I have it in an album here, but here's a pic There are 2 modified hood latches on the firewall, close the tilt using the hood as your leverage point - click , click, close hood - you're done. As you can see the bumper tilts with it - a little counterbalance (not much but a little)
Here is a picture I took of a 49 or 50 Plymouth with an all steel tilt front end. Sorry, but this is the only picture I have. The front end was heavy enough to need two people to open it.
That pivot location's not really low enough for that, but I'm going to have a custom push bar instead of the stock bumper, and tucked in closer too, so that will allow me to drop the pivot point lower. The front end of the car will be low though, so as it tilts it can't drop too much more, and it'll want to from weight shift.. This is why I need a more complex linkage. That one pivots at the top of frame horns from what I can tell. It's the least balanced you could be without pushing the pivot forward past the grille. The weight isn't so big an issue if it's balanced right but I don't know how balanced it can be. That looks really clean. the Rambler hood hinges from the fenders? Or did you move the hinges off the cowl? I used to work at an AMC dealership, but It's been a loooong time since I looked at a 60's Rambler. I think the P-15 hood is too flimsy for this though. I'm afraid to put louvers in it, that it might fold up in the middle. I'd have to totally subframe it or graft on inner panels to give it some section. I was considering this anyhow, instead of tube steel bracing: Reinforcing the fenders and hood with formed piece(s) of sheet metal.
I did a tilt front end once and didn't regret it! I cut my fenders so the lower rear portion stayed with the body and the rest tilted, this did away with the "slide forward" problem. Incorporate a torsion bar in your pivot point and you are home free. (this is the way tilt-cab trucks counter balance their cabs) Locate your pivot points as low and as far forward as possible, this gives you the best leverage to lift and transfer the weight of the sheetmetal forward. I used 2 hood pins to hold the front end down, but 1 or 2 bear claw latches would work well also. Have fun and don't worry about the ones that ask why, if they don't know they'll never get it. BTW I'm in the process of building the hinge points to tilt the cab on my avatar. They will be strong enough to transfer forces from the bumper to the frame. That grille is way to precious to have some ass back into it in a parking lot, "say oh shit too bad," and drive away.
Ulu, An additional BONUS of having the still functional hood is the added leverage you get from the hood. To tilt my front end I first open the hood - with the hood UP I get a fair amount of additional leverage. As far as reinforcing the structure - I made a lightweight fairly stiff tubular structure that follows the fender mounting points. At the firewall side I added a vertical plate that the hood hinge mounts to (similar to original) - those vertical plates also serve to lock in the lateral movement - further stabilized by the firewall mounted hood latches as well. The tubing extends to the front pivot plate - which doubles as the bumper mount, built in stop etc. The hood itself serves to lock in the fenders laterally. When driving - there is no indication that the front end is a tilt - like you notice on some fiberglass installs. The core support all moves with the tilt pieces and the radiator mounted to the frame. All that front sheetmetal and wiring is stock.
There is a member here, "gotlouvers" I think, who has a louvered hood on his Plymouth. If you are interested, he might have some input on the rigidity (is that a real word?) standpoint. HemiRambler, that setup looks really nice.
Well I presently own two that I converted to steel tilt, and all I can say is your friends must not know how to engineer a tilt frontend if they regret it. I love both of mine, and especially so when I'm working on the engines! It's so nice to be sitting on the front tire while working, and not leaning over the fenders, or fighting to get at a spark plug with a inner fender 2" away. If I had the stock front metal on my Austin gasser I'd probably be disassembling it every time I did a tune up! As for the radiator support being part of the structure...it can easily be supported with a custom radiator support, and the front sheet metal can be supported with tube framework built inside to hold it together. It's not rocket science, but the OP's ride will be a challenge with the sheer size and weight. Here's a couple pics of what I did on my Falcon to support it. As you can see there's a whole 3/4" round tube framework inside to tie the sheet metal together, and also attach it to a pivot link at the frame. I also split the front fenders at the body line to help with clearance when it's open. The fender drops hung into my access side area, and I figured I'd be hitting my head on them. My pivot point is a link, so I can pull the frontend forward 5", and then tilt it. Then I simply close it, and push back, and it pivots back into place. I have Teflon contact plates to allow it to slide freely into place and not rub metal to metal. I used simple Jeep rubber hold down latches inside the fenders to keep it closed. On my Austin I split the lower fenders and built plates in the two fender halves to hold the latch and pin setup from a old Datsun PU hood system. I have converted them from cable operation to manual, and I simply unlatch each side, and tilt the frontend. On both frontends I used tailgate cables to stop the full open position, and hold the metal at a set angle. I added rub plates to the Austin after it was painted to keep the latches from ruining the paint: Don't let the naysayers stop you if a tilt frontend is really what you want. Drop me a PM if you have questions, and I'll try to help whatever way I can.
Interesting thread.... A couple of thoughts. One, to assist raising the front end, why not a couple of gas struts? Second, for a latch assembly, look at late 70s/80s/early 90s Jaguars. These use two latches with a single interior lever and pushes up the hood for opening and pulls it down for closed; no having to 'slam' the hood for latching. Cable operated too, so easy to mount.
Thank you so much, and thanks for all the photos. I like your cars a lot & it looks like they worked out nicely. Yes, I've seen his photos, thank you. I'm not a real big fan of louvers myself, because I don't like to clean them. But the do have their purpose. I was considering gas struts, as I want the nose to rise, at least partly, by itself. The thing is my Caddy had gas struts and the things don't last in the desert heat. After 18 mos they were soft. The Jag method seems sorta like what I want, with a single lever that unlatches things, but that also physically pushes the hood forward. I won't use cables unless I have to. I thought about the Caddy electric trunk latches to draw down the nose though. That can't be a 'glass front end can it? Interesting, and I like it, but Dodge fenders are totally different. It's a good thing I don't have $7000 cash lying around. I'd be bussing out there get it back to California.
I've looked at this and there's no way it would work with the stock hinges. I'd have to mod them, make custom, or relieve the cowl. Also I just really want to de-seam the hood & hood-to-fenders.
Here's a preliminary idea, using a 4-bar linkage, similar to a typical hood hinge. Unfortunately it doesn't pull forward even 2" before it tilts considerably. I need to play with the pivot points & see if I can make it do what I need. Enough of this for now. My garage needs work while the sun shines.
Hey hey ,mount the radiator in a cradle so the original radiator is separate from original support ..you want to tilt the nose using original radiator support because it holds everything together..the front bumper bolts replaced with pins . Also remove inner fender wells, hood hinges , bolt hood to the fenders , now find some vintage door hinges , as a matter of fact I have a good heavy duty pair from a 49 Desoto 4 door and fit them to radiator support in front and crossmember....right angle seems the best as the rear of the fenders will slide up.. .that's where I would begin
@Stewartwhite , the '57 is a tour de force' and it's clear why you'd need a tilt! Anyway, I'm building a driver, and that slider would be crusty and pitted in a few months time. I'll bet you spend a lot of time polishing and waxing yours, but my car will be dirty on the bottom a week after I get it on the road. @LOST ANGEL, my mom drove a bullet-nose Stude Starlite coupe back in 1960. I sure wish she'd never sold it, but she couldn't deal with a stick shift. The louvers really do something for that car. @choptop40 Thanks for the advice . I hadn't considered using door hinges. I have some Dad saved from some old car. I was just going to use steel bolts and sleeves (floating?) with urethane bushings each side to prevent rattles.
Guys I played around with the design a lot & still don't have a really great solution. Anyhow, I'd really like to see some more custom P-15's, with or even without tilt.
The tilt design on my '54 Chevy works very well. And is very basic. I have no problem lifting this front section open by myself. And I've never had a problem with fender to door clearance (even though the lower section sweeps by the door). There are three hinge points. Two are at the bumper brackets and the third is a piano hinge located between the base of the radiator core support and the radiator frame crossmember. Additional supports were run from the core support out to the front part of the fender. In this car, the radiator was moved rearward and independently mounted. Pieces of steel strapping were bolted to the sides of the core support and welded to the top edge of the bumper brackets. I tried to resize my photos through photobucket but nothing works here. If you want to PM with an email address, I'll be happy to attach a couple photos.
I was thinking there ought to be lots of tricky linkages you could fab to make the front tilt as you want it. For instance what about a "4 bar" linkage - with the links pointing up at a 60-ish degree angle - pull it back and it pivots 60 degrees into a stop before it tilts (it could even lock there for stability if needed) and the guy that mentioned the torsion bar I think is really onto something - seems like the perfect answer for a heavy front end like yours. BTW I would never run those gas springs. I've seen those used in absolute perfect conditions - warm- dry - clean and they still fail. I don't know why they can't seem to make those worth a shit but apparently they can't. ??
I like the torsion bar idea. I might go trunk peeping at the wrecking yard for some. The P15 has coil springs under the package shelf to balance the deck lid, which is the first car I've ever owned without torsion springs in the trunk. I was actually thinking of coils because of that, but torsion bars have so many advantages.
Thanks bud. Click that thumbnail about 10 posts above & you'll see my first 4-bar design. Unsuccessful, but nonetheless it creates a complex motion. I haven't had time to work on this, as my garage is getting the major attention needs before I can proceed with Edith.
No direct experience, I'm afraid, but a few observations. Most of the examples thus far on this thread are cars with much more clearance under the front bumper than what I assume is a Custom build is likely to have. Hence, an action more complex than a simple pivot axis near the trailing edges of the front bumper will be necessary. The forwardmost extremity of the bumper has to end up at least the same height it is with the tilt nose closed, without dipping below that level on the way there. And it would appear that the rear edges of the assembly have to move forward to clear doors, etc. All this suggests a variation of the BMW E12 action, but with a somewhat greater initial movement. I'd look at an intermediate bracket or assembly, possibly a tube with two bends in it, pivoted to the extreme front end of the frame, just behind the middle part of the front bumper. The ends of the tube (or whatever) sweep back to the region of the very rear ends of the front bumper, and are pivoted to the tilt nose there. This intermediate assembly is spring-loaded to tilt up and forwards when the interior control is released. When this happens the front of the tilt nose moves forwards and upwards and assumes a nose-up attitude, in the process pulling pins in the tilt nose out of sockets on the firewall (or vice versa). From this position it should be simple to tilt the tilt nose forwards in the usual way, with the assistance of more counterspringing if necessary, except that its pivot point has moved forwards and up, so that the bumper is clear of the ground in the open position. To close, lower the tilt nose, then shove it rearwards and downwards to lock. There should be some sort of guide mechanism, e.g. skate board wheels landing on rails, to prevent one lowering the tilt nose too far, so that the rearward/downward shove brings the aforementioned pins to engage with the aforementioned sockets. The spring on the intermediate assembly needs to be chosen with care, so that the initial movement is gentle but definite, and so that the closing shove isn't too onerous. I like the opening hood on HemiRambler's tilt nose as it is eminently practical, though one advantage of a tilt nose on a Custom is the opportunity to fill the hood cut lines. Then, there have of course been rear-hinged tilt noses: Jowett Jupiter Tatra Type 57
Ned, it's pretty clear that my first linkage designs are letting the nose drop a lot as the pivots are too far rearward. While I won't have a stock bumper, there will be a bumper that tilts with the nose. I won't want, it to hit the ground, so the nose will need to rise in front as it moves forward, then pivot up in back & down in front at different rates so it translates forward as well. The garage is taking shape slowly, so it'll be a few days before I get back to this.
Ulu, I'm sorry but at first glance I did not follow your example of a 4 bar - mostly because it looked like the actual fender edge travel was a simple arc - I was under the impression that you wanted to have the motion SLIDE forward before tilting. I thought you didn't like the "piston" idea offered up because of concerns with dirt etc mucking up the mechanism??? So what I was trying to suggest is a very simple 4 bar - equal lengths - basically a parallelogram. Pivot bottoms anchored to your chassis and the tops connected to one another via a connector link - on that link (preferably on one of the top pivots for simplicity) you could actually place the tilt pivot. The action would be when you pulled the front end to tilt it would first pivot forward - you could easily get that motion to be several inches if desired - after it hit the forward end stop it would start to actually pivot for the tilt motion. Just thinking out loud Bud.
Yeah, that example doesn't work at all & I haven't had time to play with it again. I've got the garage fixed up now, except that the ceiling still needs sheetrock. I'll get back to this soon.
My earlier response did not account for the fact that your front end will be low. Can you use air cylinders or linear actuators or whatever to push the pivot point up and forward? When retracted, the pivot can sit in a cradle so that the front end does not jiggle while driving. Extended, you could probably easily extend 6" up and 6" out - that might give you the clearance you need. Not sure if that is easier than creating some fancy articulated linkage. Which reminds me, don't some Mercedes have fancy double-articulated deck lid hinges? maybe you can reverse-engineer them.
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