Hey, progress is progress! On your rpm problem, two things come to mind; spark advance and fuel filter, or possible a faulty condenser breaking down. Okay that was three things.
we have a new condenser in it but i guess it could've shit the bed too. we will try the above listed and continue on! haha.
Inside the distributor is a wire that connects the coil to dist wire thru an insulator to the points. This can fail in three ways; the insulation will chaffe and allow it to ground agaist the body of the dizzy as the breaker plate moves, the insulation will look OK, but inside the wires will be broken from years of flexing, and may disconnect as the breaker plate moves, and finally if some one has replaced it, it may be too stiff to allow the breaker plate to move. Mine was chaffed and grounding, I temporarily fixed it 6 years ago, by wraping it with silk thread, then covering the thread with rubber cement. Next consideration is the vacuum advance, which should be connected to ported vacuum on the carburetot. You can check it by connecting a vaccum pump to the line and see if it moves the breakerplate and holds it in place at any given vacuum level. Also make sure the coil wire is firmly seated in the distributor cap, they can sometimes look like they are installed all the way but are not. Finally, make sure your coil is conected properly for positive ground. The wire from the ign switch should go to the neg term on the coil annd the pos needs to conect to the points. The car will run connected incorrectly but will be much happier and perform better with the correct conections. Also check the fuel flow, as if it is restricted the engine will display moderate to high rpm dirveability problems. To test, disconnect the coil wire from the dist, unhook the gas line from the carb. Direct the discharge into a suitable container, and have an assistant crank the starter. Count the pulses of fuel as the pump discharges into the container. 12 pulses should yield 8 to 10 ounces of fuel. If you are getting less, assure your fuel lines are not restricted. Also some of the pumps have a fine brass mesh between the bottom and top chambers, This needs to be clean, as well as the hollow bolt the fastens the bottom cover on the lower chamber. Also assure that the rubber hose between the frame cross member and fuel pump inlet is not collapsing or sucking air. Some time they will look fine but the rubber gets mushy internally and will close off as the fuel pump builds suction. Blowing back some compressed air through the line from the pump inlet side to the tank can also clear the in tank pickup filter of any debris that might be restricting fuel flow also. Use the blow gun with outlet pressure about 15 lbs and give it a short blast through the line, you should be able to hear bubbles in the tank. Your initial timing setting should be TDC to 2 Before TDC. What plugs are you running. Most folks prefer AC 45, 46, or 47. What kind of condition are you spark plug wire in??? I am running a set of 6 cylinder universal (non resistor) from Tractor Supply Co. Good $20.00 investment. If none of this works, I have no further suggestions. Remember 90% of fuel problems are electrically related and 90% of electrical problems will be solved by proper fuel flow.
WOW Thanks so much!we think we have it narrowed down to a fuel problem. purchased the spark plug wires from tractor supply today. he's been at it all morning going through everything and he's buffing right now...needed a break from the frustrating side of things. hopefully tomorrow we'll get this all narrowed out and she can be back on the road.
Also check the coil after it has been running for a while, theocoil should be moderately warm, if you can not rest your hand on it because its too hot that is a sign of a failig coil. Any coil can be used to replace it for testing purposes as long as it not labled as internally resisted, sae goes if it needs to be replaced, no need to look for a purpose listed 6V coil, any non resisted coil will do just fine as long as it fits the mountig bracket.
thanks again plym46. we pretty much think we have it figured out that its something electrical. betty has a fuel bowl and everything is clean. We replaced the rubber hose you referred to last summer. we got a new coil from a model a/model t friend. Seems to be holding its own. i had to start and run betty so my boyfriend could work on her and i witnessed how she runs. she runs like crap when shes cold. she never used to. once she runs and warms up; she gets a little better. when shes in neutral and you step on the gas...at a certain RPM she doesnt want to go anymore. motor shakes around, she sputters, etc. Just runs crappy once you hit a certain rpM. we changed the spark plugs and wires with no additional improvement. a new dist cap came in today so hopefully a simple fix will fix our big problem. will keep everyone updated
when we first started running the car last summer she ran awsome. could take her for a loooong drive without issue. this problem with the coil/electric got progressively worse over time until right now she just doesnt want to run at all. will keep posted....
sounds like the timing might be a bit off. you might have inadvertently moved the dizzy while working on everything else. if not timing, then check the point gap. then check the fuel delivery as plym46 said. when the motor can't rev any higher, spritz some gas or starting fluid or gas from an unlit propane torch (just a little) into the carb's air horn (air filter off). does it get better? if so, then fuel starvation. if the motor stays the same or gets worse, then ignition. be careful doing this so you do not lose your eyebrows the hard way. you can try slightly advancing the dizzy when the motor is at its 'bad' rpm and see if that changes anythng. no need for a timing light, just slightly advance it and leave it where it runs best. you can go back and check it with a light later. if changing the timing makes no difference, then just put it back to where it was. in general, miss at idle = ignition and miss at speed = fuel. sounds like your motor can't get past a certain rpom, so that is why i suggested what i did.
Thanks! we poured gas down the carb yesterday and it made it worse...to thepoint of almost stalling so which led us to think ignition/electrical issue. We took the carb off tonight, cleaned it (it was mildly filthy) and made a new gasket for it. Thought maybe we had a vacuum issue with the old gasket (it was slightly falling apart). Didnt seem to help the issue. We are ordering a carb rebuild kit for it tomorrow and will have it in for our night time work hours on the car. We have a mechanic who knows a lot about older stuff coming tomorrow night to help us work out the bugs. We really want to get this car on the road for a wednesday night cruise...but the cruise is about an hour away. Not sure if she'll make it there but if we can fix our problem we will be able to make it there. Took her for a short drive around town. Made it home with out dying but towards the end she started to run crappy-sputtering along. We maybe did a 10 min drive. fingers crossed we can figure it out tomorrow . Thanks again everyone! Betty needs to make it to the show wednesday! we've had our hearts set on it!
Did you do the fuel flow capacity test???? If it starts and idles but cuts out at moderate rpm, it sounds like fuel. There is a porous bronze filter on the fuel pick up in the tank. If it gets cruded up it will flow OK at idle but not under load and or cruise. blowing the air back through will clear it, at least for a while. Try running it without the gas cap in place also, could be a tank venting problem also.
Two things: When you add gas down the carb throat, you do not want to pour it down as that will overwhelm the motor and it will flood. That might have been what almost happened, if you poured gas down. You want to spritz the gas in using a sprayer, or an unlit benz-o-matic, or some ether (starting fluid). It does not take much to see if it makes an improvement. You say that the car started running poorly after you drove it a bit. I wonder if you have a different type of problem. If there is some crap in the tank, maybe it is covering the fuel inlet in the tank. The more it runs, the more it gets covered, to the point where you are getting fuel starvation. When the motor is shut down, the crap slowly falls back down to the bottom of the tank, and it runs again. This type of problem does occur. There are many ways to diagnose it. One easy way is to set up a gravity siphon from a lawnmower gas tank or a gallon jug or whatever you have on hand. Run the siphon right into the carb, bypass the fuel pump and everything. Make sure everything is secured and take it for a drive. If it lasts more than 10 minutes, you might be on to something. This does not mean you are wasting your time with the other things you are checking and improving. Your car might have several little things wrong with it, and even if not these things (like the carb rebuild) will need to be done anyway. It is all part of the price of joining the old car club. You guys will be fine and soon this will all be behind you.
well thank you to everyone for the helpful words! oh and we didnt pour it down the carb haha, poor choice of words. The guys spent 5 hours las tnight fiddling with everything and adjusting everything just right. Good news is that she is running PERFECT right now. We had some majoy issues with a new set of points we purchased (quality chinese work) and so we did some minor work to the old set (better quality) of points and threw them back in the car. once those were dialed in; she ran good as new (on top of everything else we did last night). We are planning on taking her to the cruise tonight. lets hope we make it there
NICE!!! Good luck, wish I was ready to cruise up to Middletown tonight. I guess now I'm hoping to be done for the 4th of July. Do you guys want that old dodge bumper I have? Chuck
hahaha. pretty much. we just about made it 30 feet in 30 seconds hahaha. then they crapped out. typical. we're special ordering some points for it so hopefulyl we can make it there and back tonight. a friend is going to follow us in his 57 chevy so we'll have an extra set of hands to push her off the road
well we made it there and back without issue! She ran the best she's ran since we bought her! Couldn't be more thrilled. Unfortunately just as we were getting to leave, our half of the state got hit with a thunderstorm, Our buddies '57 Chevy was having shifter issues, and my brother was waiting for the rain to pass back at home in order for him to drive the real vintage mini cooper that has no windshield wipers. haha. We were delayed over an hour from leaving but we made it there eventually. Show was GREAT. lots of fantastic cars and a GREAT turnout. we had a nice little convoy of cars with us the ride there and the ride back...all driven by the younger generation Stopped at a local diner in Meriden for some dinner and there was an entire group of elderly women and two elderly guys having dinner. Should've seen the looks on their faces when we pulled in ...priceless. The 2 guys had to come out as we were leaving to see Betty. Turns out one of them took their driver's test in a '49 plymouth and quote "this car brings back a lot of great memories!" ...was really great to hear. On top of that they though she was a two door hahaha. Oh well. Great night out; great friends, good food, and lots of laughs. fun was had by all. Be sure to check out my middletown cruise thread for entire photos.
Good to hear you got Betty running right! Sometimes its the little thinks that don't ordinarily go bad that have us running around in circles. Been there more than I care to remember. I like those pics too. The car looks great!
Hey Betty looks great. And proving the point your fuel problem was electrical. When you get points, make sure you aorder them by the distirbutor number located on the sheetmetal info tag on the distributor. MOPAR used a few different numbers, and though they will interchange as a unit, they are not the same, body heights and cap depths are different, some have the points on top of the cam some on the bottom and they are not the same. rotors are different also. And lots of cars got fixed by swapping stuff around. My 46 coupe has a 56 engine with a 54 Dodge truck Distributor. Also if you haven't already noticed it's a a lot easier to work on the dist with it out of the car. Just reference the body position to the block and the rotor position to the body and pull it out and mount it in the vise. A lot easier to get the points gapped proplerly withthe rubbing block on the high point of the breaker cam. Don;t forget the rubbing block lubricant. Glad you had a good time. Keep he going.
WOW! Awesome thread, I felt like I was there with you guys thw whole time! Funny, I dont even know you but when I got towards the end of the thread and saw the finished pro pics I was so frickin proud. My wife and I are working on a P/U and hope it looks half as good as you car does. Take care...
wow! thanks so much! we might have to strip her all back down to bare metal and start over again. we will find out next thurs. if we do; we will wait until next winter. so muc for the next project in line
we ran to the store and bought some rain-X wipes. we were the lucky ones. everyone else sucked pond water on the way there haha.
long story. basically our clear wont cure. we've tried about 4 different products to buff it and it keeps scratching. you could put a fender gaurd towel down on the front fender to work on the engine and it scratches the hell out of it. really sucks. we finally have a dupont rep coming out to look at it this coming thursday. They even admit something is wrong over the phone. One of the front fenders also ha ssomething funky going on. it looks spotty white and blueish if you really look close at it. can't really describe it. So something funky happened there. We had a paint rep from a different company look at it at the car show. He was there working on something for a friend at the shop when we were putting the doors back on. He knew the car and is in love with it. He came down with another rep from their company and took a look at the car. basically he said that something isn't reacting right with eachother and the clear is refusing to cure. our issue with the roof cracking is a result of a bad reaction. As the sun hits the car more and more; the problem will get worse. he said the issue with the fender is a bad reaction also and it baically is going to get worse with more exposure to the sun as it tries to cure. He said the paint will basically start to crack and remove itself from the car. super thrilling. We are going to wait for the dupont rep to come look at it thursday and we will go from there. He already knows how unhappy we are
Looks great in the pics at the show! Hopefully these companies figure out what went wrong with their product and help you in getting it rectified ($ would be nice).
yes money for paint and labor would be really nice but we'r enot holding our breath. the fact that its not perfect and is only going to get worse really bugs us. understandably. will keep everyone posted on the situation. Just want the car to look the way we intended.
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