Technical Quarter elliptical Wheel hop.

No, it is not.

You can play Russian Roulette every day of your life, and die of natural causes at an old age. It does not make it safe.

Every suspension system has an oscillation frequency, at or above which it cannot be controlled without some sort of dampening device. That is why dampers (their proper name) exist. We call them shock absorbers, or shocks.

 

When I said Math is Required ,
I mean mathematics in ever aspect of the Font end , total weight of front half of vehicle,
Maybe even total weight ,
every leaf spring , Length ,thickness , sprung For each leaf
Weight of every thing and it's design, ,
More then I would care to deal with , I would add some kind of shocks , ( Correct shocks)

 

As an ME, I can ***ure you that there is no suspension design that is immune to uncontrolled oscillation without shock absorbers. Not one single one.

I can do all of the math.

 

Here's a pic of my setup. Def need shocks, and it rides as smooth as.

 

Ok. Shocks yea I already figured this out. Where do I put them? There's not much real estate.

 

Building with a need for shocks in mind comes with a different outcome - different than building with a mindset that shocks aren't needed.

There's quite a few creative ways to get things in.
Lever shocks fit in different places than tube shocks.
Tube shocks and bell cranks fit in differently
Friction shocks are better than no shocks and also fit differently again.
Then there's creating mounts for tube shocks where there aren't any.

 

How do you figure soft tail shocks work?
Those are coil over shocks too.

They work based off of a longs arm vs short arm bellcrank system too.

 

I would never run a hot rod without shocks. If the auto manufacture could do it look at the money they would save.
Does the wheel move up and down or side to side when you have your problem? up and down would indicate shocks or a tire out of round. Side to side indicates bent rim, steering box needs centering or king pins or tie rod ends or, or.
Please post the cure when you fine it.

 

My car had "1 disc" friction shocks mounted very close to the car center line. Even with them, at highway speed the front axle/tires would tramp kinda like it was doing the "hang loose" sign.
Redesigned the shocks to "2 disc", shortened the lever arm length and mounted them much farther out to the sides where they can get some movement to add resistance against.
I also used a preload spring to help the shocks keep adjustment.
Now the car is sweet at highway speeds, but rides no different around town...and thats just with properly working friction shocks!
I expect decent hydraulics would be even better again.
I don't see a point to trying to run with no shocks.
Thats "push it on and off the trailer" tech....

 

Post some pics of your front end. Somebody will have a suggestion on what and how to make it fit.

 

Some of you people read to much, I've been driving my T for 9 yrs without front shocks. I'm not ignorant, do meth or have a death wish, I drive the hi-ways, bumpy roads and even the QEW in Canada. My car works, one hand on the wheel or no hands on the wheel, it goes straight. The only exception is 70 +mph on the right front, women drive my car and there's no complaints, so I don't think some of you judgemental *****s know everything like you are eluding to.
I think this guy has the wrong king pin inclination or something to make his car act this way at such low speeds.

 

If ya wanna use tube shocks, you can get or make towers to make the length of they work properly.

 

Wow, ya let women drive yer car..Brave..My Karts have no shocks and handle fine at 70..Blue Bear, wonder where that character is now...

 

Some people don't read enough........it is 'alluding to'.........'eluding' is to evade detection or capture........this from another 'know it all *****'

Ray

 

Well...my blurb was factual...had the trouble and reconfiguring the shocks cured it.
I think you are just one of the lucky few really.
Judgemental *****...because we disagree with you? Come on man....thats a bit excessive.

 

This could have been a good informative thread. Facts from an engineer , real world experience. Instead it gets started off on the wrong foot by a clown. Sad clown. Poisoning the whole discussion.

 

My pants fall down and I don't wear a belt. I still need an answer from the H.A.M.B. Waiting.........would shocks help ?

 

There's still no photo of the actual car in question, seeing how everything is designed could go a long way to helping figure it out. The whole geometry could be off and a shock addition may not cure anything, but we don't know that without PICTURES.

 

100% true there!

 

No matter how much I read, I still have not read enough.

I am not trying to lord over people with my knowledge. I am trying to use it to prevent the innocent, ignorant or arrogant from killing, or getting themselves killed.

All lives are valuable to me, including those who are going to die trying while they are trying to die.

As for eluding, I won't even allude to it, I will say it: If you are running without shocks, you are indeed inadvertently eluding a bad accident, whether you accept this, or not.

 

How come some of us can build a car with a straight axle front end that has zero bump steer, tracks straight as hell, goes around corners like a madman, stops on a dime and be *****s as well?
Then, some hoo haw asks a question with little information given and expect us *****s to fix it for him with even less to go on, and more idiots chime in that what they do works for them, and that makes the problem not a problem?
Look, tube axles and hairpins or split bones don't go together, don't care what you think, or, because yours hasn't broke yet makes it o.k., cars built without shock absorbers aren't o.k. either, just because you're dumb enough to tell us it works for you. That's like saying no front brakes is no issue cause you been running no front brakes since god was a child? When you build cars, there are things that one must include in the build, shocks being one of them, not running shocks cause you didn't plan a spot for them is suspect at best, Overbiter, shut the arguments down, post some pics of what you have and let us decide, you dragged us into this, now buck up, post some pics.

 

I am an engineer, and a car builder.

You say facts from an engineer, real world experience. That is an excellent point, sir.

Facts are facts. The rest of what has been presented is pure anecdote. The plural of anecdote is not data.

Every data set has statistical outliers. They are always factored out of when drawing conclusions from the data set because they are gross aberrations that occur by random chance. It is statistical noise in an otherwise reliable data set.

Those who are experiencing success running without shocks are the statistical outliers.

For those who don't agree, go back and read my Russian Roulette statement.

 

"The plural of anecdote is not data".

I might have to write that one down and use it one day. That's a good one.

 

That is awesome ^^^

A working suspension spring must be dampened.
I know of no exceptions or rules contrary to this. (Maybe there are )

So,,, I F a suspension system is perceived to function without any form of dampening, it's much less of a stretch to conclude that the spring must not doing any work ( since it's only the working spring that must be dampened). Another explanation to this perception to is claim the non dampened system has a set of cir***stances with synergistic ability to defy all the laws of physics that pertain to the situation.

All that being said,,, if anyone that may have a suspension system that functions sans the dampening it would be well worth your while to get a video record of the dynamics on the open road and patent your special arrangement of these cir***stances.

Not a judgmental *****, just a pragmatic ***hole who's open to being proven wrong. Whatcha got?

Ps. Tight and stiff articulating joints within the suspension system perform the same dampening function as friction shocks.

 

Car trailers.. And I always wondered if it would help or hinder...

 

Watch a trailer go down the road. They bounce. Sometimes all over the place, good thing they are firmly anchored thru the tongue to a hitch on the tow vehicle.
When the trailer is empty the springs are too stiff to work and when loaded the rear shocks of the tow vehicle play in the game.

 

My 58 GMC has no shocks, from the factory. Could be cus it has 18 leaf springs. Just sayin,

cb1

 

Thats enough to run at least a couple clocks!!

 

At Don Garlits Museum in Florida , there is a Fuel Dragster Built by a engineer that never worked !!!

 

If that is true, not anecdotal, it must be one of the statistical outliers that Gimpy mentioned in his post, #52 above.

Ray