Projects Giant speedster project

Jerry,

Supposedly you can start a primed engine by advancing the spark. I have heard this was used by chauffeurs to restart cars; they would retard the spark and choke the engine before shutting it of, then when they had to go they would just turn on the ignition advance the spark and Whom it would kick over. I have never tried it but have wanted to.

By the way I like the red over dark red paint idea, I also think subtle gold pin striping would look great and pay homage to its' origins. Nothing overt, just outlining of panels and "Seagrave Special" in script, but I still can't help but think that cowl would look good polished. Summer project for the kids maybe?

Don

 

Don,

You can start some early engines on compression but they need to have a vibrator coil system like a Model T Ford or a vibrator to make a distributor coil give a constant spark. The early 4 cylinder Cadillacs and Buicks have a vibrator that is controlled by a button on the ign. switch. Sometimes if you push the button it will fire the engine. Moving the spark lever will help get the points to close if they are near the right position. It is kind of a crap shoot whether they will start or not without having to crank the engine but worth a try in any case.

A regular coil & distributor system could deliver a single spark if it had stopped in the exact position of the points almost opening. Moving the spark lever could cause the points to open & trigger the coil. I think starting would be rare with this situation. I have messed with a lot of old cars & it has never happened yet.

I have driven a 1912 Rolls Royce Silver Ghost quite a bit with a similar system & if you start it by hand once, it will always start on compression for the rest of the day & sometimes the next day as well. It has a 6 cyl engine so you have a better chance of having a cylinder in the right position to start & it has a very sophisticated ( & typically complicated) vibrator system.

Jack

 

I heard new car manufacturers were toying with a starterless system where the computer senses which piston is up, squirts in some gas and fires the plug. What's old is new. What's new is old. Except for me. I'm just old.

Jerry

 

Misc.

I got out my new finger joint router bit and experimented with joining wood. A while back I drew up a pattern for a steering wheel. I figured 22.5 degrees on each joint. One problem is the router bit only cuts about an inch so I've got to index it. I glued 2 segments of pine together as a test. Next I welded up some steel channel I had in order to experiment with windshield shapes. The final frame will be made of brass and attached to the cowl with some custom brackets that will fit the round castings on the cowl top. You can vote on which windscreen you like best. Or offer other suggestions. I'm not that taken with what I've come up with so far.

Jerry

 

Not sure it'd be any easier, but safer: make a 1" wide metal circle of the right diameter, and attach it to the spokes. Then attach your shaped (half-round) wood to the front and back of the circle. That way the wood isn't a structural piece, and if one of the glue joints fails, you've still got something to hang on to.

 

Jerry,

On old style boat wheels, the wood was made up in three layers, offset, so the middle joint fell under the outer pieces, and then all three layers were screwed together. a similar method may have been used on the early auto wheels. If I find any good close up photos of early wheels I'll try to figure out how to post them. I tried to pull a wheel today for my own project, but had no luck. so I'm going to watch your' progress closely because I think I might build by own wheel as well.

I love split vee windshields, but a pair of Brooklands windscreens would look very appropriate on an early special. They were required by the Brooklands track and very common on performance cars of the day. You could even attach them to the four holes in the cowl if you don't already have plans to mount something else there. What ever you decide, I am always amazed by your' aesthetic.

Jack, thanks for the information on compression starting, I don't remember where I red about it, and had thought it might have involved a magneto, but was never sure.

Don

 

Jerry,

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vtg-...1920s-Buick-Dodge-/170622741201#ht_3035wt_939

Good close up of wheel construction.

Don

 

Jerry,

If you don't want to go the full windshield route here is a picture of the Brooklands-style windscreens I made from lexan and aluminum stock.

 

Jerry,

I would suggest a straight, low, folding windscreen like the original Chitty Chitty Bang Bang car had. Brooklands windscreens (or one for the driver only) behind that would really add to the racy look.

The split V shaped windshield seems a little new for the look you have captured so well.

Note the fenders on both Bentleys. The "Thunder Guts" car has lots of forgiving rivets & seams.

Jack

 

wind screen????
aviator goggles and a snotty kercheif

quit adding weight to this racing .... uh .... er ... machine ......

 

Great input you guys! I think I need to simplify the wheel construction. I was looking at some old wheels I have and they have only two joints in them. A couple only have one joint. Steam bent? The windscreen definitely needs some more pondering. I've always liked Brooklands screens but I wanted to do something unconventional. A buddy suggested two monocles. Never seen that before. But maybe that's a bit too old. The kids went to camp yesterday so I should get some quality time with the speedster.

Jerry

 

Hey! I race with that guy! Anyone know who he is?

 

Brian Johnson -- guitarist for AC/DC - he does race the car!

 

Paint

I couldn't stand it anymore. I need to start assembling the speedster for real! I began by taking the whole thing apart. I got all the sheet metal off and some of the shifter mechanism and battery box. Before I paint though, I've got to take out the transmission and replace the front seal or whatever passes for a front seal. The thing leaks oil everywhere. Paintwise, it's going to be difficult to spray the inner frame side because I'm not stripping the engine and various other parts out. I think I'll brush paint the inner frame black. That'll make it easier to mask off the rest. No one will see the black anyway unless they lift the floor boards. Everything else on the chassis will be deep red. But what exact color...

Jerry

 

He was the second fastest lap on Top Gear by a tenth of a second. In the interview he said the Bentley he races gets him sometimes when he stabs for the brake...because the throttle is the center pedal!

 

A little earlier than the period you are working in, but this Mercer has an interesting round "monocle" windshield.

 

Jerry,

You might try steam bending the wood for the rim. I've only seen monocles on open bodywork cars myself, but try a mock up, it might work.

Don

 

Never seen him race the Bently but he does race a Lola T70 and a Royale. His wife races a 914-6

Sorry for the hijack Yonharr

 

thats the ticket a monacle and a eye patch and a harem girl's veil... or santa beard


full on oxblood red with shades of black and red lightened by adding gold tintbase... shooting for a bronze-vermillian or blood on copper

 

I was thinking about your wheel covers today, have you considered metal ethcing them with the " Seagrave Special" like you did on your intake?

 

I'm going to metal etch the hub caps just like Seagrave hubcaps. Any thinning of the pie pans will weaken the discs.

I forgot my camera today. I took out the transmission and dismantled the front flange and seal. It was a felt affair and had disintegrated long long ago. I believe I can put in a modern seal 100x80x10 with very little machining. The front bearing is pretty noisy. There again, I might find a modern replacement. Meanwhile, I going to finish dismantling so I can paint the chassis. I'd like to get it taped up and on jack stands by this weekend.

Jerry

 

Strip it off!

No I'm not talking about A. Weiner. The Seagrave is stripped off. I had to finish up a few loose ends like drilling holes and installing bolts in cross members. I'm going to move the chassis to an empty rental shop I have and get it ready for painting. That'll also give me room to do the bondo work on the body. The flange with the four little holes and the one big hole is the part that holds the front transmission seal. The bearing is next to it. I found a bearing that'll fit for $57 and the seal is around $15.

Jerry

 

go go go go go go

 

Are you going to make the space under the boat tail section accessible for storage? Flip forward seat or hatch door on the side?

Jon

 

Storage, yes. I thought about a side (golf?) door and still may do one. Flip seat? Actually, the passengers face backwards. There's no leg room if they face forward. Also with all the noise, their heads will be close to the driver for communication. I'm going to line the inside with longitudinal battens.

Jerry

 

Moving day

I finished a few details then loaded the speedster up for a trip across town--about 5 minutes. We've only got 4 street lights in the county. Now the Seagrave is back were it started when I first got it. Instead of painting the inside of the chassis black as I thought, it'll be just as easy to brush paint it whatever shade of red I decide--dark, dark I think, almost maroon. I'm working on that now. The NAPA store had a real nice paint color display with great colors but they wanted $400/gal. That's a little steep for me. Lots of other alternatives.

Jerry

 

This is the only time I'll recommend using implement paint, to do the inside of the frame rails! Maybe a nice Massey Ferguson red...

Brian

 

Jerry,

Here are some pictures of my 1911 Model 32 Buick. I just had the back half of the body & gas tank re-painted & thought you might like to see a real cherry red sans photoshop & airbrushing.

The color is very close to some of the original paint on the frame under the seat. These cars were painted exactly as this one with no pinstripe & the only black is the rad shell. This car has never been apart & restored totally.

The paint code for the 2004 Dodge Dakota in the background is an exact match. Easy to find if you wanted to try it.

Jack

 

Pictures -- maybee