Hey guys....appreciate any insight on this topic. Specifically, I'm looking at getting a repaint on my '55 Club next year. I'm going down to a trusted body and paint shop this week or next to get some budgetary figures. But before I do, I wanted to see if my expectations are good going in or if I have to re-set them. Mechanically the car is top notch and the interior is impeccable. So I'm not looking for a frame off. However, I was looking to have the body brought down to metal and some subtle 'waviness' to be taken out of the rear panels. This second part....I wanted an all-metal job, no filler. Is that even possible without a full-on frame off restoration? It's the 'remove waviness' part that I'm unsure of what a body shop can and can't do without frame off.
Ghost, your ride looks plenty straight in your album. Whatever you decide to do, plan on it taking at least twice as long and costing twice as much. Then there is the fear of actually driving and parking it not to mention sinking the money into it that you will never recoup.
Body shops can be a real nightmare,I see posts all over about delays,jacked up prices,poor work covered up and no service after you have paid the bill. Sadly it is all to common, really take time to research the shop get feedback from previous customers and get everything in writing before you put down any cash. Probably the worst story ever told here was from Todd aka ctfortner and his experience with two different shops.
Truthfully you might have lofty goals. Stripping the car to bare metal is going to require the removal of the interior door panels to get to some of the trim clips and nuts holding it in place. There are not too many shops that use lead anymore but they all know how to use filler. HRP
Minor wavyness is more often handled with blocking of a high build primer over the epoxy primer. I'm not an expert by any means, but the the use of lead is no guarantee of a good job. Lead or polyester fillers are both dependent on proper prep. The only thing lead will guarantee you is a much more expensive bill to pay. The only way a good paint job can be rendered, as HRP alluded to, is removal of all trim, gl***, window channels, and to protect your interior, all upholstery....basically stripped down just short of doing a body off. This is especially true if you are doing a color change. Many wouldn't go that far, but from your original post, it sounds to me like you're looking for a top notch paint job. I did a body off on mine, but I didn't do the final blocking until the body was back on the frame and all the body mounts torqued to spec...not sure if the answers your "is it posible without a body off...". My body shop friends tell me on their cars, they are more concerned with spending the big bucks on quality primers, and the clearcoat. More important they say than high dollar base coats. Also, after I got my car blocked and ready for paint, I sprayed one last coat of high build and let it sit for at least a month before I did the final block. The longer you can let the primer sit before the final block the better the long term result will be. Rich PS one last comment...if you ask 20 painters what the best way to do a car is, you know how many different answers you'll get.
I'm not an expert but I just got out of a month + working almost everyday at a body and paint shop because of the accident i had with the Ford. I got out with a ~500$ bill because I did a significant part of the work and I'm friends with the owner, but I saw them carving hard on customers wallets. It's a pain and expensive. Its hard to understand what you meen by waviness without a pic. The former paint job just might have lacked block sanding work on the primer .... Most of the secret to a good paint job is in sanding. The kind of job you describe will be expensive, no doubt. Its a frame-off job, so lots of work hours involved. It's a high-buck adventure, so make sure you know where you leave your car. Good luck and keep us posted.
Thanks guys....really appreciate the insight. As HRP mentioned, I might have (too) lofty goals, admittedly. If the sun is shining when I get home I'll try to take some pictures to better illustrate that 'waviness' that I'm talking about along with a couple of the other issues (all small ones, granted). Like 55Brodie mentioned, it's not at all visible in my album. Heck, it's not even visible unless you're 2 feet from the car, looking at an angle and with sunlight shinning on it. That having been said, it's definitely not my imagination. And if that was the only thing I'd probably let it go as one of those things that only the owner is ever going to notice. But coupled with the fact that there are a number of other paint imperfections and the bondo job on the p***enger rear quarter that's bubbling through just a tiny bit, and I thought it may be time to go all in. I could honestly go either way though. Even the rear quarter....I'm fairly certain those two bubbles I just noticed again have been there for years. What got my motor going on that was for the first time since I've owned the car (5 years now) I reached down in there from inside the trunk and pulled out a huge wad of stuffing (which I never noticed) and a pile of rust chips. Just got me going that the car deserves better (even though honestly appearance wise the bondo job was done well....not glopped on at all).
Rui..You got off super cheap...good to have friends. A good quality primer can be 2-300+ a gallon/kit, or higher, 2-500 a gallon for base and 250-500 for clear....If your doing a car 100% stripped, and finishing all surfaces inside and out, that adds up to a bunch of paint. Add to that, if you are doing a car piecemeal over the years as I did, at least except for final outside paint, the waste factor really adds up. To me, running out of a catalized primer before you finished spraying was worse than mixing up a little more than you need for the door, hood, ect....trying to estimate how much paint much worse for the hobbyist than the guy who paints on a daily basis. All of these comments are irrelevant except as added notes on the expense of a good paint job, which was Metal Ghost's innitial queery. I know I have over 2,000 in materials(primers and paint), and probably closer to 3.....another good reason you don't want to screw up the prep work. I realize metal Ghost isn't doing the prep work, but it helps to understand why a good paint job is so expensive.
I manage a body shop and have been in the business for 30+ years yes, 6 different shops = 6 different prices etc. 20 painters, ...blah, blah, blah as stated in the other replys, it's the prep that counts,the actual spraying is the easy part! If you want top notch paint job, DO NOT TAKE IT TO A COLLISION SHOP!!! they don't know how to, or most don't want to do our(hambers) kind of work. find a shop that does resto-rod, restoration type work. You will save a TON of money dis ***embling, de-t******* the car your self, and a lot less headaches with missing & lost parts!! shops mark stuff up- find a gl*** guy to take gl*** out, hire an older(experienced) body man to work on his off time maybe ,etc; Taking it apart you will find out how many clips needed, weather-strips, etc you are going to need come re-***y time. do some research, buy the right removal tool, and have at it. plenty of guys, info on the hamb to get you thru it. stock up on "buster loose, liquid wrench, or pb blaster too. I used "Evaporust to clean just about all the small parts of rust, bolts,clips, you name it and rattle can Rustoleum. all in all, the better dis-***y, the better paint job and you save the paint shop on masking tape(discount? HAHA!!) and cleaning paint off all your trim.I took mine in to the shop in May, its all apart, of course I found more cancar than expected(d-***!). your car looks like in better shape, but if you bought it used.. who knows what it under the paint. The pics are just a few of many. I anticipate having the car done for my funeral someday, seems like it is taking forever just to get metal work done.
Buymeamerc.....good advise. With 30 years in the biz, please comment on my 2 posts, you won't hurt my feelings....as stated, I'm not in the business, just someone with good hands, who does alot of research before I do anything, so I always appreciate constructive comments on my comments. As I stated I'm very much aware of different approaches to bodywork and paint, I just want to know if someone with lots of experience thinks I'm giving bad advise, (not just different than what they'd do) Rich
Ok, so the final verdict is that I'm NOT going to do a full on, down-to-metal repaint of my Club. Had a conversation with the owner of my local, trusted shop. His shop is primarily a collision shop, though otherwise I completely agree with buymeamerc's words (his is the only collision shop in my area that I'd trust with a HAMB-job, and he's been nice enough to take the time and give me a bunch of advise over the years). Anyway, he took a good hard look at the car and said I'd be crazy to mess with it (he was kinder in his words, granted). Basically to him hit looked like it would have come from the factory. We are going to move forward with working on the lower-rear quarter and replacing the bondo that's starting to bubble with a metal patch, along with a couple other small items (such as an ill-fitting trunk) But otherwise, he basically said come back when the paint is bad and he'd be happy to take it down to metal. Otherwise leave it alone and enjoy her! But everyone's advise wasn't for naught....my wife wants me to get our next car in the not-to distant future. And I know everyone's input here is going to help me ALOT when that time comes. So thank you all!
You are spot on...simply because your "advice" is based on fact/experience rather than somebody just saying what they "think". experience and research is wisdom.
sounds like you got a good honest body man that steered you the right way, that's hard to find enoy her like you said, and get on that next car! need help give a "holler" all of us will be here to help get ya where you're going
Just thought I'd chime in with a quick little update. Work is going great on the 'Club. I have an album going with pics, but wasn't sure how to link off to it in a post, so here are some as well.
Wow, it came out great. Nothin' wrong with a little plastic filler. I'm doing my '59 in gray primer until I get it all sorted out. I cringe when I think of a shop painting it. We used to have our cars done at Earl Scheib years back. We'd do all the body work, dis***embly and some masking (so it could be driven) and bring it over on the DAY we agreed upon. And pick it up the next day. Those days are gone...
Nice repair with minimal intrusion. I can't see a drain hole in the inner rear quarter panel replacement...would be a good idea to drill a couple. Sometimes we do such a good job trying to seal things up, we forget the water has to get out if it does get in.
Good call, and thanks for mentioning that! There are actually drain holes in there (apparently just not visible in the picture) but I didn't think of that myself, so I sent a quick note off to the shop and he confirmed. Thanks for looking out though!
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