Anybody mess with these on here?? How streetable are they?? Found a company that is doing repops of the moon one for a 1/6th the price... What are your thoughts on this?? Why is moon charging $1200 to $1400 for theirs?? The first pic is Moon's $1200-$1400 the second it $200.. I have done some reading on these and some where it says that they are not good for heavy cars.. Is this true and if so why... Sorry for all the questions... -COS
Because it says moon . tell that other company to start repopping other cool **** for more than just the chity ; )
It is an IR type of intake. As such, tuning the carburetors is critical, and over many people's heads....also very expensive. Once they are "dialed in" correctly, the performance & throttle response of an IR setup is very similar to fuel injection. Getting to that point can be a *****...to put it mildly. If you don't have any experience with this sort of deal- tuning Webers- you are probably best off buying a complete setup new from someone who is able to set the system up with a good baseline, and who is able to give you accurate advice to further tune it. Be well prepared for the price tag...this is in no way a cheap path to performance, and just buying the intake, then hoping to find good used Webers, is probably going to make you unhappy. One source is Inglese Induction Systems http://www.inglese.com/ In terms of streetability and use with heavy vehicles...when they are set correctly...it's no problem. I know of a case where they (an IDF system) were used on a '70s Chevrolet truck as a daily driver. They are almost infinitely tunable to any situation....which is what can make them so hard to deal with.
Don't know them just an add I found on ebay. I have alway liked the looks of this set up but could never ever afford it... $200 is easier to come up with than $1200 lol and hell that is just the intake... What do weber side drafts go for these days?? $200 $300 a piece...
Oh I hear ya!! I have always wanted one but didn't and still don't know **** about them... Just like the way the look plus you don't see them that much.. Heard before what you said about being close to injection performance and hard to tune.. but man they look so bad *** on a clean motor....
WOW that is crazy... $5600 just for carbs... then cleaners linkage oh my!! So I guess I have good taste!! LOL Must be the Gold Chainer coming out in me!!
COS The reason it is said that they don't perform well in a heavy car has to do with low end torque. Short devided runners no plenum makes for very low torque numbers in the lower RPM range. Like as has been said it is going to be a ****** to tune. And if you use DCOEs they are real sensative to humidity and al***ude changes. You could try Solex carbs they are a little more forgiving. But you will always be screwing with it. On the otherhand if you are going to be running a light car and don't intend to cross the Rockies you may be alright. We'll have to rig you up a balancing set up. But I'll be rigging one for 2 carbs in the near future and you can scope it out and build yourself one for 4.
**** your still alive I thought I saw a post on here saying you p***ed!!! So your saying this would be a now go on that fat pig of a car of mine... and I am too stupid to run them.. LOL I will go back to looking at tri-power set up now... Let me know when you start on that set up.. This time I will bring the pizza!! -COS
Tehy came on everything from Triumphs to Volvos back in the later '50s and earlyier '60. I think Jag was still using them into the '70s. They are a slide carb with a ****erfly. The slide is controlled by va***m as I recall. Good carbs not bothered too much by al***ude or humidity changes. Hey COS I got a dizzy for you over here. And you could learn to tune the Webbers, they are just carbs.
Bad, but not quite that bad. They (Webers) are "twins", so you need 4 of them (whichever type). Complete systems (new) are anywhere from $3200-$5000 depending on the vendor, the carb choice, & how much gold-chain plaiting, polishing, etc. your wallet will stand. Some manifolds can use SUs or Dell'Ortos, which are cheaper. Also, someone has a license to build a Weber copy, I forget who, and they are a bit less as well. I have to admit that I had a major jones for these things when I was younger. The entry fee, though, is a little too steep for me for what you get in terms of power. If I ever get inclined to spend my kids' college funds & build a Shelby Cobra, though, it will be 427 powered, and it will have Webers. I would disagree with pork a little bit, though....it's true they don't really have plenums, but the nature of the IR manifold, (if tuned correctly), the individual barrels, and the pressure wave characteristics of the intake runner length tend to compensate....if the engine is built with the intent to use this kind of intake all along. Most of the vendors offer/offered specific cams and strongly recommend using them. I will say that many years back, we experimented with a set of IDFs on a Moon intake on a relatively mild Chevy 355. It had a Holley 750VS on a Edelbrock C3B (I think; basically similar to a Performer). We simply unbolted the Holley/Edelbrock, bolted on the Weber setup straight as it came from the vendor & dyno'ed it. Without any tuning whatsoever, not even a minor diddle on the timing, it was up 10-15+ ft.-lb. of torque almost across the board. I wouldn't read a whole lot into that story- for one thing, dual-plane manifolds have been considerably improved since then, and for another, tuning is EVERYTHING with these setups- but they can be used, IMHO, in applications where torque is a priority. The engine in a different form, with the Webers, went into a '50 Ford & worked very well. Are they worth the $$$? Good question.
perhaps a correction is necessary. SUs probably won't fit on that manifold. Perhaps you're thinking of Solex - another carb from across the pond, but they do make a 2bbl with a mounting surface similar to many Weber carbs. that's what I recall, but maybe I'm the one that needs correction. dj
This outfit has (had?) a pretty good price on a 45 DCOE setup. http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Images/Catalog/K352.htm http://www.piercemanifolds.com/Catalogpages/conversions.htm
Hey dude, if you got the intake you cna adapt about any carb that has a close bore size to it as long as it flowed and had a healthy accelerator ciricuit.....I've done tons of sidedraft intakes on v-8's and I6's.....
Grabed a quick pic of some S.U's on the web. might not be able to fit more than three on a side. Every now and then I'll see them on a Harley and liked the look.
Webers are expensive, but they can be had used. Beware though, the huge range of tunability means that actual out of box performance can be very different between 2 of the "same" carb. Cores would do you more good than remans if buying one by one. Del'Ortos (sp?) are cheaper, but I've had friends who used them on rotories and most went to webers after a while. Mikuni is another option. Less tunability but arguably more streetable. Definitely a gentler learning curve. Usually pretty fair on pricing new or used. Import people can be good sources of info. You'd be surprised how twin side drafts will wake up really old Hondas
Did a little browsing myself . The intake is a copy pretty much as it appears and of course for the price it is cast in China and looks like sold through procomp , some of which is still an Australian company . OH, and that pierce has a new intake , 2 inline wbers for SBC looks interesting and I'm sure a lot more streetable
About 25 years ago, there was a guy around here who had some Mikunis bolted on to his Mustang hood, with some sort of chrome hardware store stacks made from plumbing fittings. Yes, that's right...not on the engine...but the outside of the hood. It must have been worthwhile to do this from a performance point of view, because when I first saw the car, it had two Autolite 2 bbls. bolted on to the hood...and obviously he wouldn't have changed unless it made the car faster. And, yes, the car was a truly complete piece of ****....rust and all.
I would run a Delorto DHLA, same mounting and a better carb IMO. better emulsion and intermediate transition. As for torque choke sizing is critical. For a 350 ci SBC and a heavy car DHLA 40 with 32 or 34mm chokes. Light car run 45MM and 37mm chokes. An individual runner induction system will make more torque and power than an common plenum setup. IMHO and from exp.
I'm not sure what IMHO means, guess I'm way out of touch on the whole acronym thing. But your statement is true on the torque and HP if you add in a very narrow RPM range. Narrow being the operative word here.
IMHO "In My Humble Opinion" I have in fact found quite the opposite of a narrow power band. All induction systems have a natural resonance during which torque will peak. So in that regard the individual runner's can have a higher Q come in quicker and roll off quicker. When matched to cam and exhaust ETC. But I was referring to the fuel delivery with respect to the strong fuel signals the individual runners give you. Add to the the width of tune ability the Webers and Delortos afford ( pilot jet, air correctors, emulsion tubes main jets, trumpets and, venturis(choke) changes they are just about the best when right. Yes quite a chore to tune but than nothing worth doing is easy. They also fit under a relatively low hood. Kinda kin have your cake and eat it too. AG
I was under the impression solexes are 2barrell, but progressive, so they have to feed a plennum, not individual runners.
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