about how bad it was back then. I sure hope this isnt our turn. Hang on wait and we will all get to see the outcome. Hey its summer time to cruise.

 

johnny sparkle has a saabaru, too. it's a saab badged subaru sport wagon. he says it hauls ass...

 

i think the reason why we're losin all of our companies is because people are all about foreign cars and everything else foreign. i'm like if you like them so much move to their country. i don't think anyone anymore understands why it's a big deal. pisses me off.

 

sorry for making an off hot rod topic going on, but this really breaks my heart.
been drivin pontiacs for years. another tradition bites the dust.

 

thats just ignorance,,theres a whole world and were all in it ,,,and everyone has something to offer,,,so next time you want a slice of pizza move to another country,,,gezzzz


don't forget .. America is foreigners who came here ,,killed off the native people ,,then became hollier than thou. This country is made up of the cultures of other countries


the TRUE Americans got killed off

and most of them owned Mustangs ( lil horse joke there )

 

This thread is probably dead, but here goes:

Rule of business is supply and demand, and all of the big 3 made WAY too many cars. Ford especially.

Ford sold off a bunch of capital assets so they have cash to sit out of the bailout, and their plan is to keep making cars at the same pace in the hopes that GM and Chrysler will fail, and everyone will run back to Ford. I think it's a pipe dream considering I was seeing '08 models being loaded on truck to be brought back to Ford just about once a week for a while. It won't be long before Ford has it's hand out.

Chrysler is synonymous with shit and has been for years. S-H-I-T

Say what you will, but the Camaro/Firebird could have made GM money. They weren't competitively priced with the Mustang, which was the biggest rival, and carried a lot of Ford. They should have offered a mid-step model using the Vortec 4.8 V-8 and priced it at about 22-25K, instead of "you get either a wimpy V-6, or for an extra $15K, you can get the awesome one." Sorry, but a guy in his mid-twenties just out of college and making a little money STILL isn't going to drop $40K on something like that.

The big 3 makes ugly shit, and lame shit. The only thing I would consider buying for a new car from any of them is the new Malibu. It's a nice looking car. I'd also buy a new Chevy truck any day of the week.

I can't think of a single car that Pontiac has out right now that I'll miss. The G8 is cool, but c'mon.

The last *real* GM cars in my opinion were the G-bodies discontinued in '88.

Rick Wagoner can suck it.

 

the big shame is there is less and less originality and ingenuity in what we manufacture anymore. with the exception of APPLE and PC computers
we have less pride in things we make in the past decades in this country.
I don't really have a problem with cars made outside this country or the new move to alternative fuel vehicles. I think domestic auto manufactures have to
stop reinventing themselves and start continuing the same lines that make people want to look foward to the new models each year. APPLE can get people to wait in line for the next version of the I phone.
i guess people feel differently about whats in there driveway these days,
wheres the style and fun gone?
we'll be looking at the same pre 70's cars at car shows forever
because there will be nothing worth rebuilding

 

"wicked gaytard" Now there's an intelligent statement. How eloquent.

And why are you Mister Angrypants? Because you certainly weren't calling me that since I am not angry at all, just amazed at the complete utter ignorance displayed by so many on this particular thread and the ridiculous comments made.

 

You sir, are one of the good ones - well 'spoked'!!!
The meek may inherit the Earth, the the simple minded better wake the hell up.

 

Maybe we have a different idea of what angry sounds like.
Spreading knowlage is one thing, but beating people in the nuts with it....

~ Flatch U. Lator ~

 

WICKED GAYTARD!!!!!

That made me laugh.

 

You ever wonder why your Uncle Harry's '37 Pontiac was in such good condition and only had 45000 miles on it after 25 years?

He only paid $800 for it, but that was two years wages in those years. He knew that he had to make that car last and he only drove it out of necessity. He walked to the local stores and did most of his shopping within a mile of home. Taking the car out of the garage was a big outing. Uncle Harry even dressed for the occasion, putting on his 'going to town' clothes. The car was washed, polished, and serviced by himself before leaving the property. When he drove down the street, people said, 'there goes Harry driving into town".

In contrast today, who takes pride in how they look or how there cars appear; not too many. People pile the car full of kids and dogs without much as a thought of putting a blanket or seat cover down to keep the Slurpee syrup off the upholstery. Washing the old Pontiac consists of a two minute run-thru the car wash, with soap still running off the trunk lid as it roars down the freeway, known as a 'air rinse'. If an idiot light doesn't appear naggingly on the instrument cluster, then the car is still considered fully serviced. When you pull up to the shopping mall and bail out of the car, did you care if you hit the car next to you? Not very likely! You treat your $40000 investment like a piece-of-shit and you expect to have PRIDE OF OWNERSHIP like Uncle Harry.

And that my friends is what Uncle Harry's '37 Pontiac stood for.

 

yes sir, it takes about five years to own a new car now and people think you are crazy for servicing a car after five years. All my friends and I could identify every car and the year on the road that passed when i was little.
My uncle only brought chevys, my other uncle only dodge and my dad only pontiac and never got sick of arguing why to each other.
NO PRIDE IN ANYTHING ANYMORE is why there will be no more new bonnevilles after decades.

 

It's a sad time to to be am autojunkie living in Detroit...

 

Buick is selling well and so is GMC, unbelievably enough even though most of them are nearly identical to Chevrolet, the average idiot SUV buyer thinks they're upscale.

Now why they can't just be models of Chevrolet or Cadillac I have no idea, but that's why GMC is not being dropped.

It's rather surprising to me that they'd drop Pontiac, it seems to me they're just grasping at straws at this point and picking the brand that sells the least cars in the continued attempt to cut their way to profitablility - except that it takes money to make money and if Pontiacs aren't selling as well it seems to me the thing to do is change them so they do sell well.

A bunch of the road course racers will get boned with this move, since some of the prototype cars are badged as Pontiac powered and some of the GT classes have all Pontiac teams running.


And the fact that Saturn can't make money shows that the real problems have nothing to do with the cars, it's the overhead costs they have to deal with because of all the union benefits, federal requirements, and so on. GM has something like $2000 more invested in building a car before they sell it than say Toyota. Saturns aren't hot rods, but they're damned good cars for basic transportation, as good as Hondas or Toyotas, I've known of a number of them that have been dead reliable for hundreds of thousand miles and more than 10 years of driving, even with the living crap beaten out of them.