Solid Rivet tech

Seeing a earlier thread here finally gives me an idea for some tech on something I do know something about

If you are looking to order solid Aircraft rivets by part number they are sized using the dash number (AN470AD-4-6 for example) the first number -4 is the diameter of the rivet in 32nds of an inch or in this case -4= 1/8" the second number -6 is the grip length or length of the shank in 16ths of an inch or in this example -6= 3/8" All aircraft rivets are sized like this here in the US.
Back to the above part number the three numbers after the AN it means you are dealing with the head style in this case 470 =a universal or ****on head 426= flush or countersunk head.
The next letter or letters after the head style is the material the rivet is made from in this case AD=2117 or in the case of the head markings it is a dimple. More on materials in a bit.
I am posting a Chart showing the head markings in relation to the materials they are made from.
The best rivets to drive are the AD or Dimpled head rivets they are strong fairly easy to drive and do not need any heat treatment before they are driven. When you see a raised dot or a double dash you are dealing with what we call in aviation "Icebox Rivets" What this means is that these rivets need to be heat treated before they can be driven. After they are heat treated they have to be stored in the Freezer so they do not harden (yes at room tempthey will get hard just by setting in the bin) These are used in areas that have very high stresses and should not be driven if they have been setting out of the freezer any amount of time.
Now what do you have if you see a MS numbered rivet? You will see a MS20470AD-4-6 All you have to do is drop the MS20 and you have 470AD-4-6 they are sized as in the earlier example.
On rivet diameters.You will normally see -3 -4 -5 -6 and sometimes -8s drilling holes are pretty critical as to using the right sized drill bit. I like to use Numbered bits but fractionals will work too, -3 use a #40 bit, -4 use a #30 bit -5 use a #21 bit, -6 use a #10 and -8 is a 1/4". When using flush rivets the countersink head angle is 100 Degrees so you have to use a aircraft countersink.

I will try and take some pictures at work tonite Driving some rivets using a pneumatic Riveter and bucking bar method. If there is no drama, and post it for you.

Dawg

 

I for one am lookin' forward to the pictures,,,this is some knowledge that is worth learning,,,,HRP

 

i've been trying to find a supplier of universal head 1100 SO aluminum rivets
i have to get the exact dimensions

but do you know of a good supplier
thanks alot for posting this
zach

 

Check and see if you have a Aircraft supply at the airport They may have the 1100 SO rivets.

Dawg

 

Go for it SnoDawg....It's good info for guys to know.


Also, for anyone who is interested in the correct fastener for a specific job use this book. It covers a lot of things.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0071348360/102-7142927-9184147?v=glance&n=283155

 

btt

 

Sorry guys The **** hit the fan last night at work and I was not able to get anything for this post. It was one of those nights I wished the Wright Brothers had failed
I will try again.

Dawg

 

more, more, more!!! must learn more...

 

Sorry about not posting on this yesterday but I had some Camera Problems Well actually it was camera operator problems.
Ok here it goes. The first picture shows the tooling The rivet Guns are not Air hammers Yea they work the same but they hit different. I have used air hammers in the past to drive rivets but they are hard to control even with a regulator. The best all around size is a 4X You can drive the smaller Rivets with them Regulated down and can even drive 1/4" or -8s with them. I have included different styles of Bucking bars Most of the ones shown are commercially made but my Favorite is the smaller heel shaped one. If you have some Dollys(for body work) these will work. I have used many different things for bucking bars even Wrenches and screwdrivers Depending on the places I have had to get into. There is also shown The Rivet sets These are matched to the head types and Sizes There are many different styles of these (offset Shortys long styles) But the standard ones shown here will do 95% of what you want to do. There is also some flush sets I Threw in just for giggles and grins.
The last item is a rivet cutter. Which is self expanitory You can cut rivets with a pair of dikes but they are harder to drive since you do not have a square end it is easier to mess up the back (Bucktail) side (More on this later) A tip You know those Screw cutters on some crimpers they will cut rivets as long as they are not worn out and still sharp.

 

OK the Holes are drilled the edges are Deburred (A larger drill bit turned by hand works Great) Talking about length sizing. In the picture (Sorry about it being A bit out of focus) You can see different Examples of Right and wrong sizing. What you want to see is a length of 1 1/2 D or 1 1/2 Diameter of the rivet sticking through (Red Arrow) I have shown a example (Blue arrow) of a rivet of the same Diameter for comparison. The next Rivet (Black arrow) is too long at 2D and the First Rivet (Yellow arrow) Is too short at 1D.

The Next picture show Yours truly Driving that little ******, as you can see the Bucking bar and Gun is Square with the work. Make sure you use a safety spring on the Gun, With Ear and Eye protection.

Ok you have driven you Rivet and here is looking at the Back (Bucktail) side What you want to see is what is shown on the Blue arrow, An even round Bucktail that is 1 1/2D (Red arrow is an undriven rivet for comparison) and looking down you want a 1/2D height (sorry about no picture) The White arrow shows a overdriven rivet (Hit it too hard Dammmit) and the yellow arrow shows a Bucktail that the bucking bar that slipped (see the line Through the middle).

Now looking at the front (Head) side. What you want to see is the Red arrow No tool marks (yes it is was driven). The orange arrow was caused by not being Square with the Rivet set (We call em happy rivets Cause they are smiling), The White arrow is caused by driving the Rivet with a Set that is one size to large See the Round tool mark towards to he upper left. and the last (Black Arrow)Was caused by using a Rivet set that was too small (inner ring).

Well that is all for now I hope this helps some of you out.

Dawg

 

Here is the picture of the Rivet heads.

Dawg

 

Here is a link for Tooling

ATS

Dawg

 

What about material? What can be used with steel? I used what the drawing called out for, so I didn't have to check for compatibility of materials. I've never seen carbon steel rivets like in your chart, but I've used monel and cres rivets on ***anium and carbon composites.

 

Thanks SnoDawg. This should be filed in the archives.

 

Very cool, this will come in handy for my floor boards!
-Jesse

 

Thanks I WILL use this info one day.

 

Aluminum Rivets should be used on aluminum. This chart is for Aircraft Rivets You can buy Steel rivets (Non Aircraft) at Farm implement stores or Hansens Rivets online sells rivets.

Dawg