Projects Will Ford 37 drivetrain go right on 30 frame?

I have an opportunity to buy the rear end with suspension brakes and tires and the front suspension with spring drums and steering components from a 1937 Ford sedan. My question is will they fit Onto my 1930 Ford pick up frame?

 

That is a pretty blank canvas. They will go on with some fab work and parts swapping, but so will anything.

Engine and trans will need mounts. Might get some hurst mounts for the engine.
Rear axle will sort of fit, going to need different spring though. And the torque tube will more than likely need to be shortened.
Front is gonna be a bit more difficult. The spring is in front of the axle, yours needs to be on top. More fab work.

All good parts but not exactly a bolt on deal.

 

It looks like you have a Model A Ford front axle and wishbone on the floor near your truck. Clean it up, make sure it would be OK to use, have it dropped if you want to, get new perches, spring and shackles, good spindles and the appropriate brake parts, tie rod, etc. and use that axle. It will fit and it will look good!

 

Do you really want the '37 cable operated mechanical brakes? As stated above, the spindles would be a good fit on an original A axle, but that's about all I'd use on the front.

On the rear, you could use the axle/torquetube****embly, but you'll need to either modify the frame a LOT to use the '37 spring, or get some mounts and use the A spring on the '37 axle. There are new mounts in the HAMB classifieds to mount that spring above the '37 axle. Then have the torquetube and driveshaft shortened to fit the space.

 

What is the whole picture? What engine are you planning? Probably too much to change to make it worthwhile. If the engine and trans came in the package it might be a good starting point but most of what you listed is not useable without a lot of work. Just a bit of trivia, do you know that your radiator shell is from a "big truck" (Model AA) and is designed for a thicker radiator?

Charlie Stephens

 

Here's the parts, I see what you mean by the spring being up front of the axle.
I do have the original I beam and wish bone as well as one king pin. Would I be further a head to just buy a kit to get the front axle in good working order? I'm also on a budget so I don't want to just buy all new. I'm in Ontario near Toronto, maybe there's a shop near by that sells the parts o need? Thanks fellas

 

I should mention he's asking 500 for all that.
Also I didn't know that the rad shell was off a AA. Thanks for that!
I will be needing to find a rad. As for the engine I had an old Lincoln 317 but I Sold it , don't know which can way to go now

 

I still don't have a picture in my mind of the whole project and that is very important. Are you going to end up with a hopped up banger, a flathead, or a full house blown big block Chevy? I would end up with the hopped up banger or flathead but that is just me. I would look for a restored chassis that was pulled out of a running car (which is the same as the pickup truck) and build from there. I like the fact that you include good pictures with your posts, makes them easier to understand. Also do you know that your truck cab is late '31 from the fact that it has a recessed firewall? Everything will interchange with the '30 but I just like to keep things "correct" (maybe I have OCD and don't know it).

Charlie Stephens

 

That stuff looks good for $500
It has hydraulic brakes and wide five rims. Grab it. Swap the spindles and stuff onto your A axle after you get it dropped. Find a T rear spring.

 

Buy it. I see what looks like a hyd hose on the front which means it might be juice (can't totally see it though). Either way, you're golden with the 37-39 wide 5 hub/drum setup and juice backing plates; no big deal to ditch the mechanical brakes if they're still on there. $500 CDN is fair for that pile I'd say.

Now, I'm going to tell you what I would try with that set of parts here, at least in mock up, which may or may not sound good to you and the rest of the gang:
Flip the bells on the rear end and put a Model A spring on there.
The Torque Tube should be somewhere around 62" (maybe @Bruce Lancaster will chime in with correct dimensions). I believe a stock Model A is 54". The spring offset is about 7" back with the bells flipped which moves your WB back but in effect should give you a 55" drive shaft length without cutting anything. The longer WB might look fine on a truck depending on what you do with the bed. I think you'd be at about 110"

Weather or not you can wedge a V8 trans and Flathead in there with that extra inch, I'm not 100% sure, but I'd tend to think you can make it work.

For the front end, you can use the 37 setup as is by using a perch on and in front of the stock crossmember, like some T buckets have. This will give you a dropped front end on the cheap, with only minor fabrication and stock Ford parts. You could also do this with a fabricated front crossmember to go a little lower and relocate the radiator forward to make up for the extra inch of drive shaft if you had to.

I think this would be a quick way to get your truck together, if nothing else for a mockup and a starting point to work forward from. Not exactly bolt-on like @dumprat said, but certainly very close to it.

EDIT: To run the 37 rear spring, you'll need a panhard bar I think. Also you would add a flat or convex crossmember somewhere, which could compensate for the added TT length but you'd be getting into lengthening the frame a bit potentially depending on how you did it and removal of the stock rear crossmember as well. Easier to swap the spring.

 

Also, if the wheels and rolling rubber are included, that's fantastic. If not, try to get them too.

 

Thanks for the info Charlie! I'm not to sure about drive train yet. I mean a flat head would be cool but everyone wants so much for them! If I can find a deal I will!
Would you guys be upset with me if I used a straight six with a standard******* out of a 85 f150? It's free but will defiantly need work been sitting a while
I like what your saying dumprat , that's actually such a good idea!

 

You'd just need to go to open drive on the rear end to do that. The big six needs 32" to 36" of engine bay, firewall to radiator, as I recall from when I was working on my build with one. You may need to put the radiator a bit forward or dimple the firewall but not impossible. The Ford Big Six 300 was introduced in 1965 as I recall, so it's not like you're telling us you want to drop a LS7 in there.

I found that reversed bells, open drive, 80's Corvette drive shaft, Ford 3.03 trans (with the Mustang length tail shaft anyway) to the Big Six fit in the Model A frame without any major cutting (except for the center crossmember, that's in the way).



The somewhat hard to find Bronco mounts look to work best with flathead style biscuit mounts.



Though if you can find an older SBC, you can run that to an old ford transmission and run the Torque Tube by using an adapter plate. This would probably be easier to fit with the cab and rad in stock locations.

 

Lol! Thanks patmanta I'll keep that in mind! Lots of useful info.

Just going to add that Those 37 drums are juiced.
Would those long pins go on my 30 axle? Also if I get the spring hardware to mount could I use the 37 springs on the 30 axle as well or are they totally different?

 

And by long pins I meant king pins, phone changed it [emoji38]

 

We definitely need a plan here. I can see that "free" straight six costing more than a flathead by the time you are finished plus the long hood, to me, would ruin the lines of the truck. A late model straight four might be an option. I can't see anyway near $500 worth of '37 stuff in the pile but it is hard to tell what you could use without a PLAN.

Charlie Stephens

 

Although a different "flavor" of vehicle than what you probably have in mind here is a good example of posting a PLAN, http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=177868&highlight=stephens . The people reading the post added their comments for consideration and I would like to think the project benefited from the comments.

Charlie Stephens

 

A Ford 300 six is only slightly longer than a 302 and will use the same mounts. And a six leaves you more room for steering parts.
Yes there is $500 worth of stuff there if the brakes are complete. Wide five juice brakes are hard to come by. The king pins are also an easy fix. They are the same diameter but need different thrust bearings. Look at Dennis Lacy's truck rebuild.

I would buy that stuff and stash it until you find just the right motor for your project. Some of these guys get so hung up on flathead fords they loose sight of the big picture. Buy and rear as many 50's hot rod mags as you can.

 

Well we all look at projects just a bit different than others. Here is a photo of my Chassis for my A Roadster. These have been around here for some time and it's still under construction. I have a 37 rear Axle and 39 front Axle a 37 X member with 39 pedals and of course Flat power. It is Stock wheel base. Yes it took some work but doesn't everything? Pick your flavor and make it happen. The single driving force for what you see here is that I didn't want to Z my frame on both ends and have almost no trunk space yet a good low stance. I got what I was after including a Flat floor.
The Wizzard

 

If the wide 5's are already juiced then where I'm from that pile is a bargain.

No, the 37 spring is wider as I recall. I still suggest trying a "suicide perch" as they are sometimes called. You can clamp a piece of angle iron to the front crossmember and drill a center hole in it to test it out and see if you like how it sits or not. Alternately, you can try it with the spring in the stock crossmember to reduce the wheelbase but your front wheel to firewall distance will decrease and may really mess with your proportions.

I'm suggesting these things because it's stuff you can do with loose parts as they sit. Plus, they'd be what you've got (assuming you buy it before someone beats you to it) and you wouldn't be buying more parts that you're not sure you need yet. You can set this up and sit in a chair and stare at it to see if you like it... and take pictures to post on the HAMB!

 

Don't screw around with the '37 front spring or axle. Use the all the A stuff on the front, except for the 37 spindles (and new '37 king pins) and the '39 brakes, if that's what they are (I can't guarantee that from the pics you showed). Monkeying around trying to mount the later spring and it's wide perches is just effort you don't need to do. It will look ugly, and not work as nicely as a stock A spring and shackles in the location they are supposed to fit. If you are missing the A front spring, just put the word out or go to some swap meets. Should find one for under $75.

 

While I respectfully disagree with @alchemy on playing around with the 37 front end setup (I still think it's possible to pull off and worth mocking up at least), I may have a stock width Model A spring in my pile somewhere and possibly even a reverse eye in stock width that I might be willing to part with if you can't find one (a lot of aftermarket springs are a half inch off for aftermarket drop axles, you gotta watch that).

 

there is only 5 people on the hamb that understand spring-ahead. It's a part of low cost rodding history back when. I like the look, but only if the W/B gets back to where it was. I love the look of the shackles up front, that in itself makes things look lower IMO.

Henry Ford did it, so it's ok

 

As I mentioned before your photos are excellent. Attend a few car shows/runs and find a truck you like. Take a bunch of detailed photos and post them for comments. That sounds like a "PLAN" to me.

Charlie Stephens

 

Ya, the stock frame horns, no kick in frame and extra low stance look like Hell. And talk about Work to get there, what was I thinking? To get this frame to ground look with a Model A axle it would need to be a 8" dropped axle. Those are every where, right?

 

^ That one is very nice ... Next thing you'll say is that it will be channeled too?? LOL I think it will be..

One big issue is radiator placement...what is your plan?
.

 

Rad is built and mounts in "STOCK" mount holes and I actually will run a belt driven Fan. Yes it's Channeled. I'm also working out the full fender issues. Now talk about work. That's a made by Henry 32 grill shell hanging in front of the rad being I had not trimmed the sides for frame clearance.

 

^ That cowl bottom looks lower than the frame bottom? That's another thing that is rarely done on a "new" old style build. There are still a few survivors in my area with these features.
.

 

I wouldn't worry about a plan or copying what you see at most car shows.

Find a year cut off and stick to it. Build your truck around the coolest parts you can find. Not necessarily the cheapest. Scour the local craigslist and buy and sell. You might get lucky. The drivetrain parts you have a line on are good stuff put them in your pile. Next find an early steering box, then maybe an engine and trans. Don't get wound up about a flathead unless you have deep pockets or find a good runner. Besides a you might get lucky and run across a nail head, red ram or an olds motor on the cheap. And if that doesn't pan out you can always stuff a SBC in as a last resort.

 

If that was mine I would jump on that pile of parts for $500 bucks and combine it with what I had. Here is how I would do it all if it were mine.

Like others have said, I would use the A axle, running the spring on top of the axle, I think in the end make things a little easier for you. Nothing wrong with the spring in front. It just takes a lot more fabrication and skill to make it all work right and have good proportions( which pist-n-broke pulled of perfectly I might ad) So get the A axle dropped and put the spindles and brakes from the 37 axle on there. Run a reverse eye spring. I would probably split the bones and use the 37 bones as well, they are beefier and longer than the A bones. That takes care of the front. Next I would think about the rear. If it was mine I would lengthen the frame to run the rear as a spring behind. This will get the**** down nicely. At that point you have a "roller" but need to think about power train and rear end locating. Basically open or closed drive line. Because of the weakness of the banjo rear, you are gonna want to run a less powerful engine. I would love to see a flathead or a banger. both of these could use the torque tube and rear wishbones for a very simple easy to build rod. But both will be expensive unless you are lucky in finding good running old engines or like swapping them out as they break. perhaps a small chevy V8. Those can be adapted to ford transmissions and still use the torque tube. really the possibilities are endless.

Or you could also convert the banjo to open drive. You'll need to reengineer for the lack of torque tube. I would ditch the rear wishbones then and just run a set of ladder bars. Once you go open drive you can run lots of different transmissions and engines easily. A 2.3 ford 4 cylinder with a t5 would be cool. or that six you were talking about?

all of this has been done a million times before. You should dig into the builds on here and see how others have done it. AV8 would be a good term for you to familiarize yourself with. Also I can't believe no one has mentions the Tardel book "How to build a traditional hot rod." good luck. have fun.