I also took shots of the magna flux machine (A huge electro magnet) and the dark light used to look for cracks...
Started cleaning up the frame and removed the center trans mount with the plasma cutter. The crappy Eastwood model took a dump so I got the Miller X-treme which I am extremely happy with!
This is the invoice for my 53' flatty build... I know I can trim some fat like $685 for offy heads? Speedway has em' for $599.00 free shipping... Also what is $2,400.00 engine kit (everything included mean?) Where do I draw the line between nickel and diming vs. being taken to the cleaners... HAMB Brethrin Please Advise...
Them' flatheads aren't cheap are they. Looks like they are doing a complete long block for you and breaking it in? You could always assemble it yourself.
The three things that jumped out at me were: 1. Ck Align hone: This seems like part of the machining process to me. 2. New Offy heads: A little on the expensive side, but remember your machine shop probably bought them from Speedway for the same price you can, spent the time to place the order, paid shipping and marked them up a few bucks. Doesn't seem too bad. 3. Complete engine kit (everything): I don't even know what to say about this. Obviously this doesn't include pistons, connecting rods, heads, etc., but what DOES it include? Didn't you reuse your intake and carbs? Didn't you reuse your water pumps? At first glance this is the only portion that really looks like highway robbery. Get a detailed, itemized list from them. Tell them you're honestly concerned about the price and NEED to know where your investment is. It's a legitimate question that a concerned customer is allowed to ask, and if they balk at it they may be hiding something. We need to know a lot more. Saxon is right, flatheads aren't cheap. My dad is into his 8BA about $4300 with a cleanup bore/hone, new pistons, new connecting rods, reground crank, new cam, Aluminum flywheel, Offy heads and Offy intake, adjustable lifters and more. No carbs and this point, but if we're lucky we'll see 180 hp out of a $5200 engine. But oh the sound of a hot flatty!!!!.... mmmmmmmmm..... dreamy........
I am not averse to building it myself... But I just don't have time with all that is going on right now... If I get a breakdown of "everything" and it checks out should I pull the trigger? Further they are also putting the accessory oiling system in rather than using the RDT cooling which sucks... On the whole I don't mind paying a little more (that's the price of admission) just as long as it's fair... I just don't want to get raped...
I hear ya brother. What I imagine is in "everything" would be bearings, seals, gaskets and assembly labor, but those materials shouldn't total more than a few hundred bucks at the most. A knowledgeable builder would have it together in no more than 6 hours, and at say $65 per hour shop rate it doesn't add up. Hopefully they will have a better explanation before we assemble a lynch mob. It may be perfectly reasonable after all, we just need details. I will say, setting flathead valves/lifters ain't for novices. Hopefully they have the flathead valve tool on hand or labor could go way up!
I'm tracking what you just said except for one thing... in their quote they are already charging me "$800.00" for Engine assembly... There are a bunch of other parts that I am not re-using... The only thing I am re-using is the block, con-rods, carbs, intake, mains and crank... all the other "stuff" they are supplying I assume. They were even willing to paint it for me, but I am painting it myself. They will also use glyptal to seal the pores... I think its within ball park, no? Hold on to them pitch forks for now fellahs! More to follow!
What you doing for a cam and valves? "Further they are also putting the accessory oiling system in rather than using the RDT cooling which sucks..." misc Almost $1000 in heads and breakin' oil. It's probably livable if they are giving you a turnkey flathead.
Wow! Just read the whole thread, good job dude. I'll be honest, I had my doubts after seeing the first few pages of pics but you are really turning this thing around. The $2400 for an engine kit does seem kinda high to me, maybe a typo? Anyway, keep up the good work man, gonna be watching this one.
Thanks for the words... The more I dug the more I found. After listening to Daddio I made the final decision to do it properly and not just fix the interior and drive on...
And a good and safe and expensive decision it was! But don't give me any credit, you're doing the work. I just told you what you already knew.
wow, well now i understand what a ratrod is from the build point of view.. meaning how it was assembled. ( saw a video of one which i thought i understood with missing lugnuts and what not.. but damn if they are all like this im afraid to be on the road with them) damn scary!11 how could someone even think that is safe? im glad you listen.. cause honestly how that was before.. scary!!!! and im one to even take a risk from time to time.. will be following this and keep up the great work. you rock. chris.
Sorry, can't do that... All credit MUST be given to Daddio Almighty conveyor and purveyor of all things rod of hot. Not to be mistaken with Whisky the one time believer in rod of rat... LOL
So I visited the Machine Shop yesterday and they explained things to me... The $2400.00 includes: Pistons, valves, hardened seats, springs, Camshaft, seals, bearings, gaskets. The Owner/Head engine builder Justin Brangers said I could order any parts he felt were cheaper such as the Offy Heads etc... I am a KY dealer also so they negated tax. However, he said he is used to using certain products for pistons/valves/seats etc and preferred his suppliers for those items. On the whole he seemed very reasonable. I put $3k down... Let the fun begin!!
I am re-using the rods... (not in the 2400) but the R&R pistons has me wondering... They were pretty jacked up pistons and I don't see how they could have even try to salvage them... Maybe another 80 bucks saved?? Either way I have saved close to $400.00 just by talking with the guy. Further the accessory oiling pathway is an ADDITIONAL 100-150 bucks... I also discussed PCV provisions into the intake which I could do but he said he probably wouldn't even charge me for it... He will help with rear end/driveline and trans etc so I am building a relationship with him and don't want to jeopardize it as he said he would cut me breaks along the way... The guys particular about stuff and quirky so I don't want to question him too much or nickel and dime him or he'll tell me to take a hike. PS I forgot to mention the water pumps mine look like shit, all pitted and what not so I need to replace em' also I am not sure about the MSD ignition etc... PLease advise.
The oiling addition is well worth the effort, do it! However I don't think the PCV will do uou any good. Is the MSD new or was it there when you bought the car? I'd try to re-use it, they're good. Speedway has pretty good water pumps from what I hear, but I haven't used them myself.
Yes on oiling addition PCV may not create much impact but looks the dogs biscuits (at least when I'm done with the polished stainless lines) MSD will be a new addition Chrome or painted on H20 pumps... what would u do?
Painted for sure, and for two reasons: 1. Chrome draws the eye to it, and there's not really anything cool (no pun intended) about a water pump. I'd speed the money chroming more aestheticly pleasing parts that to DO want people to notice. 2. Have you ever had a chromed thermostat housing? Did it leak? Yep, i thought so.
I just sifted through all 35 pages..... not sure why. It started as a train wreck but has gotten better. Why? The car you bought was pretty much every HAMB members definition of a RAT ROD. And you fit the general description of a FNG. Little by little, the car and you, have gotten up to speed on what it takes to build a real hot rod. The suspension? You did the right thing. Toss it as far away as possible. There are many suppliers who can sell you good parts that will work. The frame? What will new steel cost versus trying to salvage the previous builders abomination? A perimeter frame from a HAMB alliance member may be a wise investment. The engine? A flathead is a great choice..... if it fits the rest of the build. I notice you still intend to use an alternator. Disc brakes? Other details of a build detract from what should be a traditional hot rod. The body? You've said several times that you are a metal fabricator. Me too. I've been at it for 30 years. I still learn new things all the time. I have all the fancy tools, but I wouldn't waste my time on that T body when I know a far better one can be had cheaply. I too love a challenge but when you see how thin and deeply pitted that body is, you will end up with a body that is 90% fabricated and 10% original Ford steel. Your attitude? I'm amazed at how positive and enthusiastic you've remained. Very impressive. As far as the tough guy posing B.S., flipping the bird, shock and awe, and related crap...... there must be a place for it, but I just don't feel like this (the HAMB) is it. Carry on.
Thank you for taking the time of sifting through the post, your words mean a lot to me. Will carry on.
I'd go with the Isky 400Jr. Make sure you get adjustable lifters. Ask/check about 1.6" dia. stainless chevy valves. Read this, start at post #18. "A Flathead for the Road "
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