Features VINTAGE SPRINT CAR PIC THREAD, 1965 and older only please.

After a season of "barnstorming" with the Carl S "Boyle Valve Spl.", I have posted a lot of "in car" video from the tracks we visited, including the two mile tracks at Fontana & Michigan, The Phoenix Mile, The Milwaukee Mile, the half mile high banks at Winchester and, even, the odd little quarter mile Mt. Lawn Speedway.

Have a look!!!


http://www.youtube.com/user/macmiller46241

 

Josh;
The #10 at Flemington, N.J. URC race.

 

How cool is this?? Bill Akin and his Bardahl Special 1953 Kurtis was one of two cars that lapped the infamous Churchill Downs!! Bill says this was scary and like driving on marbles..the car also won first in class at the Louisville Concours on October 2, 2011..not bad for a Tennessee redneck that does all of his own work at home on his 3 vintage indy roadsters.

 

Thanks for the photo and heads up on this event. Terrific to see Bill and Joe Freeman (in his Deusy) slinging dirt in their beautiful concours winning cars.
I happened to drive by Churchill while towing the car home from Indy just a few weeks ago and and reflected a moment on the early motor racing that took place there and at other State Fair dirt miles.

Hope to see Bill at Millers Milwaukee in July.

fwiw: A nice story (more to come) on the occasion from The Old Motor.
http://theoldmotor.com/?s=nikrent

 

Sure appreciate you and Indyrjc running the car for me at MIS, IMS, Salem, Terre Haute and Winchester.
Was really looking forward to joining you all at Darlington-their cancellation a great dissapointment.
Now getting ready for The Santa Barbara Concours Salute to Indy and then 3 day Salute to Indy on track at Havasu City AZ
Carl Schulz
Indio, CA

 

.....'carl, I really wish that you could have stopped at Churchill Downs, and pleaded with security to let you guys in and then posed for pictures with the Boyle Valve Special on the main straight-away in front of the twin spires.

The picture that 32STUPRES posted of Bill Akin "hot-lapping" in his Bardahl Special on arguably this country's most famous dirt track is a picture for the ages. Wow!

Here is the link which includes that pic and others along with the complete rundown and story:

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=30698

 

Thanks!

Alone, tired and old on the road I just didn't have the presence of mind to think about it. But next year maybe they will offer the same opportunity and I will be able to put it on the schedule.

http://mhtjef.smugmug.com/MotorSports/Millers-at-the-Mile/18141826_WGhCXz#1392853128_HvnwTg3-M-LB

 

Bill Watson's Crack'n Riley Special at Hershey AACA Fall Meet 10-7-11 on track day. Bill's in the middle with his son's and his grandson has the best seat in the house. enjoy!

 

This looks like Randy Hannigan's car from just a few years ago. I'm pretty sure I saw this car at Wayne County at an Allstar race.

 

With the wings and the stubby little tail and the "bill boards" on the sides of the cage in my humble opinion this car looks like shit.

 

I agree. I was wondering why it's on this thread?

 

To paraphrase Bob Dylan " The answer my friends is blowing in the wind". Or in other words, the problem with ugly race cars around the world is the aero package supplanting design aesthetics. As much as we may look back to the 1960's as a Golden Age of open wheel racing, the thirst for more grip was annually adding wings and thinner, less-upright body sections to open-wheel designs around the world. As teams yearned to understand and validate their aerodynamic experiments, we saw the first usage of wind tunnels occur in the mid 60's and by the end of the 70's nearly all major series' race cars spent time in the wind tunnel. The world-beating aero game-changer was the Lotus 79 ground effect design that took Mario to the F1 title in 1978. At Indy, the game-changer was the similar Chaparral 2K that cruised to the Indy 500 win in 1980. Both of these cars did not have any other significant performance advantage over their competition except for aero so with other teams wanting to win too, the race was on to hire aerodynamicists, spend more time in the wind tunnel and usually the result was aesthetics be damned!

Fast-forward to 2011...knowledge of aerodynamics which has defined such a narrow window of optimum performance so as to lead us to nearly identical designs, shapes, executions of bodywork and aerodynamic appendages within each series and as CFD time, wind tunnel time is exorbitantly expensive, once series or teams find 'the answer' to their aero question, they're not going to spend more money looking to make 'the answer' prettier just for our sakes...no, they usually find themselves with a very simple basic shape that lacks visual refinement-thus the ugly race car. There have been some decent looking aero race cars through the years...some of the last Champ Car Eagles, Panozes, Lolas and Swifts were actually quite good looking-much better looking than today's Dallaras, or much more so than the next Indy Dallaras. Some of the LeMans cars have been quite good looking over the years as their full-body envelopes help encompass their aerodynamic needs elegantly. Plus some of the F1 cars have been quite good looking too but in a purpose built manner more so than an elegant one. Today's F1 cars remind me of Russian fighter jets in that they both have a mix of elegance and visual brutality that arrest your attention and put your aesthetic sensitivities in check.

As USAC, WoO, sprinters, midgets and other series that may not have the CFD ability or wind tunnel time struggle with adding aerodynamic performance to their traditionally shaped bodies, we sometimes find ourselves with slab-sided, flat panels filled with billboard-style advertisements instead of the more developed elegant aerodynamic solutions...thus ugly racecars.

What's the old saying? " If it looks fast, it probably is? " With the aero discipline being so very dominant today, I don't know if that still holds true anymore...The other more basic issue is what we call in the industry 'Design Love' meaning that if you love your design, you will fret, obsess, refine, rework it until it's as perfect as you can make it...you don't see that a lot in flat-paneled slab side racecar bodies today-not enough design love...Lujie Levosky had design love, Jackie Howerton has design love, Colin Chapman had design love, Dan Gurney has design love, Harry Miller was just filled with design love...so was Frank Curtis, AJ Watson and the list goes on....Aero and a lack of Design Love...that is the problem blowing in the wind my friends.

Now with that said, I'm still going to Saturday's USAC Midget/Silver Crown doubleheader at Toledo Speedway...see you there.

 

airplanes aren't square and flat

 

You said a lot in 5 words, Roy.

 

HA!....Yea! If i want to see ugly, I can go walk around in the local Target and
K mart for free.

mac miller in INDY

 

Hey Dick
Hows this for a slick sprinter, maybe 64 at the Fair, anybody know who drove it.

 

I don't mind the looks of this car, but it doesn't look like a sprint car. If you have followed this thread and read my posts, then you know how I feel about the "new look" cars. Before the wings, there were roll cages and I just wrote about my opinion on cages. The "down tube" cars do actually incorporate the roll cage into the main design of the new sprint car better than the old bolt on cages. I don't think it would take much to bring style into these newer cars. You're right, get rid of all the square and flat pieces and install nice rounded body work. There is no stopping the design the sprint cars are now taking, however maybe they need to be called something else and another design trend should be started. I like the idea of the "down tube" cars with vintage style rounded bodies on them - and yep - with a full size tail. The newer cars look like Transformers and the old cars looked like beautiful women. Some of you rich guys should buy a new chassis and install an old body on it. And, by the way, I didn't orginally post the photo in question, I used it as a "quote" and asked the gentleman a question (in a nice way) if this is on the right thread. A bunch of photos have been posted recently that are of post 1969 cars - and stock cars. Nobody else seems to have any more pre 1969 photos of sprint cars. Although I don't feel the newer cars are nearly as attractive as the older, I applaud people for giving us something to look at. A lot of the older cars posted on this thread aren't "sprint cars" anyway. Now, instead of everyone getting upset over some pictures, maybe some vintage look can be salvaged. The old days are gone and no amount of bitching will bring them back. Chevy, Ford, Chrysler, all have brought back a "vintage" look - some more successful than others. Yet, all of these cars have modern safety and comfort features built in. I really think a real racing division - competitive, not for show - could be started without a lot of trouble and expense. USAC would be the most logical place to start. I'm old, poor, and far removed from today's racing, so I'm not the guy. If some of you agree and would like to see wingless rounded sprint cars actually competing, then maybe some of you can do something about it. I hope you can.

 

That is beautiful. Looks like the track is going to be moist. Are those two levers on the right weight jackers? Love the knobby.

 

The pictures of the winged cars were taken mostly at Latimore valley The home of the Eastern Museum of Motor Racing were they preserve the history of motor racing, winged sprint cars are part of motor racing history.

 

They surely are but this thread was primarily aimed at non wing cars (as indicated by it's title) when Josh started it.

Roo

 

Excellent!!! Thanks!