1952-59 Ford Just don't Wanna Give Up My Inline 6

I know I've been given solid advice suggesting that if I want to increase performance, I should look at a swap to a later model 289/302 small block V8. I can't possibly dispute that the swap would do exactly that. My "problem" is that I love the I6 look. Soooo, I'm back to tap you guys for compromise options that you have experience with that might allow me to swap my 223 I6, 3 on the tree to a physically compatible engine bay fit with an auto trans for my 54 Customline. I'm not looking for racing type performance, just comfortable performance at highway speed limits and decent fuel economy. As always, any advice is appreciated.
Trikepapa, RonC

 

Visit this site www.fordsix.com you may find some ideas there,however aftermarket goodies for a six are not budget friendly.If you decide to build the 223 you are pretty much stuck with a Ford-O-Matic.A later model Ford six would work with a C4 and possibly an AOD,you might have to get creative with fabbing front mounts but a C4 or AOD can easily adapt to your existing crossmember.

 

I think I'd "reverse engineer" this question by researching which Ford OHV 6 has the most speed equipment available at reasonable prices. If you've got to do a full-on engine swap, you might as well stack the deck in your own favor. Good luck!

 

the 300 L6 has alot of goodies available for it. there just so damn long and tall.
a buddy of mine built a killer slant 6. alot of people think its a v8 idleing with the hood closed.






l

 

I am not recommending this since I believe in "Ford in a Ford" but sometimes the devil wins so here goes.As you know you will want an engine that has a front sump oil pan if you were to swap to a Chevy 250 six cylinder you could use a front sump oil pan and pickup from a 62-67 Nova.The conversion mounts used for a SBC will also work on a 230-250 Chevy six,and a lot of goodies are out there for this engine at a cheaper cost than for a Ford six,if you love the "Shock and Awe" factor when people look under the hood,I say go for it,make sure the donor engine is the earlier version without the integrel intake manifold.A 200R4 overdrive will bolt up also.

 

My eyes must be going bad, or my 'puter is malfactoring again. I'd swear I just saw Jeff recommend a non-Ford motor in a Ford. Naw...?

 

Keep the six with a little fabricating and swap meet/ internet looking you can find some good stuff to warm it up. Get the higher compression head that would of been on the trucks or towing kit( I might know where there are a couple yet), ignition, shave, deck, bore, cam, exhaust and carburation. You'll have an awesome sounding small V8 eating in the short run different motor than everybody else has.I've done all that for about $3000.00 not counting my labor and not wishing at all I would of kept the 292. Also the kids in the mustang 5.0 don't have anything on me light to light. If you don't show them under the hood or run long roads they'll think you've got a bad car. I've smoked several small blocks and some guys with flatheads that have dumped alot more money than that in them. Did I mention it will have the best sounding pipes but I'm partial I guess. If your set on a swap I would definetely sway the way the other guys were and go something Ford or at least different than a small block.

 

I'm getting 19 to 20 mpg out on the road and don't have the 3 spd with OD in yet. But have no problem keeping up at hwy speed.

 

I think you can get a 2x2 intake but might be wrong . Get a set of headers , better ignition , see if you can chance the rocker ratio with different ones and that is the easiest HP gain to get . Now you can take your cam out and have it reground to get more lift and better duration . There is not one thing wrong with using a reground cam unless there is one made for your engine . Do dome checking around and see what you can come up with .

As for the Ford 300 , they do have a lot of torque & hp but I am not a fan of that engine at all . They **** gas for sure and I remember too many problems when I worked for Ford when they first cam out . With the weight and the ****py gas mileage you just as well drop a 289 or 302 in instead of that Ford 300 .

Jeff I agree with you that the Chev stove bolt 6 is a damn good engine . Better than the Ford 300 hands down plus there isn't too much you can't get for that Chev engine either !

Still there are still some good inline Ford engine to use from the early Mustangs and not the tiny 170 either . They can be bored and have a cam ground and better intake and distributor and you will have a lighter , hopped up 6 that will serve you well .

As for the Mopar slant 6 , I would take that 6 cyl. over any inline 6 cyl made out there ! you can get so many performance parts and add on chrome for that engine plus it was a strong engine to start with !

There are many way to go so just do your homework , talk with a few machinist that re grind cams and go from there !

Jim

 

Here is where I got my cam not wild but a little extra they have all kinds though along with some other stuff that would help also.http://www.cliffordperformance.net/ this guy is good place to check into also has some really fast 6's he's built. More GM stuff but knows alot of people that are good with mopar slants and fords http://http://stoveboltengineco.com/

 

Clifford has some really good go fast parts .
What cam did you get as to duration and valve lift ?
What intake do you have now for the cam ?
Do you have header too ?

Need to know what all you have with specifications so you know what you are working with .

Jim

 

I have 264 mechanical lifter grind 264duration /474"lift . I have a fenton dual singles intake with matched fenton header running the small gl*** bowl holleys bored 30over with the Ford truck crank and head out of what I believe was the 1tons in 55 and56( found a FoMoCo new in box laying on parts shelf upstairs at local parts store covered in a whole bunch of dust wonder how many times they inventoryed it till they gave up) ,also ran an extra line up for oilier this motor isn't known for supplying the best up top, running the petronics ignition and coil. New valve& seats and don't rember what we did to the valve train and rockers because that I had done by somebody else can't rember exact right now have to look back through paperwork I also got it from Clifford though. Took a little messing with the jets and timing to get it rolling smooth but pretty good now idles nice and pretty decent torque on low to middle.

 

I always heard there's no replacement for displacement....454!

 

not worth the extra weight with a big block. or lots of extra funds to build one that actualy will out run a nice small block. when i go to bristol the straight sixs will outrun most bigblock that dont have 10grand in them

 

Yep. I had a buddy in high school who repaired a totalled '62 Chevy II (brand new car at the time) and swapped in a 230 cubic inch 6-cylinder (the larger of the two 6-cylinder Chevy engines available that year). With street slicks - 7-inch, I think - and ******* bars, that car ruled at the stop light drags! A good 6 is to be respected, that's for sure.

 

I gotta admit.... I do love those sixes!!! Check out my 300 Ford Six in my yard art.... it has a mild cam, two Holley 94's on a clifford dual four converted to dual twos, and a 3-speed manual.... It hauls ***!!!!!! If I ever blew the engine in the '53 I would do a swap to a 300 six with all the toys and 4-speed.

Nothing beats the looks on people's faces when you pop the hood and they see a dressed out six!!!!

 

Back in the early 70's I ran a built 223 Ford six in a 56 ford stock car on dirt and it was one super quick car in it's cl*** and it could run with or out perform most of the V/8 cars as it had a ton of torque and quick rpm's. It was running tri power, wild camshaft, high compression trw pop up pistons, and a super good head and split manifold. Most of the V/8 guys would really get pissed that that little six could make them eat my dust. (I loved it!!!). The only reason we gave it up is because they changed the rules at the local race track. We also had a guy that raced a slant six Dodge and it was also very quick. (They are built like a tank. Most all taxi cabs ran them as they would run forever!!) The rules at the time was all six cylinders were run in the B cl*** regardless of what time they turned in for qualifing speed. So we moved on up to the A's and ran small block Ford 289's then a Boss 302 ( What Motor that Boss 302 was!!!) I still have a real soft spot for those old 223,s They are super good on gas in stock form and can be made to really go but it would cost plenty of $$$$ to make one really to be a performer today. If you want something for all around use I would just put the good old standby 302 in and be done with it. As it's very easy on the pocket book and tons and tons of parts availible everywhere. Ken

 

I vote for keep your 6. Just bore it out, give it a larger stroke, maybe dome the pistons a little, and add yourself a decent cam. Then throw in a header, maybe a 3x1 carb setup, an Offenhauser head and a good exhaust. Mate that with a good OD trans and you'd be cruisin down the road in some style!

 

All right....i'm on my way to bed so I didn't read through all the other posts. I have the original 215 in my 53. I did 223 pistons with somewhere around 10:1 compression, balanced/lightened bottom end, clifford cam, ported head, chevy sbc valves, clifford valve springs, new lifters, clifford intake, weber carb (from clifford), clifford headers, recurved distributor with pertronix from Linder's Technical Service (from the HAMB). I'm sure there's other stuff I'm missing too.

I built the motor this way after talking to Larry from Clifford and having him convince me to use all of their parts. I was told I would be looking around 300 ft/lbs of torque with this setup.

In short, I love the motor. However, I would never go with all of clifford's stuff again. The headers didn't even remotely work on the 215. They may work on the 223 because of where the motor mount is but they definitely do not work on the 215. I had to cut every tube and completely rebuild the headers. Secondly, the difference in thickness between the header and intake flanges was an average of .070". This made the $20 intake/exhaust gasket burn up in about 200 miles and cause the car to run like ****. It specifically says in the directions not to modify the intake flange so they couldn't be cut down. In the end....after spending countless amounts of money (probably over $1500 just from Clifford) on clifford products, I ended up having to spend a day at the machine shop to make step washers just to make the stupid headers and intake (from the same company) actually work correctly together. After that bridge was crossed I was told I needed to run the carb at a certain float level and fuel pressure. So I made sure to set the carb float dead nuts on 17.5mm and set the fuel pressure regulator (from clifford) at 2.5 lbs of fuel pressure along with my expensive (supposedly necessary) electric fuel pump. Now the car falls on it's face when I go around a corner or take off too hard. I'm thinking either the float level or fuel pressure isn't right.

My suggestion, get an offenhauser intake because it looks cool. Bump up the compression and build the motor. I would say to use the clifford cam but not all the rest. You might get a little more power from their whole package but from what I have experienced, their claims are wildly exaggerated. My car runs well but I could have built my 368 Lincoln motor and put it in for cheaper than what I did. (and if you know anything about those yblocks....they are not cheap)

That's my 2 cents. If you have any questions shoot me a PM and I'll be happy to answer them.

 

300 Ford for sure. Lots of low end grunt, Clifford and Offy make intakes, Headers are available, same with cams. Try for a later model engine with the better cylinder head.
Pretty sure you can find a 300/AOD combo in a Ford van .

 

Nailhead 65 was your Lincon motor the big Flathead they ran in 50 and 51?I smoked one at the drags with my Ford 6. Guy had dumped a ton on money in it bragged how fast it was. It was definetly a nice looking and sounding motor but my car is no speed demon beat him by more than a car length. I'm sure he weighed more but he also was pushing alot more horse and cubes than me. Had it set up with 3dueces and all the goodies inside and 4:11 posi rear with a 400 turbo and shift kit. Trikepapa I still vote stick with the six do some work on it you should be able to do some simple things to make it more drivable and pep.But don't get to technical unless thats what your looking for they were able to make them fast 50 years ago without a computer setting everything to the ne****st mill outta be able to now only better.
http://http://www.egge.com/about.shtml here is another good link for some parts it's where my valve train came from and a few other parts pretty knowledgable people which is handy for me not being that knowledgable.

 

Hi ALL,
Havn't checked in lately, been working on the 54 rather than just talking about it. Got it all wired up and converted 6 --> 12V, rebuilt the sway bar and 3-on-the-tree shift linkage. Pretty happy with the progress, but still on the fence with the engine & ****** decision. As I've said, I really like the I6, but just not finding much go faster stuff, other than the Clifford and Fenton pricey stuff. I've been looking into the I6 250 motors from the Falcon's and early Mustangs. Seems they have lots of goodies available. Does anyone have words of wisdom on compatability of an I6 250 w/C4 ****** combination for my Customline?

 

Trikepapa,You just need to know where to shop check this out: http://www.aaamarine.com/servlet/the-826/3128-dsh-8-Offenhauser-Ford-223/Detail they may also have other 223 goodies and these guys: cams are around $100, talk to them for advice before you order. http://www.deltacam.com/camshaftgrinding.php Clifford is outrageous on headers ,you could go "old school" and weld on a second flange to come up with duals,there is a HAMB member that can cut header flanges for you if you want to build your own.Several guys here have some carbs to part with if you get the intake.Look up HAMB member GMC Bubba to upgrade and curve your distributor,He is excellent and good on price to fellow members.

 

Stew....what Lincoln motor were you talking about? I was referring to my Ford Inline 6 with my post about the Clifford parts.

The inline 6 is a great motor and you can really make good power but you have to know what you're doing and it takes a lot of trial and error. I'm in the process of dialing my car in now. I'm going to dyno it eventually once I think I've exceeded the limit of the **** dyno, so I'll post those numbers up once that's done.

 

Oh, and I agree with Jeff. Big thumbs up for GMCBubba (Linder's Technical Service). He did a great job with my distributor for a very fair price.

 

Hell, If ya want my old 223 engine and ****** I'd sell it for $100 has everything but the carb there I think it would be a good candidate for you if you were ever down in my neck of the woods.

 

Sircamp...
Check your PM
Trikepapa-RonC

 

Checked compression on my stock 223 today. Readings from left to right were 115/8 120/8.2 105/7 90/6.3 120/8.0 120/8.2
Is the 90/6.3 too low?

 

yes 90 is low.

 

Check the idle vacuum reading and report back also.