Welcome JrStk 70. Funny, I just came across this a couple nights ago. I had to dig it out and post it. April '72 Hot Rod
Guys, I have come back as 61 Pontiac. The site will not let me login as Jr. Stocker Racer 70! Have no pics of the 61. Didnt think to take any. Was always working on the car or working my job. I worked at a Sunoco gas station. I was the youngest guy there and everyone had a new muscle car that either worked there or hung out! Never even took a trophy from all the wins either. I liked the $5.00 you got for the class win each weekend instead of the hardware. It was a 2-dr sedan. The same color green as Truman Fields Firebird. Had Buick Rivera chrome wheels on the front and stock "BLUE" rims on the rear. Now that the Bananna Peel is a part of history I can say I was a guy that made passes in that car along with some great racers! I remember that news artice on Pauls 60 wagon as well. Paul was always a real nice guy as well. I was envious of all the guys that had nice 55-57 Chevy's. I had my 210 Sport Coupe apart and dreaming of the day I would get it to the track. The 61 wasnt the nicest car around but it worked great and had all the top of the line parts and latest tricks at the time. Halfway thru the summer of 70 we pulled the engine and went thru it. The man that owned the car went as far as to buy a set of Duffy's pistons with the teflon buttons on them! He did fairly well with the PEEL off and on. The 60 Wagon he bought that ran N/SA just never cut it. I believe it had what he called a slim-jim trans with a fluid coupling high gear shift that took all day! Chuck Norton or one of you west coast guys might know where and who owned that car. I just know it came from Cal. Supposedly it won a big race maybe in 68 or 69. I cant remember what he said. It was solid orange with a white top and no lettering when Jim Kopp had it. Man what a tank it was to drive!
The 60 Pontiac was the ex Forys and Douglas car that won the 1967 Winternationals. It had a jetaway tranny, 1960's never had slip jims.
We discussed earlier on how NHRA allowed mild customizing in the stock classes back in the 60's and here's some examples, but the Forys & Douglas Pontiac almost looks like it has a "bug cover" for a grille. Tony, Gary or Chuck, any of you guys remember if this was the case?
Along the same lines, who was it that bolted a huge Chevrolet Bowtie to the front bumper of their 56 wagon to deflect air up, into, and through the grill to feed cooler/fresher air to the motor? There's a pic of it somewhere, I've seen it. Butch/56sedandelivery.
I don't know if there are pictures anywhere or not but Joe Allread ran his car with a stock 57 grille. He had ordered a new grille bar and it had not come in when the pictures were taken. I know because I took the grille bar out of my street driven 57 to put in his car. My street driven 57 was Bob Lambeck's former Bel Air junior stocker.
We ran a '57 Chevy grille bar with parking lights in our '58 Chevy Delray in favor of the stock '58 grille and parking lights. It saved a ton of front end weight and we thought it looked... well... custom. Lee
Hey Butch; The Grump ran a very BIG Jenkins Comp bow tie on the front bumper of his 66 Chevy Deuce (white car, second version). Also, I have a photo somewhere of Jere Stahl's 56 wagon (I think) running a front licence plate at an angle to allow more air flow in. I'll post that when I find it.
The "customizing" thing obviously got progressively out of hand along the way. In the early days there were actually a serious number of Stockers that were dual purpose vehicles. In 1964, at the first Divison Seven race of the season, I remember that Dave Kempton drove his '62 Plymouth Sport Fury C/SA all the way to Ramona, California, set a record, tore down on Saturday night and won the event on Sunday. All with 4.11 gears in the car. While there was a fairly pronounced separation between the drag racers and the cruising crowd by the mid-60s, I believe that NHRA included the customizing rule to accommodate cross-over vehicles. But, as usual, I digress. I don't think I ever saw the Douglas/Forys Pontiac wagon in person but I met Graham "Doug" Douglas at an earlier time. I know that Doug and his partner, Ed Forys, were both engineers and liberally applied their theoretical knowledge to the race car. It appears that they had performed "customizing" work around the front end of the wagon but based on that picture and recalling the intensity that they displayed toward the sport, I'd wager that they perceived some performance advantage was to be gained either from removing weight or by blocking off air flow through the grill area. I suppose that would have an effect similar to the practice of putting tape over the nose of a NASCAR grill. Recalling Doug's '40 Ford coupe street racer (Pontiac w/four-speed), I sort of recall that it was equipped with less than a full complement of creature comforts; specifically, I don't think it had a floor or scatter-shield or passenger seat. Those were much different times!!! c
Thanks Gary; Another fine example of Junior Stock facts and history you'll only find here on the Junior/Stock thread. For anyone new to the group, here's a photo of Gary and Joe putting the front end on Allread's Car Craft project car.
Chuck Norton wrote; I don't think I ever saw the Douglas/Forys Pontiac wagon in person but I met Graham "Doug" Douglas at an earlier time. I know that Doug and his partner, Ed Forys, were both engineers and liberally applied their theoretical knowledge to the race car. It appears that they had performed "customizing" work around the front end of the wagon but based on that picture and recalling the intensity that they displayed toward the sport, I'd wager that they perceived some performance advantage was to be gained either from removing weight or by blocking off air flow through the grill area. I suppose that would have an effect similar to the practice of putting tape over the nose of a NASCAR grill. Recalling Doug's '40 Ford coupe street racer (Pontiac w/four-speed), I sort of recall that it was equipped with less than a full complement of creature comforts; specifically, I don't think it had a floor or scatter-shield or passenger seat. Those were much different times!!! And that pretty much sums up just how innovative these guys were back then when Winning Class or setting National Record really meant something. Sure beats the heck out of todays bracket cars. Back then it was all about "How can I make this thing just a little bit faster". Thanks Chuck. c[/QUOTE]
You've got me on the edge of my seat, Steve. I can't wait for the next installment of this Junior Stock saga! Pete
Welcome to this forum and thread! Thanks for sharing your J/S experiences. Stories like this are priceless. Need I say: MORE? Btw, what is a "slim-jim" trans? That's the first time I've heard that term. Regards, Pete
Guys here's a little update on the Patrick Bros. "In-Bomber" '68 NHRA Nationals winner. More pics here: http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?p=4221348&posted=1#post4221348 -Dean
Thanks for the kind words. I have no idea what a slim jim trans was. I was just a kid that could drive and wrench on cars. I started going to the drags in 64. A neighbor was a stock tech inspector at Kil-Kare. Every sat. All I know is that Jim Kopp didnt like the 60 wagon as well as the PEEL to run. He said the trans took too much time to shift into high gear!
Check out this Judy Lilly You-Tube video. "List" member Joe DeLorenzo is shown doing what he did best at the end of the clip. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wUngQG3jAI
Any of you guys interested in a Jones-Motorola mechanical tach I bought new in 1972? It is in perfect condition. I think it is a pretty rare piece as it has the MOON EYES logo on the face. It is located just under the name Jones-Motorola,Stamford,Conn. USA. It has the Tell-Tale that works. I have the original cable that is 37 inches. I do NOT have the bracket the tach mounted in. The glass has not one scratch and the face is in mint condition. Be nice to see someone maybe restoring a car that could use it. Make offer if interested. Thanks!
'Slim Jim' was the nickname for the Rotohydramatic used in the early 60's Pontiacs; Catalina's, Ventura's, Grand Prix's. The bigger cars got the Super Hydramatic, (Bonneville & Star Chief) it was a much tougher tranny and had a super low first gear. As I understand it, these tranny's didn't use a torque convertor. They were replaced by the Turbohydramatic 400 in 1965.
No one seems to remember exactly, but from what I figure it may have had something to do with the Martin Bomber Plant right in Omaha Nebraska that was responsible for making bombers during WWII....but who knows. The "In" is refferncing the car being injected. How ironic though that a car named that survived 30 years in the woods and came back! -Dean
61 Pontiac, It was a grreat tach in its day and for anyone that is restoring there junior stocker nothing could be more original than the JONES-MOTROLA { not MOTOROLA-they didn't make TV's} tach. They were made by the Jones Motrola Co in Ct. Various suppliers that ordered a quantity of them could get their logo on the group of tach's they ordered. Mooneyes-Moroso-Honest Charlie & Stahl were some of the suppliers that had a good following and made it worthwhile to offer an item with there name/logo on it to enhance sales. Dom
Ask your Dad if he had a phone call recently from Ronnie that included a discussion about a certain guy with a Nassau Blue '62 409/380. With any luck, Ronnie and "that guy" might bump into your Dad next Thurs nite at the Sonic cruise-in nearby. Verne
From 1963, Ramon Lowe at the NHRA South Central divisional championships resetting the C/SA mph record at 110.79.
Look at how long the header extensions are on the 56. You can see what appears to be darker areas from the exhaust starting behind the number down on the rocker panel. OR at this time you had to have complete exhaust system and they lead back to a muffler somewhere? And the "Trick" backward bent front license plate.
Bob Rice posted a better photo of Stahl's 56 waaay back on page 46. Here's the link... http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=3315055&postcount=903 Here's what the rule book said about exhaust and good job noticing that licence plate!
Colsey, What is the date on that Rulebook? We dealt with exhaust systems in the early-to-mid 60's and then the requirement was lifted. When Stock reappeared after the great Stock Eliminator purge of 1972 the exhaust system requirement returned for only a couple of years and then it was dropped again. It has been theorized that they got tired of picking up the pieces of light-weight, flimsy mufflers and tail pipes as racers became increasingly inventive in circumventing such rules. One feature that has always been a standard part of the exhaust rule in NHRA has been the definite prohibition against flex-pipe. Obviously, it has never been a viable option for maximum performance and it's unquestionably trashy from a visual standpoint as well, but, from the outset, someone in NHRA had enough aversion to that stuff to put those words into print, year after year. I saw it on cars in AHRA in the 60s but NHRA had banned it early on. c
That's from the 1966 NHRA rule book Chuck. Not sure what year it was lifted but I'm pretty sure the 67 rules called for mufflers as well.
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