X2. With one qualifier, the "character" of the motor needs to suit the "character" of the car. If I had to sacrifice every other project, and only have one modified vehicle, it would be the totally impractical, loud, obnoxious, steep geared, stumbling beast. For me, Its like heroin, once you've had it, theres no going back. And running race parts on the street will not work if you do not have the talent to tune it properly, which very few guys do.
We build a lot of Boosted Engines for customers. The Internet has desensitized the reading public about HP numbers. I get at least 1-2 calls a week from people wanting over 1000 HP and want it to be completely street-able. We can do that but with most the car or driver is not up to handle that much power to weight ratio? With the right driver I don't think there is such a thing as too much. Now making it capable of going back and forth to the corner store without a problem has become easy with the new engine management systems available. We have several customers with 800-1000 HP and they drive them every day. In a light vehicle like a Hot Rod you have to make sure you are not going to kill yourself or an innocent bystander. We are building a 1932 Chevrolet Roadster that will have a power to weight ratio of 1HP to 2lbs and we are making it so we can drive it cross country if desired. It can be done just don't build it so it is an on-off switch. Like others have stated tune it to be drivable down low and radical up top and it will be fine with a responsible driver.[/
I put a 468 BB in a 91 S-10, Pro Street, 4 link, 9" rear, giant meats, the whole deal. While it's fun to drive the power really doesn't do any good because you can't hook it up. The only one that thinks it's cool is the guy I buy my tires from. What's the old saying ? "You can never have too much money or horsepower it's just tough having both."
I put a 632 into a '66 chevelle with a 6spd tremec. If you hit 3500rpm the tires break loose, don't matter what gear. You have to drive the car constantly, with that much power you even have to watch driving over a steel manhole cover. It is a ball to drive but it'll wear you down on a trip because of the concentration. There just ain't nothing like it, enjoy and drive the piss out of it.
I believe the pedal ratio may be an excellent solution. It isn't the power per se, its how violently the power comes on. I really wasn't kidding about the stereo that goes from 1-7 with nothing in between. I believe you have at least part of the solution. This is why I asked because I know I'm not the first guy whose monster woke up and smashed half the lab. Still love that monster. Through it all, I was still smiling an hour after I drove it. Makes me want to go to the store for a loaf of bread...one slice at a time. I think this is a beeter problem to have trying to tame something that building it and it bores you to death.
I totally disagree on castrating it with tall gears. Increasing the throttle travel is not a bad idea. Just drive it, you WILL get used to it, surprisingly quickly. Voice of experience. Hell, in a month, it'll feel slow, and you will be looking for more power. A month later, THAT will feel slow, and you'll be looking for more power, and so on. Remember, its like heroin....Just dont drive it in the wet until you feel like you are on top of it.
Oh yea, hes got it! Driving isnt SUPPOSED to be like a video game. Real cars DEMAND your attention and respect. And when the time is right, and you step down, its better than sex. If it aint, trust me, you dont have enough power yet...
Holy Moly,,,,,Just don't stab it every time you drive it and you can't go wrong! HRP http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=29578&pictureid=336729
First off that thing is bad ass!!! Congrats on the first drive. But for god sakes bolt that seat down! I would say my truck is a close comparison, pump gas 582, huge solid roller, th400 3500 stall with a 3.50 gear. I do have baffles per say but they don't do much. So far the farthest I've drove my truck is about 1 hour at a time. The noise does get fatiguing, even with ear plugs. (If you didn't wear ear plugs you need them.) So far so good with the police. Granted I live in a fairly rural part of Ohio. With that being said I have drove it in Downtown Cleveland and Downtown Austin Texas, and even into my work which is a fairly effluent suburb and nothing. As far as street manners, it all comes down to what you want to do with it. Like I said above I haven't taken it that far yet. But I'll jump in it every time I get a chance and drive it 30-40 miles no problem. If it was quieter and had a little better gear I wouldn't have any issue taking it on a decent road trip. I even take my 5 year old and 2 year old and they love it. Mine is an automatic so it's a little different then yours but mine is very easy to drive. We've even talked about teaching the wife drive it but I have no way of teaching her because of the noise. With saying that I'm doing a lakes pipe style exhaust this winter. Truthfully I don't even care if it's quieter but I want the sound behind the cab. I think it'll help a ton. Like I tell everybody it's only fast as how far you push the pedal down. BTW I have way more power then I need but I'm planning on doing a supercharger in a couple of years.
Well I built a motor that killed a guy once, it may not have killed everyone but it was too much for him to handle so I guess Tony was correct at least once. I always build as much engine for myself as I can afford, but affording engine involves having something that is built to handle said engine. if you can't make it hook or stay in its lane then that is too much motor as far as I am concerned. Soooo I guess that is where I draw the line.
I think you've hit the nail on the head, this is the same discussion I have with the supposed "car guys" in my neighborhood who drive the Porsches, Ferraris, Skyline GTR's or what ever flavor of the month some magazine says has a better 0-60 time. The only way these cars run such great 0-60s is to let a computer drive for you...traction control, launch control and so on. If an experienced racer and a novice can both run the same 60s, I'm not interested. The whole reason I LOVE Hot Rods is the thrill, the raw nature and even the sacrifice that comes with owning a car that you're so intimately connected with. No electronic nanny(s) just the patience to develop the understanding of what MY car is capable of and the respect that comes from developing that understanding. I had a suspicion that I would grow to understand this car and manage it, even love its flaws and idiosycracies. It just was a departure from performance cars I'd owned in the past. I think you've given me the confidence that it'll just take time and patience. Oh yeah, my said she was going to drive this...after all she said " I can drive a stick, I had a Nisson 240 in college. Any thoughts on how I respond to THAT. Better bolt the seat in and take 2, no 3 plug wires off.
Never too much motor , but with alot of HP in a light short wheel base car you just got to repect it and watch where you open it up. My blown Model A you really have to watch it. Even crusing what little time I have spent in it, it breaks the tires loose easily and always tends to get alittle hairy and sideways, I am even running a 21.5w tire and it goes nuts, no traction when I put the pedal down, It spins and eventually hooks, but when it gets sideways too much and you let off it It want to get a little tippy,lt likes to pick up on one of the back wheels. Respect it and just drive it
More time with a proper seat x2 Well if the engine makes 400 ft lbs at 1200 rpms ya gotta do something , and castration is such an ugly word ... Adding more weight to move, Start off in second gear, Get some highway gears, Tune it to pull some low end out of it - recurve on the distributor. At least give the car a chance get one full revolution on tire before 1200 rpm actually 400 ft lbs. You can always come up on the converter when you desire hell to be unleashed. Driving it with a proper seat will help quite a bit. If your not connected to the car you don't have a snowflakes chance in hell of controlling it. This is kind of like using a 1/2" impact to tighten 10-32 screws.
This reminds me of a comment by my good friend Jiggs Hinkle, now 85 years young,.......upon hearing another guy say "I get about as much pleasure out of taking a shit as I do sex"....Jiggs pondered that a moment and replied... "either you don't know how to %$#@ or I don't know how to shit" Ray
I am SO disappointed in you... Actually, I do think a longer throttle throw will help. One thing I will mention, If a given combo has lots of power and a working rear suspension, it WILL tend to move around a little if you suddenly just flat lift at WOT, because the rear supension unloads, and the ass end of the car drops. Make DAMN sure before you go WOT that 1) the car is pointed in the direction you really intend to go, and 2) that you have mentally given yourself enough room to roll out of the throttle and THEN brake. Its all just common sense, but when the car really hooks and the W/P ratio is south of 8 to 1, you really have to start thinking about what you are going to do before you punch it. The snowflake comment is dead on the money. A few years back, an ex of mine was sure she wanted to drive my falcon. High ten car,snarly 428 FE, drum brakes, manual steering and 4.56s. She went about two blocks, never even WENT WOT, pulled over, got out and said it was the worst car she'd ever driven. And she owned a '68 mustang 390 GTA.
Tell you what, tell Jiggs just wait till he really NEEDS to take a shit, and the line-up is twenty minutes long. Then see if he still wants that piece of tail...
Good input. It has a Tremec 5 sp (I believe all Hot Rods should have 3 pedals) so no converter solutions. I believe controlling the throttle is part of the answer. The initial linkage I fabbed probably (meaning almost certainly) has too much ratio causing large throttle input with minimal travel. A stiffer throttle spring might help some too. When I built the rearend I thought 3.55 was "highway" gears. Thank god I didn't put in the 4.11s. Would have been funny as hell to watch that first drive without the seat bolted down though! One of the biggest problems I am going to have in the near term is all the friends who want to drive it that don't have any frame of reference for what a car like this is capable of. If this was a shock for me the first go 'round, it will be a potentially fatal education for these guys. How do you explain that without pissing them off. maybe I'll leave the passenger seat unbolted for a while and give rides first One of the most interesting things to me is how when I looked at the dyno sheets The effect of that much torque at that rpm never translated into the real world. I remember commenting to the engine builder that the torque looked impressive and he gave me that look like I just said "trees are made of wood". To his way of thinking, he'd just painted the Mona Lisa and I said "nice picture" What a greenhorn dumb ass I can be sometimes. That's the problem with hanging around ignorant "car guys" all the time...I get fooled into thinking I'm knowledgeable...One eyed man in the land of the blind is more like it.
You need more tire jk. Just take it easy till you get used to it and when you get comfortable with it, put the hammer down. I love seeing monster power being put to the street. If you think you have too much motor, just Youtube: Nelson racing engines. Those guys make huge hp numbers in street cars.
Mt father in law once said to me, "You know, when you get to be my age, alls you really care about is gettin' something good to eat."
I had/have a camaro, used to run a 454 w roller cam, 13.5-1 compression, 1050 dominator. Lots of fun, couldn't really take it anywhere, mileage was too bad and it needed high octane fuel. Also a little too loud.... I've learned alot since then. Now it's getting a 600 cid bigblock with PRESSURE fed roller lifters, and a reasonable 11-1 compression.... I expect the mileage will still be horrible and it won't be going very far but it WILL be FUN! Cheers!
The 440 I had in my duster killed the screen door on the back of my dads house once, and wrenched my back pretty good. Does that count? PS: probably ill-advised to wheel a 440 long block up a narrow sidewalk on a cheapy 3 wheeled engine stand...
If you consider the OEM model A Ford's throttle rest post that sits to the right of the pedal, it further refines the throttle positioning. The first suggestion, to slow the rate of pedal to throttle plate should help. I've built balanced power-to-weight cars, point and shoot can be a problem in a build. You'll get it right.
I just sold a car last year. Dynoed at 697 crank horsepower in a 3000 pound car, four speed auto with a 4:11 rear. The car was a handful to drive, loud. It was fun but I tended to drive it less often than a quiet comfortable rod I used to have. I am now building a car with 200 horse v8 and a three speed.
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