Features Ford Thunderbolts Photos Wanted

This pic is from the same track

 

I've been really busy at work , ok actually I've had some time to kill so I searched the HAMB and I think I've found a few pics that haven't been posted here on this thread.....sorry if they have. This thread is getting long and my memory is short!

 

Seen the last one (not on this thread) but not the first three. Any ideas on what cars these are? Kudos on your dilligent searching too!

 

The first is the Dobbs Ferry car out NY. Not real sure about the other 2...maybe Tom McGroans car?? The last is Gene Wilson's car.

 

Zoomed the pics....that is McGroans car.

 

You got a better zoomer than me....

So help me out on something else I've been trying to figure out. I know I've seen this info posted online somewhere but can't find it now. Who got cars 9, 10 and 11 out of the first batch? I assume one was Mickey Thompson, one was the Bob Ford automatic car but who got the other? I recall reading somewhere that one of the first batch ended up painted white to match the last 89. Wickersham?

According to the HotRod magazine article Milo Coleman got one of the first 11 cars but I don't think that's correct. Was his maybe one of the first out of the second batch, maybe 12 or 13?

Last question for the night. Which car did Butch Leal race, the 7th car or the other one that Mickey Thompson got?

 

Bob Ford was one of the oldest Ford Dealers in Michigan, and in fact it was named after its founder, Robert "Bob" Ford, who was a cousin of Henry Ford. As Bob Ford (now operated as Fairlane Ford) was the closest Ford dealer to the Ford World Headquarters, both The Ford Division and the Lincoln-Mercury Division General Offices, and the Ford Engineering Center, it clientele always included the who's who of Ford management and their families. It was only natural that Bob Ford established many connections inside Ford Motor Company. For example, in 1956 Ford wanted to enter Troy Ruttman’s 1956 Ford in the MARC (now ARCA) Labor Day late model stock car race at the Michigan State Fairgrounds one-mile dirt track. However, when Troy showed up in Dearborn, the car did not have a straight piece of sheet metal on it, and as Detroit is the Motor City, Ford wanted the car to look brand new. A phone call was made and Troy’s car was rushed over to Bob Ford’s Collision Shop, where they worked around the clock to completely re-skin and repaint the car, so when it showed up at the Fairgrounds it looked like it just came from the showroom. As repayment, Bob Ford lettered the car with their dealer’s name on the quarter panel, and Troy went on to win the Fairgrounds race, leading almost every lap. The Bob Ford Sales Manager was a savvy ex-navy Hot-Rodder named Paul Harvey.
Paul later returned to his hometown of Indianapolis, Indiana to work for Jerry Alderman Ford, only to return to Bob Ford again in 1961 when offered the General Manager Position. Paul was an avid performance enthusiast, and immediately elevated the in-house drag racing effort, being run by a Salesman named Jack Gray, who was racing his high performance 401HP Demonstrator on Sunday to sell performance on Monday, and hired Jack's young mechanic Dave Lyall to tune, maintain and eventually drive the car. Jack had already convinced Ford Chief Engineer Bob Frey to ship Jack's demo to Holman-Moody for a blueprinted NASCAR 390 engine, transmission, 486 gears and some wide and soft NASCAR slicks, with Jack and Dave winning the season-ending S/S meet at Central Michigan Drag way, ironically defeating Troy Ruttman’s 409 Chevrolet, driver by Brother Joe Ruttman, in the final. Paul then made a new 1962 406 Galaxy available to Gray and Lyall, and now a full dealer effort was underway. Late that summer Dave defeated all the out-of-town Factory Fords, Pontiacs and MoPars at a pre-nationals show at Detroit Dragway, only to lose to Frank Sander’s 409 Chevrolet in the final due to a pit miscue of over-icing the intake manifold, causing a backfire when the car was launched.
<OWith this success, Bob Ford was awarded one of the first lightweight 63 427 Fastbacks, and one of the original Thunderbolts. Dave Lyall went on to work for Ford Motor Company at the end of the 1963 Season, and the Bob Ford Thunderbolt was driven by Len Richter.
Paul Harvey helped Dave launch his own drag race team in 1964 with a BFX 427 F-100 in 1964 and then an AFX 427 Falcon in 1965. Paul left Bob Ford in 1966 to open his own Ford Dealership in Indianapolis, with son Jerry Harvey, Dick Brannan, Hubert Platt and Don Nicholson driving their drag race cars into the 70’s. Paul has retired and son Jerry operates their Dealer today.
<OBob Ford continued to sponsor Dave Lyall’s drag race cars through 1967, and Dave continued Drag Racing, including pioneering efforts in both Pro Stock, Pro 5.0, and IHRA Top Sportsman until retiring from driving in 2006, at the age of 67. Bob Ford was sold to Fairlane Ford in the 90’s, and still operates today. Jack Gray retired in 1972, and passed away in 1999.
<OAttached are pictures of Dave’s 1963 Fastback, 1965 Falcon, 1967 Fairlane, 1868 Mustang, 1970 Mustang, and 1998 Mustang.
<O

 

dlshady...There were 2 Mickey Thompson cars....Leal's (#7) and then Jess Tyree (#10)

The Wickersham car (#9) was white in all of the pics I've seen (not to say it wasn't burgandy at first).....most people think this is it later on:

 

The first 10 Purple Thunderbolts were issued as follows:
Dick Brannan-1, Phil Bonner-1, Bob Tasca-1, Bob Ford-1, Les Ritchey-1, Gas Rhonda-1, Mickey Tomson-2, Ford Engineering-1, Ford Livonia Transmission-1. (For automatic transmission development)
The Ford Engineering Thunderbolt was eventually painted like Len Richters Bob Ford car, and was sometimes run locally driven either by Paul Harvey or Bill Humphrey.
Dave Lyall

 

Wow Dave,
Thanks for the great contribution! Glad to have you here and welcome to the asylum! However I'm confused a little confused (nothing new there) on the first batch of cars. There were eleven, correct?
1 - Romy Hammes - Dick Brannan
2 - Bob Ford - Len Richter
3 - Ed Martin Ford Sales
4 - Al Means Ford - Phil Bonner
5 - Performance Associates - Les Ritchey
6 - Downtown Ford Sales - Gas Ronda
7 - Mickey Thompson - Butch Leal
8 - Tasca Ford - Bill Lawton
9 - ?
10 - Mickey Thompson - Jess Tyree
11 - ?

The automatic Bob Ford car (Paul Harvey's ride) must have been either 9 or 11, so who got the other one? Not that it really matters, just that I hate knowing only half of something....

Also, who got the last one built?


Thanks,
Deron

 

Dave (or anyone), Why does the order of the Thunderbolts built at DST not match the order of serial numbers off the factory assembly line? An example would be Dick Brannan's car being called the first Thunderbolt but then hearing that Gas Ronda's car is the one with the lowest serial number. This happened throughout all four groups of Thunderbolts built. Any comments?

 

A bit of trivia. There is no such thing as a thunderbolt. Thunder is the sound made by a lightingbolt.

 

I'm sure someone else can give a more educated answer, but I would have to guess that its just the order in which they were completed and delivered. As I understand it, the first eleven were cars that were actually completed on the Ford assembly line and then sent to DST as complete cars for modification. I seriously doubt that any thought was given as to keeping them in consecutive VIN number order as they were transported or modified, but rather the first one through the door was started on first. As for the remaining 89 cars, it is my understanding that they were sent from Ford to DST as incomplete cars (I would assume to save time and energy on disassembly as well as cost for components that would never be used) and I'd be willing to bet that again, no attention was paid to keeping the cars in any kind of order while and/or after they were transported.

Being that all of that is just supposition on my part, I'd be interested to hear other more knowledgeable opinions.


Deron

 

Yeah, but Thunderbolt sounds so much cooler...

 

"Thunderbolt" appears in the dictionary, however lightingbolt (lighteningbolt) does not.

OK, back to the cars.

Regards,
Dennis

 

The 623 Bob Ford Automatic car had the "9" decal on the windshield, see attached. This photo was taken at the 1964 Winternationals, for some reason the passenger side of the car was not lettered, however the driver's side was.

Wickersham Ford in Orange TX received the other car you were asking about. However it to may of been referred to as the number 9 car as that is where it falls in the delivery list and is also the ninth car in the Drag Council presentation photo taken at the test track in Oct 1963.

Also, on the Mickey Thompson/Jess Tyree Thunderbolt, it was originally assigned to Bob Ford Inc then reassigned to Mickey Thompson.

Regards,
Dennis

 

I know it's a Cammer Falcon and not a Thunderbolt, but I thought everyone may like to see this photo.

Bondy Long's High Riser Mustang (former Tasca Ford car) in the background too.

Regards,
Dennis

 

Does the Hemphill McCombs car have coat hooks in it? The first eleven Burgundy cars did, the white ones did not.

Years ago I asked Clester Andrews about the exterior paint color. He said they painted it white to match their 1963 Lightweight Galaxie. However, when they realized that only the early Drag Council cars were to be burgundy, they wish they would of left it alone.

Regards,
Dennis

 

What ever happened to this car??

 

Cool stuff indeed and I appreciate you taking the time to answer!

By chance, do you have any photos of the Len Richter car during restoration that you'd be willing to share with us? I'm most interested in detail stuff such as whether the underbody of these cars was left in primer, body color or blacked out. I stumbled across a Thunderbolt model in my basement that I started several years ago and looking back on it now I realize that I had many of the details wrong. They're calling for a couple inches of snow here tomorrow which will lock down north Alabama so I'm thinking of getting started on another one (like I don't have enough unfinished projects...)

Thanks!
Deron

 

Regarding the pic of Gene Wilson's Prodigal in post #967--it looks like the front wheels are a little closer to the bumper than stock? Also--I was told that when you went to D.S.T. to pick up your T-Bolt they took you out to the lot-where a bunch were sitting-and you picked out the one you wanted--with a lot of coaxing to take an automatic. So the one you chose might not be a consecutive number with the one the next guy got.

 

I have been told much the same thing by a friend that got one of the cars originally. He also said that each car had the weight written on the windshield so naturally he picked the lightest car that was available that day. What a sight that must have been to see a row (or more!) of shiney new Thunderbolts just waiting to be thrashed....


Deron

 

Gene Wilson's car was Phil Bonner's second car. Originally an auto, that didn't last long and in went the T-10. All of Phil's cars eventually got "adjusted wheelbases"... Southern Match Bash was where it was at!!!

 

Anyone have a photo of the Wake Forest Ford T-bolt? How about the Dick Waters Ford car out of Cedar Rapids?

 

Dennis:

The reason the VIN numbers do not match the order the T-Bolts were completed and delivered is they were built at Dearborn Assembly as gliders, that is without engines or transmissions, and pushed off the end of the line, loaded on to transporters and delivered to DST in Dearborn at Michigan and Gulley. The DST lot was small, and they were stacked in any way they could get them inside the fence. When DST began the final assembly, they just dug them out of the lot as they could get to them, and went to work on them. They were delivered when completed to suit the needs of the individual recipients, Brannan got the first one completed because he had a Match Race booked with Arnie Beswick, who was an serious, innovative competitor who never bothered with any rule books, and Brannan knew he would have his hands full with 63 1/2 lightweight, so he took the first Thunderbolt completed to surprise Arnie. If I remember correctly, it was the first T-Bolt match race victory.<O></O>
The rest of the cars were distributed as needed, and when the last one was completed, they had a big gathering at the Ford Test Track in Dearborn, a picture of which was displayed at the last Thunderbolt Reunion.

As I recall, there were 12 Thunderbolts built before the white “Production batch”, as follows: There was a light green 1963 hardtop built as a concept prototype late in 1963, and it was used in a Match Race against the Ramchargers at Detroit Dragway on a Sunday late in the 1963 season. It was driven by Bill Humphrey, a talented, unflappable and accomplished Ford Test Driver who occasionally drove some of the Bob Ford cars when I worked there. I was up all night with the Experimental Garage mechanics, and Ford Engineers Dan Jones, Vern Tinsler, and program Manager Charlie Gray going over every detail of the 63 car to make it as good as we could make it. Sunday before the show started, Gil Kohn called a meeting between us and the Ramchargers to set the rules. Gil stated there was to be no time trials, and the best 3 out of five would be the winner. Round 1 was won by Bill in the T-Bolt. (The Ramchargers had never been beaten before, and were in dismay) Round 2 was won by Bill again in the T-Bolt. The Ramchargers were in a panic mode. They had a meeting with Gil, who was never favorable to Ford, and he called off the match race, and let the Ramchargers go to work on their car, and make several single time trials to redial their car in for the late season track conditions and the cool dense air. After several hours of Ramchargers trashing, Gil announced the Match Race would continue. The Ramchargers went on to win it 3 out of 5. However, if Gil had not favored the Ramchargers and stuck with his initial rules, that race would have been the first T-Bolt match race victory. The Green ‘63 hardtop prototype was then turned over to Tasca Ford, and Bill Lawton drove it to impressive wins on the east coast, racing it until they got their ’64 Thunderbolt.

Then DST built the 10 purple ’64 cars, distributed as I described earlier. Phil Bonner did not think his Thunderbolt was as fast as he needed it to be, to win on the southern match race circuit, so Ford also built him the light blue ’64 Falcon Futura, which he immediately started tearing up the south with. Then DST built another Falcon for Brannan, who was also doing a lot of match racing. Later in the year, after the 100 car run was completed, while Phil was at a match race with the Falcon, one of his Mechanics took Phil’s purple Thunderbolt to a local strip without Phil’s knowledge, and wrecked it. As Phil’s Thunderbolt was to be reserved for NHRA Super Stock competition, Ford built him a replacement; however this time they used a 2-door hardtop body, as in the ’63 concept prototype.

<OFrom my memory, that is all the Thunderbolts I am aware of. I was there through it all, worked on the ’63 prototype and watched them build the others, but I did not count every car nor was I in charge of keeping the records. Dave Lyall <O

 

Dave it is great to have you here. Your stories are great and very much appreciated by me and I'm sure others. Can you tell us more about the white Bob Ford '63 Galaxie you drove? How did you like the car and how did it stack up compared to others in '63. Do you happen to have any photos from the "good old days"? I remember when you were driving Stormin' Norman's pro 5.0 convertable Mustang!

 

Here are a couple of shots of the white '63 and the '61 mentioned earlier.

 

Unless I'm mistaken this is Donilson's car when it was almost brand new. This was taken at Lassiter Mountain in Birmingham. Whose car was the other you posted. One of the first by looking at the hood....