History Miller Race Car Chassie Pictures/Info?

Here is the poor man's Miller replica, I build. Have a look........

http://macmillersgarage.webs.com/

 

Bare chassis photos are very difficult to find. I agree with above posts that if you are serious, get a hold of Miller Dynasty and inquire about drawings available through Gordon White etc. as posted on www.milleroffy.com.

 

Attached is a quick Rhino3D sketch of the frame of a Miller 91 rear drive. Viewed from the top, the rails are straight.

I included two tubular crossmembers at the ends of the rails, but I don't know what the other crossmembers looked like. One of the photos shows what appears to be a casting.

The front springs ran under the rails. The rear springs were outboard of the rails. A gas tank was nested between the deep part of the rails, toward the rear.

The top flange of the rails is shown in the photos of RD 122s as much wider along the body than I have indicated here. It appears to me this flange may be part of the rails or -- perhaps equally likely -- the wide top flange may be an overlay of sheet metal, essentially bodywork. John

 

After referring to a couple of books, I found a photo of the chassis of Frank Lockhart's 1927 Miller 91. In these frames, it appears the frame rails are actually contoured to conform to and help provide mounting points for the bodywork.

Front and rear crossmembers were spring mounts. The second crossmember was the fixing point for one arm of the scissors type front shock absorber. The third crossmember, shown in the center photo above, secured the "spider" front motor mount typical of Miller/Offenhauser engines. It also seems to provide mounting studs for the radiator.

From photos supplied by Miller91, below, it appears to me there were two tubular rear crossmembers shaped to support the upper gas tank, positioned just in front of and just behind the differential. These two tubes are shaped something like inverted "U"'s.

Some views from a Rhino3D sketch of the left frame rail are attached. The upper rail has a vertical flange that runs along the length of the body. Apparently the bodywork was affixed to this flange.

Custom chassis fabrication is discussed on the net. Here is one source I found with Google.

http://www.roadstershop.com/chassis/chassis/menu-id-660/

See also the postings below re Miller frames from Norby at Last Refuge Hot Rod.

John

 

For what they're worth, some photos. The original frame rails were generally hand-formed-real blacksmith stuff.

 

bttt

 

Hi! I make all the chassis castings for the 91/122 type chassis, we also make the frames, I may be doing a post on frame building using this frame . we also do Bugatti frames.
Norb
Last Refuge Hotrod

 

Please do- that would be a fantastic thread!!!

 

I built this car about 10 years ago along the lines you are talking about. The Rails are made from Miller drawings but the spring brackets are 27 Chevy. The cowl section of the body was made on english wheel and was a lot easier than it looks, The tail was from an old circle track car with Pikes Peak history. Pics are from Barrett Jackson auction. This was car number 4 in a line of handbuilt speedster/ racers that I built. Most were four bangers but this Flathead V8 with long exhaust tubes on both sides was a big winner. No mufflers, sounded great. If any one knows where it is now let me know. Note Millerized front axle that was fabricated from tubing to look like a Miller front axle but accept Ford spindles. That let me use regular Ford hubs, brakes and wheels. ANYONE can afford to build this chassis, infact if I remember most of the stuff was discarded (free) from a "StreetRod" build. I have a model B motor and some parts laying around for a similar build. This time I want to use the Miller castings instead of the Chevy parts. Dash profile was from Miller/Ford two man Indy car. Grill shell modified Plymouth or Pontiac.

 

Yes you should, a very valuable contribution that would be!

 

Here are some scans of the Chassis during construction, This was before I started my shop so it is in the lobby of a Hotel I am restoring. Had to weld outside next to the street, wood floors and all. Apologies for picture quality, this was pre digital age for me.

 

Another one, Featuring 4 by 4 VROOM VROOM seat

 

Last picture on this car, can see Fabricated Miller/Forderized front axle, Dont recomend it unless you are a really good welder, A Bare tube axle with spring flanges from Speedway would be just fine. I wish I had better pics of headers they had little elbows welded on to curve up so that pipe went straight out to back, Burnt elbow, could have used that woven Asbestos cloth,didnt know about it back then.

 

This is my race car. It's got a narrowed and shortned 1928/29 Essex frame. The engine is a Ford Model B, topped with a Miller Hi Speed OHV.





This is the car, in its "all together", at speed

 

Levi... Here are some pics of a Miller 91 Built by Chuck Davis in the 90's. He pretty much built everything new. Chuck started me off on this path and I am sad to say he is no longer with us, Great man!! I am going to dissect the chassis for you.

 

Starting with the front view, you can see the beautiful axle made from castings machined and welded onto a steel tube. Chuck told me that he made a mistake and didnt put a core in the original patterns and had to drill through a 3 inch diameter casting with a 2 inch diameter drill, He was just learning. Brakes are mechanical and cable driven, You can see cable at bottom of Axle end going into backing plate. Front crossmembers included a crank mt. that doubles as shock pivot. I remember reading somewhere that the guys would fill the axle with wood to cut vibration over the bricks. Chuck couldnt find correct Balloon tires so he shaved down some street Firestones to get desired look. Grille made from many 1/8 welding rods.

 

Very cool Norby, thanks for this. Keep posting.

Cris

 

Hi- glad to see you interest in Harry Miller racing cars- you can purchase most all of the drawings of Miller/ offy cars from Gordon White- I have a copy of his catalogue but a lot of them are listed on the Miller offy site- he can be found at the Miller/offy site that someone sent you- I have his catalogue which has over 5000 original drawings by Leo Goosen who was the draftsman first for Miller, then Offenhauser and then Meyer and Drake almost to the end of Drake Goosen Sparks. The beauty of these vehicles is they were hand built out of sheet aluminum. Most of the Miller bodies were formed by Myron Stevens- I have a video of his which shows him at 80 years old forming the top of the rad shell of a 1926 Miller- the video is still available- Gordon White is a great guy to talk to and has written quite a few books on Miller and offenhauser-his email is available at the Miller Offy Historical society site- as you can see I am a great Miller fan -fell in love with them on my first visit to the Indy 5oo museum and have never been the same- a friend of mine is in the process of building all the patterns for the Miller 220 engine to reproduce them- you can also access Zakiras garage in Cincinati -hope this helps Chuck

 

The next part to discuss is the front spring horn, has a pocket core to accept 1 3/4 spring. I think its important to find an old time spring shop that can grind tapers on spring, More expensive but worth the trouble. you can also see the hand crank casting over 1 inch tube DOM. On this frame, front spreader bar has its own flange, later cars went through spring bolt. (less weight). Nice details of Axle, note bottom spring flange, each side has 7 degree tilt opposite direction. Chuck made an insert in the pattern that could be unscrewed and flipped to make a Left or a Right part.

 

Next picture is the second spring carrier, we are working our way to the back of the car. These castings are silica bronze. may have been cast steel originally. Your judgement here. You can see brake cable entering Axle end and some details like spring shackles etc.

 

Wow! Some cool stuff presented in this thread. These Miller racers are mechanized porn for sure!

 

And here is my " Mac Miller" body on a T frame for the Newport Hill Climb .
Best piece of fiberglass i have ever seen and i hate fiberglass !!!

 

On the left side we have the fuel pump and steering. The link at the bottom right that is headed toward rear axle is the radius rod, Fancy spring loaded spherical ends that could have a thread of their own. Steering was mounted higher in first fitting, then a blockoff plate was added. Chuck later filled the hole with a welded patch and re did the lower flange. Air pumps were used instead of fuel pumps to pressurize tank and cause fuel to flow. Hood straps are little bronze castings that found thier way onto Sprints and Midgets well into the 60's.

 

On the right side is the hand brake, and opposite radius rod. The little ball on handle is legendary as it is hollow! Miller cast it with a core. The exhaust is on this side. I Love the little rivets. Handle was made just thick enough not to break.

 

Rear Spring front carrier, lower shackle pivot goes through frame like a big bolt. Shackles allow spring to move front and back. This set up requires radius rods. Flange on axle allows axle to rotate preventing spring bind.

 

Last picture, shows rear spring mt, Old timers called it the dumbiron. view of shocks and mounting points, friction shocks are repros too. Bottom rod under axle is a truss. Rear brake cable visible also. Hope these pics answer a few questions.

 

Very helpful - can you explain why rear radius rods are needed with rear parallel leafs?

"Rear Spring front carrier, lower shackle pivot goes through frame like a big bolt. Shackles allow spring to move front and back. This set up requires radius rods. Flange on axle allows axle to rotate preventing spring bind."

 

The way the rear springs are set up they are free to move forward and backward. Regular cars mount one end solid and let the springs move axle forward and back as it goes over bumps. This works OK in an open driveline because driveshaft slides in and out of trans taking up the travel caused by the difference in arcs (springs vs driveshaft). With a torque tube driveline, The rear axle moves in its own arc,if you tied one end of the spring solid it would bind. Allowing both ends of the spring to move solves this problem. The radius rods help the torque tube transfer load and keep the rear wheels straight. The Radius rods usually pivot near the trans Ujoint (front to back distance) so that every thing moves in the same arc. In my Low buck special, I used the original Ford arms that connect to torque tube, this should work for low speeds and power. Side to side forces should be kept to a minimum.

 

Many thanks for these photos and explanations. Did Chuck Davis install a Miller 91 engine in this car? I notice in the background of the first photo, in the garage, a couple of Miller/Offenhauser engines. Anyway. This car is a masterpiece. Seems like it would probably be harder to faithfully re-create a machine like this than it was to create it in the first place.

 

BB Ford trucks used this same arrangement with the "dumb-iron" spring mount/floater and the parallel leaf springs shackled on both the front and back of the leaf. however, the radius rods on the BB's instead triangulated to the torque tube.