History We ALL Love a DARE! PIX of TRULY Extinct Makes?

Here's a picture of the rear of a '36 Lafayette along with one of a '37 Dodge body and one of a '37 Plymouth for comparison. I kind of thought the '36 Lafayette was the ugly duckling of all the Lafayettes myself.

 

Star

From Wikipedia

Like other products of the Durant Motors Company, the Star was an "assembled" car, built from parts supplied by various outside companies. Originally, Stars were powered by a four cylinder engine; in 1926 the line introduced a six cylinder engine. All factory-installed engines were built by Continental.

In 1923, Star became the first car company to offer a factory-built station wagon (instead of shipping a chassis out to a custom builder who added the wooden wagon body).

For the early part of the 1928 model year, the Star was known as the Durant Star and was only available with a four cylinder engine. The car was replaced in the later half of the 1928 model year by the Durant 4.

 

SunRoof, funny you should say that about the Nash '36 sedans. Plymouth's sales were always steady to great (as we all know), but customers ROUNDLY panned the '38. Good thing Plymouth had a new series lined up for '39!

 

Like this???





60WideWhiteZ has a recent thread, but THIS car was posted on the thread from BRAZILE. If interested, I can dig a few more facts.

 

Rugby

From Wikipedia

The Rugby was a 1920s brand of automobile assembled by the Durant Motors Company of New York City, New York (USA). The vehicle was identical to Durant's Star car, and was assigned to export markets by Durant Motors, due to the name Star being under copyright by The Star Motor Company in the British Commonwealth.

 

Isn't it interesting that the '39 Nash and the '39 Plymouth both had square headlights in 1939.


1939 Nash


'39 Plymouth

Of course Graham had them first in 1938

 

1923 Chevrolet Series M Copper-Cooled

by the Auto Editors of Consumer Guide

The 1923 Chevrolet Series M Copper-Cooled model served as definitive proof that nobody is right every time. Engineering genius Charles Kettering, who'd devised the electric self-starter years earlier, got another bright idea in the early 1920s: an air-cooled engine.


[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]The air-cooled 1923 Chevrolet Series M was beset by overheating problems. [/FONT]

Air cooling wasn't new, as verified by the success of the Franklin. But Kettering's concept, promising on paper, proved to be a disaster.

GM wanted an engine that was high in performance, light in weight, low in cost, and easy to maintain; a tall order, but not impossible.

Kettering exhibited the Copper-Cooled engine in January at the New York Auto Show, vowing that it would eventually replace water-cooling. Smaller than usual, it displaced only 135 cubic inches and yielded 22 horsepower
(at 1,750 rpm). Cooling was accomplished using U-shaped copper fins bonded to separately cast cylinders.

Priced about $200 higher than the water-cooled Superior B series, which was essentially an upgraded 490, the Copper-Cooled Chevrolet wore the same body as the Superior B, but weighed some 215 pounds less.
Because of uneven air distribution, production engines began to overheat badly, causing severe detonation. Breathing poorly when hot, power also fell sharply.

Production stopped after 500 cars, and nearly all were recalled. By 1923, Chevrolet was the chief GM rival to Ford, but this fiasco didn't help Chevy's image.

<table align="center" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td><center>
[FONT=arial,helvetica,sans-serif]The Series M was Chevy's last attempt at
an air-cooled engine for nearly 40 years.[/FONT]

</center></td></tr></tbody></table>1923 Chevrolet Series M Copper-Cooled Facts
<table style="width: 100%;" border="1" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> Model
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> Weight (lbs.)
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> Price range (new)
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> Number built
</td></tr><tr><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> Series M
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center">1,700 (approx.)
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center"> $695-$1,060
</td><td style="width: 25%;" align="center">500
</td></tr></tbody></table>

 

BTW, it runs in my mind that there was an ORIGINAL LaFayette company shortly after the turn of the century. I will have to check, as I think it may have been completely unrelated.

 

QUOTE: "definitive proof that nobody is right every time"

SunRoof, ain't THAT the truth?!?!? And the problem with building cars is that when you goof, it's a VERY PUBLIC thing. And nowhere to hide, either!

Far from fading into past obscurity, the Edsel remains a virtual synonym for gross error and failure. Even MoPar's ballyhooed flop, "Lean Burn" ignition pales in comparison!

What OTHER major goofs can we think of down through the decades?

 

1939 Nash


'39 Plymouth

Graham 1938



You know, the headlights were always my biggest gripe about the '39 Plymouth. THEY JUST SEEMED AWKWARDLY DONE. Everyone knew the days of pod headlight had to end, but some of the "transitional" models were too sleek, IMO! Maybe when bulbous pontoon fenders, too, passed away (mostly anyway), it resolved the styling problems around what to do with headlamps, eh?<!-- / message -->

 

Oops, of course I meant NOT too sleek. Sorry. That's one I needed to correct!

 

RE Post 1963, I looked, and there was the ORIGINAL, independent LaFayette company, founded in 1919 and offering models from 1920 through '24. At that point, Charlie Nash gained control. From 25 through 40, LaFayettes were made -- albeit as Ajax for a stretch of some years (as noted by SunRoof earlier). Early Nash versions of the LaFayette were regarded as a separate make, while later ones became de facto (and so-badged) Nashes.

So, in essence, yes, there were two separate companies called LaFayette (the first, independent, the latter, under the Nash umbrella), but they were actually "related."

 

The other day, I mentioned that my attitude about the THOUSANDS of U.S. car manufacturers since the 1890s has started to change. The more you read and analyze, the more it becomes apparent that a TON of automakers over the years have been closely related "companies" or so tiny as to be questionnable as "companies" versus somebody's hobby or wanna-be project.

An existing company, for example, gets bought out; the new owners just change the badging on the car. NOW, you have two makes listed on WIKI, the MOAAL, etc. Then you also have "companies" that were SO small that they were never even incorporated, in any sense. Some only built one car that barely even ran -- out in the garage or smithing shop. Some never completed a car at all.

Today, I got into reading on FOUR companies that -- when you think about it -- were really only two.

Rainier (1905 - 1911)
Welch-Detroit (1910 - 1911)
Marquette (1912) (the ORIGINAL Marquette that far preceded the one of circa. 1930)
Peninsular (1912) (not even on the WIKI list, but it was eventually absorbed into Chevrolet Div. of GM)

The first two were small companies bought up by Billy Durant for the new GM in 1908. He started a short-lived company, Marquette, to build parts for Welch-Detroit and to build the Ranier. For part of 1912, he marketed a car with the Marquette badge on it, discontinuing it in September 1912 (same year!) and renaming it the Peninsular. WHAT? We are supposed to seek after these RARE cars today when they were actually little more than figments of somebody's imagination???

I suppose, from the standpoint of RARITY ALL FOUR are rare as hell, guys (and I am NOT talking about the Marquette of 1930, either here). AACA didn't have a picture of ANY of the four, so I guess even they find them scarce as hen's teeth, right? If you could find one, it might be one lone duck in the warehouse of a museum someplace.

I don't know if there could EVER be a way to redefine what should constitute an auto "make," but I surely have concluded that, maybe, three-fourths of the names credited on the lists one sees hardly count as companies or makes, at all.

 

Perhaps the term should be Marques and not Makes.

 

<DT>From: DICTIONARY OF AUTOMOTIVE TERMS</DT><DT> </DT><DT>Marque</DT><DD>A particular brand name of a vehicle. Also spelled marquee </DD>
<DT>Make</DT><DD>Brand name of a car or truck (i.e., Chevrolet, Ford, Dodge, Honda). </DD>

 

Maybe it would help, HJ. I guess I was just saying that it's a little confusing when a Beaver counts the same as Packard, while Durant's Peninsular does appear at all (even though more were made than Beavers). Make any sense?

But I suppose there's no real solution, and, maybe it's not an issue anyway. I said my piece, and that's that. We may NEVER cover them all, eh? Let's turn the page and move on with it! We have fun with this thread, and it seems LOTS of others do, too!

 

The Inter-State Automobile Company was Incorporated in Muncie, Indiana, in 1908. Production began in 1909 with the first car being a 35/40-hp-four, 122" wheelbase. The car kept improving in quality, size and horsepower. Inter-State manufactured its own complete cars from 1909 to 1913, then after an involuntary bankruptcy, one of the investors, F.C. Ball, continued the Inter-State as the Inter-State Motor Company. He produced a component car (Beaver Engines, etc.) all the way until 1919. At this time World War I military production halted the Inter-State forever. There are a few examples of this fine Marque still in existence, being toured and shown.

1913 Model "45" Touring, 7-passenger Inter-State. This car is the largest of the Inter-States. It has a 388 C.I. 6-cyl monoblock, 21 wet-disc clutch, and full floating rear end, all sitting on a 132" wheelbase. Certainly just one of the fine examples of the Inter-State Motor Cars. This car exists as seen today.

 

Jimi' I think the Inter-State Automobile Company is a perfect example of what you are talking about.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Inter-State was a Brass Era car built in Muncie, Indiana, from 1909 to 1919.
Thomas F. Hart announced in October 1908 the winning name of his new company, chosen via a contest. The Inter-State Automobile Company set up shop at 142 Willard Street. Ads stated "we could get more for this car."<SUP id=cite_ref-Kimes_0-0 class=reference>[1]</SUP> Originally, all Inter-States were mid-market, both in size and price, with four-cylinder engines. In 1913, 6-cylinder engines were added.
Unfortunately receivership followed in the fall of 1913. Thomas Hunt cited "internal dissention and his inability to secure working capital because of disagreement among stockholders."<SUP id=cite_ref-Kimes_0-1 class=reference>[1]</SUP> In February 1914, Frank C. Ball (one of the original Inter-State investors) bought the Inter-State factory and real estate. This resulted in a renaming of the parent company to the Inter-State Motor Company. In 1915, a new Beaver 4-cylinder low-priced car was released. In May 1918, automobile production was suspended in favor of war work. In late February 1919, F.C. Ball announced he would be resuming passenger car production, but by March of the same year, Ball sold the Inter-State factory to General Motors for them to produce their new Sheridan<SUP id=cite_ref-Wise_1-0 class=reference>[2]</SUP>.



1916 Inter-State Touring Car

 

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Colonial was an American automobile which was manufactured from 1920 until 1921.
Built in Chicago, Illinois, the car was nothing more than a Shaw with the emblem switched; it was, however, treated as an entirely separate marque. In 1921 the company returned to using the name "Shaw" for its vehicles; soon thereafter, the entire operation was sold to the Yellow Cab company, which renamed it "Ambassador".

The Colonial was an American automobile manufactured only in 1920.
The car came with an own-make engine, a straight-eight; it also featured disc wheels, with an extra pair mounted at the side as spares. The body was a hardtop, calibrated so that the driver could turn it into either a sedan or a touring car simply by rearranging the windows. Only one car was completed.
The Colonial is chiefly remembered today because it was the first American car to feature four-wheel hydraulic brakes.

The Colonial was an American automobile manufactured in Boston from 1921 until 1922.
Although the company pledged to produce "in excess of 100 cars" during its first year in business, no more than a dozen are believed to have left the factory. Each car had a 130-inch wheelbase and a six-cylinder Beaver engine. A complete line of open and closed body styles was advertised, but the few completed models all appear to have been open. A 12-cylinder Colonial with a Weidely engine was proposed to augment production of the 1921 line, but it does not seem to have materialized.

 

Auto show, Madison Square Garden, New York City, ca.
1905. Folder

 

The York Motor Car Co. built Pullman automobile Pullman automobile

The Pullman was an American automobile manufactured in York, Pennsylvania by the York Motor Car Co. from 1905 to 1917. Total production is estimated at anywhere from 12,000 to 23,000 cars. The Pullman automobile was named by industrialist A.P...

s on South George St. from 1905 thorough 1917. An early and unique six-wheeled prototype was involved in one of the city's first known automobile accidents. Another model was driven to San Francisco and back over about one month to prove its reliability several years before the creation of the Lincoln Highway Lincoln Highway

The Lincoln Highway was the first road across the United States of America. Actively promoted by entrepreneur Carl G. Fisher, the Lincoln Highway originally spanned coast-to-coast from Times Square in New York City to Lincoln Park in San Francisco through 13 states: New York, New Jersey,...

which ran through town, connecting New York and San Francisco.

 

1908 Pullman Model H
York Motor Car Co. York, PA
1905-1908

 

1908 Pontiac Buggy Roadster
Pontiac Spring and Wagon Works, Pontiac, Mi
1904-1908

 

1908 Speedwell Tonneau
Speedwell Motor Car Co. Dayton, OH
1907-1914

 

1909 Geneva Ewing Taxi
Ewing Automobile Company, Geneva, OH.
Dates unknown, purchased by General Motors in 1909

 

Back to the PINK cars subject for a moment.



1915 Dodge Runabout
Dodge Brothers Detroit, MI
1914-Date




1916 Simplex Model 5
Simplex Automobile Co. Inc. New Brunswick, NJ
1907-1917

 

YowEE, HJ, that is SOME loud pink! LOL Now, I have to guess that both the color and the Woodlites are not correct for this car?



1915 Dodge Runabout

 

HJ said: Jimi' I think the Inter-State Automobile Company is a perfect example of what you are talking about. Citation from WIKI: Unfortunately receivership followed in the fall of 1913. Thomas Hunt cited "internal dissention and his inability to secure working capital because of disagreement among stockholders." In February 1914, Frank C. Ball (one of the original Inter-State investors) bought the Inter-State factory and real estate. This resulted in a renaming of the parent company to the Inter-State Motor Company. In 1915, a new Beaver 4-cylinder low-priced car was released. In May 1918, automobile production was suspended in favor of war work. In late February 1919, F.C. Ball announced he would be resuming passenger car production, but by March of the same year, Ball sold the Inter-State factory to General Motors for them to produce their new Sheridan.

Jimi: Yes, indeedy, HJ! PERFECT EXAMPLE. Inter-State appears to have been a well-made auto make, but internal strife and the war appear to have doomed a promising marque, no? So, out of THAT emerges two car names that only auto historians might recognize -- and even those are confusing. Sounds to me now that there were technically TWO short-lived U.S. Beaver makes, one being on the other side of the nation, in Oregon! Then there's that Sheridan, made by GM (we are told by Wiki) but only in 1920-21. Yike. Now, '21 being a recession year, there couldn't have been many (any?) Sheridans built.

Even the most dedicated layman examining a lot of these early makes would be PUZZLED, to say the least, befuddled, maybe more likely!

 

HJ, I stopped and rubbed my eyes a long while
before reading the details!!! I thought I was
seeing two cars, one parked behind the other!

Now, THIS is the same Pullman interest that
built a ga-zillion railroad passenger coaches,
isn't it?

<!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->

1905 Pullman 6-wheel prototype?
Hence, defunct?

 

What a shame. SEEMS as if Inter-State was doing something RIGHT< at least in the beginning! THIS factory is pretty huge for circa. 1908 !!!