This T700R4 thing is driving me nuts...

I've read most of threads over the past year or more I guess.
I have got the lockup thing sorted and the ****** installed in to my early f100.

I am very aware of burning the ****** if the tele cable is not set correctly.
I have asked a couple of my local ****** guys, who have all said it is easy and I wont even need to let them do it, just set it up and drive it and then adjust it if the shifts are not feeling right.

Well, I driven it around the block a few times and once it gets hot/warm I start to get some smoke coming up thru the floor which appears to be from the ******.
So I gave up on it for a while and did some thinking.
I was not able to come up with any new ideas until a buddy of mine referred me to Utube.

A search of Utube revealed that I should set the tele cable by having the throttle wide open and the hitch the tele cable to the carby position ensuring that the tele cable remains tight/taut.

I've done this and driven it again, shifts better than my original setup method given by my local ****** guys.
It even shifts into OD at about 40mph, but still I am getting smoke up thru the floor once the ****** get to running temp.

The engine is a 350 SBC with a quadrajet carby (diff is 3.55:1) so IMHO this is all stock setup with no need to make new brackets for the tele cable etc.

I have the ****** slightly over full fluid wise, which may account for the smoke but I feel there must be more since Ive slightly over filled ******s at one time or another and never had smoke etc.

Am I a little too over sensitive about the smoke or is there something to it.

I am of the belief that guys are going to come on and advise me to buy the TCI kit gizmo etc for constant pressure.
I believe that these ******'s should and can run without needing the kits since they did originally and I dont see the need for it.

I am sure setting these ******s up is not a national secret so if anybody who knows what I am going thru can truely offer some positive reinforcement or reliable advise, believe me I am all ears!!!

 

I set mine up with help from these people...they do a bracket that fits near the carb and setting up is real easy....I also had a 6 foot hose and pressure guage coupled to the port on the box for commisioning purposes as they suggested.Driving with that tranmission was great,Good luck.

http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/index.shtml

 

X2 for bowtie. Look at their web site

 

You are right, these trans will work fine if the cable is set up correctly. I can't see how it is hooked to the carb by your picture (?) The distance the cable hooks on the carb from the pivot point (throttle shaft) is critical since that directly affects cable travel. Height of your cable housing mounting point above or below the hook on the carb also does to some degree. Do a search and there is some good info on here that addresses those dimensions.

As for overfilling, it is just as bad if not worse than underfilling. When the trans is overfull, the fluid gets whipped into a froth by the rotating components of the trans and you get air in the hydraulic circuits same as if it ****s air if it was low. Pull off a cooler line and fire it up for a few seconds to drain excess fluid. It doesn't have to be full but it needs to be between "add" and "full" with the trans completely warm. It truely takes about 10 miles or more of driving to bring the trans completely up to operating temp. I would get it right above "add" on the stick before you drive it then recheck the level after you drive it normally (cautiously) about 10-15 miles. As long as it is between the marks, it is fine.

When do you see the smoke? During a shift or at steady speed, sitting still, etc?? How do the shifts feel?

 

Using a gauge to check pressure is the way the shop that does my transmissions recommends. They are known worldwide for transmissions they build for race cars. The TCI kit is not necasary as you are correct with that asumption, but I would recommend at the very least a correct built and engineered bracket to work with your carb. I'm sure there is one out there and reasonably priced. Sorry to say, it doesnt take long to toast one with a incorrectly adjusted cable. If your ****** wasn't overfull or leaking externally, sorry to say it already sounds like you can stick a fork in her, she's done. I hope for you I'm wrong, best of luck, TR

 

fifty, two other things to add, first, dont listen to those local ****** guys. Of course they want you to drive it and then adjust it- meaning they know you will smoke it and maybe bring it to them for a complete rebuild. Second, I see that you are using what looks like a Lokar shifter. Theres another area that you need to address as far as critical adjustment. I am NOT saying this is your root cause of your problems, just that when you are said and done with the TV cable, please be sure you have checked and double checked the adjustment and set up of your shifter. TR

 

Yeah, thanks TR for your concern about the setting.
Funny thing is between drives I had an auto electrician do some work and he screwed around with the setting during is facination in getting the neutral start setting so perfect that it did initially put the engagement settings out, fortunately I twigged to it almost right away.
Got to say I am also not real impressed with the dash indicator for the ****** setting as it shows all the setting except PARK, or you get PARK and the none of the other setting show.
Some guys just wont leave things alone that does not concern them.

As for the Local ****** guys, I started to figure that they did not reall seem to know much.

 

My next step is to drain a little fluid out to get the level correct, then source a pressure guage and hose setup to get back to gr*** roots.
I got to say, you can read all the past posts in other threads but it does not count for much until you are live on the ground with one of these ******'s and ready to set it up.

 

Thanks for your pointers, after ready the Bowties link from Reefer, I think I need to review my cable bracket or at least take some measurements of one that is working on another vehicle to confirm accuracy.
I think I fell into a feeling of a false sense of security knowing that I was running GM stock components, except for the bracket which after reading some of the Bowtie stuff has prompted me to take a few steps back in my setup process.

The shifts feel reasonable especially after ready what Bowtie had to say.
I dont think it is cooked so I am still ready to tweek it.
If I had stuck with the local ****** guys directions, I think I would already be on a flat top now.

The smoke for whatever reason comes after a mile or so of driving in suburban streets with a maximum speed upto around 40mph, it has basically happen once I hit O/D for the 1st time.
It does however seem to be up shifting a little quick according to the Bowtie readings.

 

Fifty,

Go to www.purplesagetradingpost.com and look at Sumners recommendations on a carb bracket for the 700. I made mine that way and have never had a problem.

Charlie

 

Fifty, the best way to set that start switch is with a simple ohm meter, heck you could use a powered test light for that matter, simple electronics 101. As far as smoking when you hit OD, thats usually due to the line pressure because of the TV cable adjustment or lack of. Like going up a steep hill in a stick shift car in 4th gear and riding the clutch pedal. Think positive and maybe you caught things before its too late, TR

 

Your problem is evident in your picture.
700R4s need a different cable pull ratio than the usual 350/400s do. Your cable is leveraged as a Turbo 350/400.
Theres an adapter out there to remedy this. It mounts to your carb.
DO THIS FIRST and recheck settings and fluid.

 

Thanks for spotting that error.
Any ideas where best to get this adapter?
My 1st port of call will be Bowtie as I dont know anywhere much else to look.

 

You should be able to get the TV cable to carburetor bracket from Bowtie Overdrives as well as the carb throttle linkage adapter cam. I bought the bracket and linkage adapter cam to fit my Edelbrock 600 from them. I think you can order whatever adapters and brackets you need, depending on what carburetor you are running. It was a very simple installation but it requires the right parts.

I have never had a transmission apart in my life but this was pretty much a snap. With my 700R4 on the bench, I installed the lockup kit, new TV spring and new TV cable. After getting it installed in the car I installed the cable brackets at the left rear corner of the carb which the TV cable slides through and attaches to the brackets with the large black connector near the end of the TV cable. Then I mounted the linkage adapter cam to the throttle on the carb which was a tad tricky because the adapter is two halves that screw together sandwiching the ball on the end of the cable between adapter halves.

As said before, go to Bowtie Overdrives and read EVERYTHING concerning your type of carburetor so you can get the right parts for the job and don't end up with a toasted ******. I read everything I could on their website regarding my setup ( several times ) and I ordered all of the parts they said would be needed, granted it cost a few bucks but it was soooo worth it, the 700R4 has been in the car for at least 5 years now without even a hiccup, not bad for a complete dumb*** pretending to know what the hell I'm doing. Good luck man, you should do fine.... it just requires lots of reading and the right parts. Mike

 

For the adapter, try the usual Jegs or Summit first.

 

Bowtie, as everyone has mentioned. They originated and innovated this stuff. They have technical help over the phone from guys that KNOW their stuff, not order-takers. And it's made here, not China...

 

I did the Bowtie kit and it was easy. A lot cheaper than a trans rebuild. Thinking that because all your system is GM may be part of your problem. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe overdrive tranys were in use when the Q-Jets were around.

 

It is a bell crank on the carb that changes pull rates on TV cable as the throttle is opened. I have one from bowtie that came on a carb setup that I picked up a while back. Never used it, but I can see how it works.

I can take a pic, but won't be back in the shop til Monday. PM if you still need it and I'd be glad to post one.

 

Check here. http://www.summitracing.com/search/Part-Type/Throttle-Cable-Brackets/?keyword=700r4

Below is the one I use on my Holley 750.

Holley 20-121 - Holley Transmission Kickdown Brackets.

It works great and I have over 60,000 mi on the trans. Set up is easy IMHO

 

Are you checking your fluid level with the engine running, or not running?

 

One of my buddies picked up a 700r4 that gave him fits wiith over filling the trans. turns out it had the fill tube and dip stick for some other trans in it when he got the trans. BILL RINALDI

 

Well guys, thanks to all of you for your good advice.
I am well on track to identifying my ****** issues.
The big break through was finding out my carby had the incorrect throttle lever setup on it.
I was able to get onto the Bowtie site and order a couple of parts including the pressure guage kit which will go a long way to helping me solve and setup correctly and hopefully help out somebody else in the future going thru similar problems.

Just a note about the Bowtie TV system kit is that it requires that I install their plunger spring into the ****** which should be a good learning experience.

Thanks, Russ.
I hope to see and meet some of you at the Lone Star Roundup.

 

my o/t monte carlo ss has q-jet and od 86 model.
good info in this thread.

 

The Bowtie Overdrive kit will serve you well. However, if you were to go with a typical aftermarket geometry corrector bracket, I would warn you that there are two different types being marketed under the same application (fitting Holley carbs for GM overdrives, the 700R4 and 2004R).



I'm really writing this for anyone who sees this thread in the future. The bracket on the right is the one you want. I don't know why there is a difference on the market, nor do I know who is manufacturing/selling each type. Just a warning in case you receive the left bracket to return it and seek out the right one. Whoa, pun?

 

Thanks for offering this extra bracket info.
Yes, you are right this thread has taken in some good info and I am pleased for my own project how it has worked out for me.
There are several other good threads covering various T700 issues, but as I mentioned earlier they dont seem to mean all that much until you have your sleeves rolled up and are feeling the pain.
Arm chair observing will only get you so much info, enough to hold a great conversation about these ******s but probably wont solve issues until like in my case the problem was found.

 

Did not read the new post to the thread, but you mentioned over filling. I put mine together and added the required fill capacity plus about 1 qt more as I had plumbed in a large aux cooler. I started my truck, moved it about in the driveway at let it idle to get some heat into the systems. When I looked under there was a slowly spreading puddle of fresh ATF. I shut things down and looked for a leak. It was coming out the fill tube. I then spoke to a guy who asked me if I drained the TQ. I though I had, but apparently there is a procedure for doing so, and I just upturned it over a drain pan.

Apparently the TQ retains enough fluid that it causes an over full condition if you add the spec'd amount of capacity.

So maybe your trans is overfilled.

 

Good point. My TQ was new or at least recond & I added the supposed correct amount but was low after its 1st startup, so I added more and kinder over did it.
So far no spilling so as I mentioned earlier is a touch over full but I did not see it as a concern, but after reading some previous comments, I am going to drain some fluid off.

 

Holley adapter on the left is for the TH350 the one on the right is 700r4

 

Well, for what it maybe worth to anybody else fooling around with 700R4 ******s, in my case after seeing several so called experts, I actually found a guy who is more on the humble side, but seems to know his auto ****** stuff.


Funny thing is, while I was being told I may have my ****** too full, this guys adds fluid and now it runs and shifts great.


What do you know, I was given a wrong dipstick and was running just a tad too low, which is what was giving me all the odd signals especially going around corners.


I used 11 litres which what was given to me as the amount of oil needed to fill a 700R4 from scratch.

I struggled to get that amount in until the convertor ****ed it up slowly, which gave me that overfull concern, but in fact it has taken an additional 1.5 litres and is good.


Taking into account a fairly long set of oil cooler hoses and a good sized cooler, I guess this must have ****ed up a little more fluid than I could have imagined as well.


Hopefully this will save someone else in the future from the same pain.

Time to move on now and deal with the SBC rear main leak which is driving me nuts...

 

A little piece of helpful info to folks like me who are doing a 700R4 install for the first time into a hot rod style project.

I purchased one of those convertor lockup kits that has a pressure switch you need to install into the diaphram cover on the p***engers side of the ******.

Let me tell you, I installed it and thread taped it and gave it to the auto electrical guy to do that and other wiring jobs I required for my f100 project. For some unknown reason he removed and then refitted this pressure sensor ***embly but without using thread tape.

Well this has caused me no end of trouble trying to determine where all my ****** oil was going. It only leaked a little do test drives around the block, but once out on the highway at speed it would dump oil, like more than a quart in 15 miles.

Funny thing was it was real hard to find where the oil was coming out for sometime. Any way my advise is if using one of these kits ensure you fit it well and use thread tape and check a couple of times when newly installed because sure as hell it will leave you starnded with no oil very quickly.

Carry a spare container around with for a while.
Mind you a leaky dipstick tube can also be pretty bad.