There's a fellow who lives just North of me and has a Xerox of yours. He bought it out of Florida. Seems like he told me a City Policeman bought it new. Originally a 250 HP car, he swapped heads and cam and it's now a 283. He has the solenoid set-up on this car.
Pir8Darryl, stude_trucks, & Gotgas ... You damn Mopar guys are always trying to hijack GM Fuelie threads!
They had isuues but when they worked had good performance. They made improvements over the years but most were pulled and replaced with carbs because the were a hassle. I am on the Corvette sites a lot and there are some the swear by them but they are very commited. To most they are too finicky.
I remember an article about a speedshop in Florida (Best Damn Garage in Town, maybe??) that made a pretty good living pulling the FI units off and replacing them with carbs that ran better. The article quoted the owner as saying he had the fuel injection units "stacked under the work bench like cordwood." Larry T
This was probably the most common comment made about the rochester FI unit. When they worked, they were great, but usually they didn't and got replaced with a 4 BBL or two. 40 years ago you could get early FI units for next to nothing, as nobody wanted 'em. It would be interesting to hear the history of the Bendix FI/AMC story. I remember hearing about the work being done by the boys in Kenosha when I was a kid.
>>>>,in '65 when i was in the Air Force in Anchorage Alaska ,,i had a Dontov cammed 283 in a '54 Ford P/Up ,,,the Chevy Dealer gave me a '62 Rochester F I set-up that quit werking ,,and was replaced with a single four on the customers '62 'Vette ,,i took it home and fixed it ,,simple compared to the fuel control unit on the F-102's i werked on ,,I ran it for two years up there after gettin' outa the Air Force and staying there ,,one Sat nite at the Drive-Inn Rest ,,i ran into the guy with the '62 'Vette ,,and sold it back to him for a couple hundred bucks ,,and I went to dual quads on my 283 ,,my truck never ran as good as it did w' the Rochester F I ,,nor started as good in sub zero weather ,,
Frazer or Kaiser used a similar type supercharger in the early 1950's I believe.And Cord before that?
>>>>>If you go back to 1957 NHRA record book ,,the Supercharged Fords held the class record over the F I Chevys,, mater fact ,,Ford outsold Chevy in '57 ,,but,,,you sure don't see many '57 Fords left running around ,,nor at the big time Auctions ,,
And just to round out the discussion, Pontiac had a mechanical fuel injection setup available for the 347 in the '57-58 Bonneville. The '57s were all fuel injected, but it was an option for '58.
>>>>>,Before going to Alaska ,,in '62 & '63 , i was stationed at Roswell,N Mex ,,my roomate had a Rochester F I '57 Bonny Convertable ,,white over white w' red trim/interior ,,,neet car ,, but, in '63 , he traded it off for a '62 Honduras Maroon 409 4-speed Impala ,,,,to go faster ,,,lol,
Here's an article on that early Mopar electronic injection,maybe more complex than a new car http://www.allpar.com/cars/desoto/electrojector.html
Had a great experience running a '57 Rochester unit back in '62. It was as easy to rebuild as a 4bbl with a kit from the Chevy parts dept. It ran great, made lots of power and was no trouble for me if I kept good fuel supply filters on the upstream side of the unit. They were not favored by the pussy's.
My college commuter car was a '57 Bel Air 4 door hardtop. This was back in 1965-1968. It had a Rochester Fuel Injection unit on it. (I always believed it was a 1960 unit possibly). It did not have any cast fins on the top side. It only let me down once the whole time I had it. A one-time glitch caused the choke to malfunction and it went to full rich on a cold start one afternoon and proceeded to smoke out the neighbors. I always pulled 20-21 highway miles per gallon and 14 in town with a light foot most of the time driving this thing. I'd run the valves once or twice a year, changed the oil every 3 months, that was it! About 3 years into this car I pulled the unit and a guy in my town turned me on to this California tuner that sliced off the top, ported it out then Helli-arced it back together. My memory fails me at the moment but I remember the decal he sent me back with the unit had his name and logo on it. I slid his decal onto my glove box door. I think his name was Thomas.........Bill Thomas maybe???? I've got some pictures of it out in the garage. I'll try getting them scanned at work to throw out at you guys some day. The thing was very trouble free for me, wish I still had it. I did at one point change out the spider underneath, I replaced all the Bakelite material fuel nozzle blocks and I upgraded the nozzles to 327 spec size. Ran a little too rich, hurt mileage and performance, so I went back to the smaller nozzels.
I ran an early model one on my T-Bucket for years. Put close to 30K miles on it. The only problem I had was on a road trip one of the small copper lines from the spider to the nozzle broke at the ferrule. Stopped in a roadside park and was able to fix it by filing down the tube with my wife's finger nail file and driving the broken piece of tube out with a nail. At the first ever NSRA mini-nationals in Waco Texas, '72 I think, they were checking exhaust emmissions. The roadster passed with flying colors and then went on to win the streetkhana. I have a '65 unit I ran on my 34 Chevy for about 10 years, plan to put it on my soon to be completed 32 Roadster. They are not that complicated to work on.
I just have to tell this story..My dad worked for a used car dealer here in Des Moines, and when ever they got a Vette in with FI or 2 4's the dealer would have my dad replace it with a single 4 bbl manifold. In the meantime Dad is building a 37 chevy coupe, circa 1958 or 9, he bought what he thought was a 283. As it turned out it was a 265. I think he gave $75. He then saved his money and bought a Duntov cam. He was the first in the area to swap the knee action for a 40 Chevy independent front he wanted it to handle. Dad didn't want to give up the torque tube drive because he figured it would work like a traction bar, however the transmission was'nt that great for drag racing. he discovered while he had a 57 or 8 trans apart that all the close ratio gears would interchange except the main gear missed clearing by about an 1/8 inch. So he blued the case and marked it and hand filed the case so the gear would twist in. He talked the dealer out of both a Fuel Injection and dual fours for the car. He told me it would run 90 in 2nd gear at about 7000! I think it ran hi 14's at the Des Moines Drag Way..... To bad I was just a gleam in his eye then!
When I drove down to the Winternationals in '65, we stopped into Bill Thomas' shop. One whole wall was shelf after shelf with early FI units sitting on them...by the dozens, likely more than a hundred. Cheetahs used them for the street editions. There were way more FI units than he ever used on the few Cheetahs that were sold. dj
Dad bought his '57 new from Kirsch Chevrolet ( he worked there for a few years and was goo friends with the salesmen). He ordered a Harbor Blue convertible with fuel injection, but the salesman talked him out of it because "they were still working out the bugs, the wait was at least an extra month, and the 270hp engine would get you off the line faster- by the time the fuel injected car would catch up, you'd be across the finish line". While he never regretted buying the 2x4 setup, he always wondered what it would have been like having the fuel injection...
>>>>>,That Fuelie 283 in my '54 Ford pick up was driven all over southern Alaska ,,Moose huntin' up at Rainy Pass and down at the Kenie Penninsala,,hauled out a 1200 lb Moose several times,, the Polar Dragway opened in '64 ,,so that ole` truck saw time at the drag strip ,,but mostly was a street racer ,,nobody expected a '54 Ford P/Up having a 283 Chevy w' a 30-30 Duntov cam and a real live Rochester Fuelie on it ,,along w' a close ratio Muncie 4-speed ,, BUT,,,as time went by ,,sold the F I back to the guy w' the '62 'Vette it came off of,,,and in '68 ,the truck got a 396 BB and became a "Strip Only" drag racer ,, those were some great times ,,up there in the "Land of the Midnite Sun" ,,
I got two of the units just by replacing them with single 4 bbl intakes and carbs. both were rebuilt by a friend of mine who early on figured out what it took to get them to run right. I sold both of them before I had a chance to try them out as the new owners both came up with offers that far exceeeded what I had in them. Always regretted not keeping one or at least putting one on one of my engines but back then I was making loads of $$$'s buying, rebuilding and selling Chevrolet high peformance engines so "profit" always over ruled self indulgence. Frank
>>>>>,Yep,,,those ole` "Rockchester F I's" were dirt cheap back then ,,some were just thrown in the trash behind the Chevy Service Shops ,,free for the taking ,,,if only we knew eh???
>>>>>,The "Neet" ones were the '63 & newer ones ,with the chrome removable tops ,,had a buddy with a '65 Fuelie 'Vette ,,after seeing an article in one of the Hot Rod mags ,,where Bill jenkins,,Bill Thomas and Smoky Unick removed the side throttle body ,,made a new top and put two throttle bodies on top ,,and went and killed their Mod Production classes ,,we did it to my budies 'Vette ,,really werked great ,,amazing how much more air flow those later units wanted ,,
If you look closely at this photo you'll see Pontiac's fuel injection in 1957 although having similar components to the Chevrolet, and being functionally the same, was actually quite different. The entire unit was enclosed in a sheetmetal shroud and as a result didn't require filters on the nozzle blocks. The doghouse (plenum ram tube assembly) was constructed of sheet steel instead of cast aluminum and the fuel meter was under the doghouse instead of mounted to the side. This enabled a short, straight driveshaft from the distributor drive unlike the long curved one Chevrolet used. The air cleaner was clamped to a recess on the outside of the shroud instead of being bolted to the air meter. It also used a long intake tube that ran forward through the core support for cold fresh air (maybe this makes it the original Ram Air Pontiac) and was supplied with hot air from a chamber around the exhaust manifold when needed for warm up. For 1958, like Chevrolet, a cast aluminum doghouse was used (it simplified some vacuum connections and probably was easier to make in quantity), but the unit was still enclosed in a sheet metal shroud and the fuel meter was still underneath. In late 1972 or early '73 I had to buy a '57 Safari 4dr (TC) from a guy in Seattle because he wouldn't sell just a '57 injection unit to me unless I did. I found out later an aircraft mechanic from El Granada California had pulled it off a rusted out Bonneville destroyed in the Crescent City tidal wave and overhauled it. I even found he had tied off all the vacuum hose ends with wire, aviation style. Ran it on my 57 Safari 2dr for around five years. Rebuilt the 347 at 123K, used the 292 Crane cam from my 421 in it, bought a complete but not running Star Chief 2dr hardtop for the B&M Hydrostick upside down in the trunk and bolted it in behind the 347. No operational problems of any kind, it just ran like a scalded ape. Got into Camaros in the late '70s and sold the car, but did pull the F I off and kept it. I do wish I'd have just kept the whole car instead, but I still have the injection. Maybe one of these days it will be finally shown off in a hoodless Model A hot rod installed on my 421.
>>>>,Twofosho; is that why the Pontiacs didn't have that little whisle you could hear like the Chevy units ?? my roomates '57 Bonny didn't have it ,,, i noticed the bigger generator pulley with extra fan blades ,,so it wouldn't thro the belt off ,,where the stock Chevy (not the 'Vettes) had the stock generator ,,throwing belts at hi rpm was a problem with them ,,seems Pontiac was a step ahead ,,
I think fuel inj systems look awesome.. My dad's 57 had the original removed and then later replaced with a 60's verion. Here is something alittle more rare, his old 59 chevy fuelie car (he added the valve covers as he prefered the look over the stamp steel factory versions)
I used to love the ability to tune the whistle on or off on my 57 Bel Air. I had it whistling when I wanted to profile in it but I could tune out the whistle if I wanted to slip into stealth mode and do the sleeper drill. It was a real fun experience owning one of those things.
Exactly right, the shroud masked any whistling sounds because it completely enclosed the fuel injection unit. Seeing only filtered air inside the shroud also kept all the other components clean, except the distributor drive housing, of course, it being external to the shroud. For what ever reason, the unit I purchased was missing the F I specific exhaust manifolds and crossover, and the F I specific generator and bracket. Not worried about it being a restoration and being assured by the man that rebuilt the unit I didn't need the OEM stuff anyway, I just used the original ones to my Safari and ran without the balance pipe. Had the local Midas store put on a complete stock replacement dual exhaust system with one of their life time warranties. Although the unit came with the air cleaner and pieces to run the intake tube through the radiator saddle, it also came with a small diameter round one from a slant six Dart to run without the intake tube and that's what I ran. I also modified a four barrel manifold generator bracket to work with the F I and ran the original Safari generator, but this resulted in the little quirk of tossing that fan belt at high RPMs. No worries there, I'd just pull over, slide it back on, and go again. My favorite anecdote about the car; One day not long after I'd gotten it back up and running (I took the first test drive sans front bumper and it just didn't seem like a high priority to get it bolted back up), a couple of kids in an '66 SS396 Chevelle 4 speed convertible made the mistake of letting me roll out through the intersection and get up to about fifteen MPH with the Hydro locked in low gear (north on Williams Ave across Broadway if you're local to the Portland area, mind you this was in the early '70s) before they nailed it. Winding that 347 until I felt it flatten out up top, I would bump the stock column shifter to the next gear with my first two fingers. The right rear tire would let out a squall and I would gain half a car. At the top of third gear, and about 6 or 7 car lengths ahead, I just knew that generator belt was off again, so I coasted to a stop and parked neatly next to the curb. Hood up and putting the generator belt back on, I noticed the Chevelle had made the block and was pulling up behind me. Amazed I had beaten their Chevelle so bad, the occupants wanted a look at the motor. When one of them asked "Why does the air cleaner look so funny?", I simply answered "Gee man, I think they all looked that way back then". Poor guy, to this day he probably thinks ALL '57 Pontiacs came with air cleaners that look like that fuel injection shroud.
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