OK I have gone through all the older Lincoln brake posts and can not find anything close to this. Maybe I am missing something I dont know. I just put a set of Lincoln brakes on my 33 5 window that i am building that were given to me from a friend of mine. I clearenced the spindles and the backing plates. Everything went just like i exspected except for one thing. The drums inner race does not seat against the bearing on the spindle unless i space the bearing out on the spindle. I am using the round Ford spindles. I am using the same bearings from the old drums for mock up they seem to fit the drum races fine. What am I doing wrong or missing? Has someone ran into this before?
The inner bearing is a 15118 and some of them need a champher on the inside edge of the bearing to allow it to go on a bit further. HemiDeuce.
yeah, on my 37 Ford with 47 lincoln backing plates I had to add a spacer to move the backing plate out Am I understanding your problem?
The bearing fits the spindle fine and the backing plate is fine. The drums inner race does not seat against the bearing unless it is spaced out on the spindle. If I was to space the backing plate It would still not seat and I would not be able to get the spindle nut on fare enought to get the cotter pin in the spindle.
You need to either put a chamfer on the inner race of the bearing, or put the spindle in a lathe and ruduce the size of the radius where the bearing is hitting. Do not make it a sharp corner if you modify the spindle as it will be a stress concentration and weaken that area.
I may be wrong. But I think you need to use a 40 style Ford hub. The kind that goes inside the drum. The Lincoln drum should work. The "snout" on the Ford spindle is shorter than the Lincoln.
Sorry I guess I didnt say this the bearing is fine. The drum race is not hitting the bearing. Unless i space the bearing out on the spindle.
This is my guess. I have looked really hard at this picture and it appears that you are using stock Lincoln brake drums. I had the same thought that the snouts were different length but I only had a 38 Lincoln spindle to measure and the snouts are the same length as Ford. The issue I have is with the length of the backing plate bolts. My take is that they are sticking out so far that they hit the drum and do not allow it to full seat on the bearing. Correct installation should have the head of the bolt inside the drum and the nuts on the back side. Not so pretty but this is also a good practice as you can see if the nuts loosen and back off for some reason. Before you go doing a bunch of machine work flip the backing plate bolts.
Ok so the bolts are fine they dont come close to the hubs in the drums. So fare all the answers have been rule out except the ford spindles or lincoln spindles the bearing has to sit out further on the linconl spindles? So when people use the Lincoln brakes the only thing they use is the drums and the backing plates and not the Lincoln hubs?? Someone out there has to have used them before?
I believe bib is right also. I plan to use the repro lincoln drums and backing plates on my coupe and am told I need hubs on the inside of the drums.
You have already told us the problem and the solution Do you think its cheating to make a spacer to put the bearing where its needed? just do it and report back to us how it works out. Thats the way hotrodding progresses Will the bearing fit the spindle OK if its spaced out?
But that puts the bearing load in the middle of the spindle. Instead of the strongest part of the axle. I know what i did to make it work just checking to see if this is right? Sorry for being redundant.
Ok I believe the problem is the backing plate is for the rear. The Lincoln fronts and rears are different depth's... That's just a guess though.
I have 47 Lincoln brakes on my 37 Ford, 39 Lincoln brakes on my model A with stock spindle and unknown year Lincoln brakes on my chopped and channeled Model A built in 1954 with 46-48 axles. None of them have your problem
Ok so then what the heck is going on then? Are you using the stock drums and hubs. With the 39 you are useing the Model A- spindles so that wont help.Which hubs and spindles are on the other cars. Did you put them together? any pics? I have always used the 37-48 ford stuff on my other cars. This is a first time for me using the Lincolns. So fill me in with your wisdom on what the hell is going on it should be obvious for you since you have used them that many times.
Just wondering if MT Products that make the repop Lincoln brakes,drums and hubs might offer any help.
Without being there and seeing first hand what you have for parts, This is my Take on it. First i would get a '40 Ford Drum and see how that fits the application. If it fit, Then i would check to see which Lincoln Drums you have as there are 3 DIFFERENT Depths/Off Set in Lincoln Brakes. '39 Lincoln being the Deepest, Which pulls the backing plate & drum in to narrow up the track width & only fit the EARLY '32-'36 style Ford Spindles (with mods of course) '40-'41 being the Shallowest & Most desireable Front Backing plate which are the same as REAR '39-'48. These should hold the Correct Lincoln or Ford Drum ***y WITHOUT a spacer between the spindle & Bearing... Sorry Boys, But the spacer is ********. '42-'48 being the Medium depth backing plate. Not many use these because the DO require a bunch of nonsense spacing to run on Ford Spindles. From where i sit, I Bet you have '42-'48 hub/Drum ***emblies. Check them against a '40 Ford drum & see it the offset is the same as the Lincoln drum... I bet you find its not. By the way, Get some FoMoCo Backing plate bolts... Those Home Depot ones are Killin me
I say send VAPHEAD a pm, he has this all figured out and will tell you what you need, I had no problems with the same set up that I purchased from him.
Or you could call Bob Wilson at Wilson Welding - just a great guy and really helpful. www.wilsonweldingandmachine.com
Sorry the simple bolt flip didnt work. I looked thru all my parts reference book but I dont have any part number book specific to Lincoln prior to 49. I do know that there are two different styles of backing plates that are used with Lincoln Lockheed brakes. The most popular is the 40/41 version which is similar to the Reproduction version out on the market and like the ones on your spindle. These have a shallow dish backing plate and simply are a bolt on to upgrade brakes. The later 42-48 style backing plate is harder to use as it has a deeper dish to the backing plate. This deeper dish centers the brake further over the spindle boss. To use with Ford spindles this requires you to install a spacer to index the shoes correctly to the drum. Now the issue with your misalignment may be traced to the use of 42/48 Lincoln drums which index on the deeper backing plates. Using the later hubs with the earlier backing plates is now creating an issue as the two parts are not designed to be interchanged. The snout offset of the later Lincoln drums moves the brake surface further inward which then causes the shoes to bottom out on the brake hub before the drum seats. Do you know what year the drums you have are? The simplest check would be to just throw on a stock 40-48 Ford drum and see if every thing indexes and the bearing seats, the issue is with the drums.
If it would help, I do have '36-48 H series parts book...but of course part numbers are of little help when the need is dimensional. I agree on trying a Ford drum as a good quick checkup! I do have a reasonably accessible set of '42-8 type Lincolns that I could measure or pop onto a '37 spindle. I try to maintain a sort of "iron library" to help my own research and maintain sanity when something doesn't fit, but the Lincoln stuff is thin on the ground. We should somehow gather up the Lincoln tech ****tered all over this board and put the good stuff into the tech archive, and add in some real measured dimensions on all the years. Seems like no one has all the answers, yet all the answers probably exist somewhere on here! I can provide catalog data to identify the year divisions and some actual dimensions. Interesting factoid...Lincoln sold some years of hydraulic backing plates as ***EMBLIES ready to install! I thought that was cool and mouth-watering. Probably out of stock now. I just found out also that Wilton ( http://www.mtcarproducts.com/index.html ) sells an original type with adjustable anchors...anyone here a dealer for that? He also has E-brake hardware for rear use, and even has custom-drilled plates for all years of spindle and rear end, such as the offset rotated holes for '32-4 rear.
Sorry De Soto The Bolts on there are mock up only. I have a whole bin full of correct Ford bolts for the car. Everything on the car will be pre 49. Thanks for your take on it, Rick
my 47 lincoln brakes are against the 37 ford drums, the 39 lincoln are using 40 Ford drums with A spindles the Model A with 46-8 axles with lincoln brakes is *I THINK * lincoln drums because each one has a pointed lug stud and this car is untouched from 1954 I did learn that 42-48 drums did not work on the Model A with 39 backing plates However 2' shoes fit ALL the brake drums with room to spare because the drums are actually about 2 3/16" wide and you can use self adjusters
"I did learn that 42-48 drums did not work on the Model A with 39 backing plates" Does this mean that the '48 drums did not fit because the spindles were model A, and that the Lincoln drums DID fit the A spindles?? If so, this may be the total answer...it would mean that these Lincold rums have A bearing spacing. Model A spindles do require a roughly 3/8--1/2 inch spacer to take '48 drums.
The 42-48 drums rubbed on the 39 lincoln backing plates on my stock A spindles. The 40 works just fine I have not tried Lincoln drums on an A spindle
So out of all of this I have been told I do not have the flat backing plates and do not have the deep backing plates but the in the middle plates. Which I knew already. The Drums are lincoln but dont know how to tell what year or depth. But this could be the Problem or the stock lincoln hubs could be. So I either need to find out how to tell what lincoln drums fit which backing plates or just change the hubs to 40 ford hubs? Or be ok with spacing the bearing out on the spindle and leave it how it is and pray! HaHa!!. Any test dummies out there? HaHa! Its not that bad when you lose a front wheel on a straight axle on car the freeway. Right? Hmmm?
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