Body damage, how would you attack this?

thats a pretty good possibility..it does look like someone got a bit crazy with a ballpeen hammer from the inside , and went a bit too far

lucky for me that gas tank is removable, mostly mocked in place for now

 

Ha! im sure i could mess it up worse than you!...lol

I do have some pieces and parts i could play with this weekend, think i will give it a shot on an old piece of tin before thinking i got what it takes

 

i would hate to go this far, if i didnt have to. but than time will tell

 

I am envious of your back panel, mine is beat and dented up from top to bottom.
Had one big oil can in the middle of the back.
I took the panel off and took it to a body shop when I first got the car and they knocked the outy dents in and took the oil can effect out of it and skim coated the hole thing and primered it.
I couldn't believe it looked as good as it did when I picked it up.
When I put it back on the car and welded up the seams on both sides the filler peeled back so I stripped the whole thing back off and found the body shop didn't epoxy it first like I asked.
I had zero experience moving metal around at that time, now I would have done the same thing they did with out hesitation but I didn't know any better before.
It will still need a skim coat on the whole panel but most of my other patches will to because I am not good enough to do metal finish work.
I am now killing time waiting on more money to move on with the project so I have been working on my front fenders for the past couple of weeks, and thought they were to bad to fix but I have surprised myself with the beater bad and hammer/dolly work and now I turned what was going to be metal working practice into some very useable fenders and I can't believe I actually was able to save them.
Nothing on my car will be perfect but it is turing out good enough for me to be proud of my work, of course some experienced body man might come over and laugh at my work but I am proud of it anyway.
Take your time and they will come out.
New and old fenders are so expensive and most of them are tore up worse than mine money was a motivator.

 

I can relate to the fender deal..

I went thru 4 complete sets before i found a set (4) that i can live with..
the drivers side rear still needs a little work its a bit twisted and pushed in. but my body has some problems too at that wheel well so im waiting to get that ironed out before i move on to that fender.

Building a full fender rod has its pit falls..no wonder most guys take the no fender route..time and money..
takes time to find a good set, and money to make what you found look like fenders again

 

Trust me, he passed through the exact same point where you are on the way to where he is now.

You already proved that you can do it. The only thing he's got over you now is speed, and that comes with practice.

Hammer and dolly, all the way, even if it is just for the learning experience.

 

shrinking hammer ,several different dollies ,and maybe a buddy to help out and some patience and youll probably get it close enough for a little putty some primer and some long board blocking can,t hurt to try

 

i hope im not being unreasonable by saying, i really hope i can do this with out much "filler"..hopefully very little.

I would like to have the feeling when i say "its all steel" ..that it is.

i know there will be some, but ..thin is the goal

 

Take it easy or you will turn a 2-3 hour job into something major. If you are looking at some damage that looks like someone hit it pretty hard with a ballpeen from inside the car, like you earlier described it, that area is stretched and will need to be shrunk. Watch some of John Kellys videos, they will help.

 

Yep.

 

If you buy a shinking disc I would suggest a smaller one but my advice might not mean much with my experience level.
I bought the 9 inch one I think it is and it has to be spun on a big angle grinder and is a pain in the ass to use so I don't.
But I see their value, just wish I had bought the smaller one.

 

is there someone near him who has time to show him the basics of hammer and dolly work? it's not that bad but if doesn't know how to do it, it could get much worse. could be a chance to meet another member,hang out, and beat on some steel. Plus a chance for someone to learn something.

 

Just try it, what can happen.
'You don't beat it out, take you time, even firm but not hard,blows, doesn't take much, go after 1 at a time.

Or

Cave and pave , beat her in and mix up a big helping of plastic, just kidding.

 

If you weren't so far away I would be glad to come help you, but thats a bit of a drive. I need to pull one of my fenders anyway and fixt a dent, dummy here had a board fall out of the loft and hit corner first on it. if you pm me the adress i'll try to copy a section on basic metal work out of one of my books for you and send it up there. My scanner has been broken for a while

 

Bring it to my house and I will help!

 

I have faith in ya, let us know how it goes!

 

If you are considering replacing the panel, before buying another panel, remove this one and straighten it or have someone else straighten it and then re-install it. Having this panel on a couple of saw horses and being able to get at and work both sides would make it a lot easier to fix.

This just another idea.

I would fix the one you have, where it is though.

 

you have holes to fill were the tire mt was so put a frenched tag plate in to stiffen it up straighten what you can and z grip the rest .... just saying still doing it for 50 yrs.

 

Since it's pushed out the metal is stretched. You need to shrink it before you do anything otherwise you are going to chase that Beercan affect all over the rear panel. I would assume it already has a bit of beer can going on. Heat some small dime size spots to just cherry red and quench with a wet rag until the beer can goes away. Then work our the ripples by letting the hammer do the work. Body file it and look for high and low spots. Then you may have to shrink a little more to finish. But it will take time and be patient.

Also I don't know if you already know this or somebody has told you but the shiny metal finished stuff has alot of sanding in different grits on it and a ton of time to make it look seamless. So don't kill yourself trying to make hammered metal look like that. If you want to metal finish it then good for you and take your time. But if you are not that concerned and want to use filler that's probably the easier route for a less experienced hand. But make sure you guide coat it after you get it roughed in. That's a big panel and you will not only be frustrated by it but you'll use alot of mud and waste alot of time money and effort. Also sand diagonally to the panel and use as straight and long a block as you can find. Buy the stick'em paper on a roll and go after it.


Good luck,

Tim

 

I say teach yourself...but instead of learning from square 1 on that panel....get a hood and beat the shit outta it and learn on that....then go to the car...

 

Vonn ,Do you have access to the back of panel .This is How I would attack it .I would build a 1/4 inch plate the size of the damaged area and contour .And I would screw the panel in from backside .Then just beat in with a body hammer .The big panel would be your dolly ,Otherwise you need two people to bang that out .If you feel comfortable cutting it out and welding go for it .From what I see you do nice work .Either way you'll be fine .

 

I do have a fellow HAMBer and friend that will show me, I will not go at it like a nut, and will wait for his wisdom and guidence. He was one of the first guys to tell me, "it should buff out"...lol
and it is what he does, so i respect his opinion.

I do have the "other" panel and thats why i prompted the question, thinking it would be easier, but i also see the value in learning how to get this back the way it should be.

I really do appreciate all the help, and offers. and do believe it is time for me to stop being afraid of a bunch of dents, and take the time to learn.

once my schedule and his comes together i will do my best to watch and learn, and hopefully get some hands on training in there also.

Soon the body will be back off the frame for other things, i've still got a ways to go. and those dents are not going to stop me. even if i have to roll with them in the steel until the right time comes around..obviously they are not going anywhere..

i do have some bigger fish to fry on this build. but all the experiance that has been given to me by others on this subject , lean toward it getting body hammered out.

so im not going to entertain cutting it out, unless it comes down to the last resort.

 

yeah i can get to the back..window is out, no interior

 

Hi Tim,

What you describe will work, but it is not necessary to heat metal to red hot in order to shrink. Low temperature shrinking is more controllable and leaves the metal less distorted and easier to hammer and dolly. Torch shrinking is fine. Most people just use way more heat than is required. Usually the metal will start to swell when it is hot enough to shrink. You quench and if there is steam the metal is shrinking in a repeatable controllable fashion.

He could just shrink the highs before hammer and dolly work as you describe, but that is not the best way to attack it because those stretched areas are not all stretch. Some of the metal is just pushed along with the stretched metal and does not need shrinking. The easiest way to determine what needs shrinking is to get the surface as close as possible to its original contours before hand.

Djust, The smaller shrinking discs are not nearly as good on a panel like that as the 9"-10" ones are. The larger disc floats over the surface, covering more area, and just works better. It will do a better job of highlighting areas that still need raising as well. I stopped using a file while metal-finishing after I figured this out.

John www.ghiaspecialties.com

 

Where you at I may be able to come by and take a look and bring some tools with me

PM me and maybe we can work something out



Tom

 

id practice see what i could do, then cut out and replace

 

haha im afraid thats how it would go with me too..
i would get it sooo close..than wamo..dammit

 

Thank you John. I'll try this on my next one. I appreciate the tips and guidance.

Tim

 

Hey Von Rigg,

Not that you need any more advise, atleast from me, but this post brought up some good points that probably should be touched on-

Each of those high areas in the panel, the ones caused by someone who knew nothing about metalwork, will require several shrinks to return them to normal conture. As Mr. Kelly stated, the larger shrinking disc, the 9'' one, will produce more heat and cover a larger area of the panel faster than the little 4.5'' ever dreamed of, and thus speed your repair time. To shrink the stretched areas with a torch would require using alot of gas and alot of relighting of the torch between shrinks. It would make for a long day!
Each action that you take to straighten this panel will build on the previous one. A process of comparing one action and its' result to the next, starting from the undamaged areas of the panel and working towards the center of the damage. As you bump down and shrink the highs and raise the lows, the panel will tell you where it needs to be worked next, if you work slowly and with a repair plan.
Oh, and alittle '' mud '' in a panel today is pretty common, I see million dollar street rods & kustoms with layers of plastic filler from headlight to taillight often. Try that stunt in a real restoration shop and watch your client pull his vehicle out in a New York minute!

Any metalman worthy of the name didn't wake up one morning with those skills, they got them the same way you will- learning them one dent at a time!

Good luck!

Meanwhyle, back aboard The Tainted Pork

 

I have the perfect Three Step Solution : Hammer, Dolly, Beer.
Repeat this sequence about 18 - 24 times and wallah ! !
Get out the torch and lead once the Beer's gone and you'll
have a perfect back panel. It always works for me ! ! !