Folks Of Interest Fear & Loathing The Classic Car Dealer: Part 2

I am going to have to, like, disagree with you there.

If you read between the lines as far as agriculture goes, there is a big movement by a part of the buying public to "buy local" directly from farmers. The ag industry and the federal gov will fight that tooth and nail, they don't want to lose the gravy train.

 

This is what I'm saying. I have never seen anyone go after the Boss with such venom before, I found it startling. Ray has some good points on this topic, just not sure why the vitriol.

 

TRUEhamb
Changing How Rods Are Sold









I just had to, ya know?

 

Shills......

 

So you're going to the farmer and buying his wheat to turn into flour and make your own bread? Going to the rancher and buying cattle on the hoof taking it home to slaughter and cut up? The large farms and ranches are not going to take the time to deal with the small quantities the individual is buying. It's much easier to sell in the large quantities they produce

 

What's wrong with shill's? All they do is bring the bids closer to the reserve, once the reserve is met or on no reserve sales they go away. It's not like your going to pay more for a car since your bidding against fake bidders. As a seller they keep you informed which bids are real. Just part of the auction game.

 

I don't want to be the subject of a "game" with my money.....

 

All it takes is one bidder and a skilled auctioneer.

As far as consumers buying individually from local farmers...sounds great in principle, but that is not how Farmers will feed the World. Never work to feed the masses, no way/no how. And the prices will be dramatically higher.

 

There is a move away from "corporate" farming.

You can see it in the brewery industry. So many small micro-brews nowadays. The corporate greed is buying them up to muscle in on the market share.

Also- local butcher shops are making a comeback as well here in the Northeast.

Yes it will be extremely difficult for some aspects of agriculture, like wheat farming.

But- small agriculture businesses are making inroads into the big corporations market share. I see it from both ends. My day job I work for large food & beverage companies, at home a play around with old cars when I can find time from "farming" 400 acres. We had a small vegetable stand this summer, we sell hay and eggs, and we make and sell maple syrup too.

 

I understand that. Must be why I've never sold one of my own cars at a reserve auction, less games. You have bidders, one of them is willing to pay more then the others and he gets the car. The car truly is worth that amount on that day at that place.
I go to sell, move on to the next one good or bad. Only reserve cars I sell are clients, some guys don't have the balls without that reserve safety net.

 

I am not saying it is going to feed the world- all I am saying is that there is a tangible move towards buying what consumers can locally.

The sheep will go to Wally-world and buy from the corporate world, we can't stop that. Farmer's markets are growing (pun intended) and sustainable and diverse farming is as well.

 

We are kind of already doing that. Luckily I live close to an Amish community and can buy most of what I need there. Cuts of meat, sausage, vegetables, breads, pies etc. No you can't feed the world but it does keep small farms in business and that's mostly what we have here in my neck of the woods.

 

there was a classic car dealer in st. louis whose downfall was a sale he made that appeared in the local paper. it was one of those replica auburn boat tail speedsters with the ford drivetrain. he sold it for 4 times what it was worth, and a lot of gearheads noticed! the tv news got involved, and, in his interview, said "the customer wanted the car. he had the money. so i sold it to him!" he wound up losing his license over it.

 

why would he lose his license? I bet he did something illegal. Or perhaps he represented the car fraudulently?

 

Gotta be way more to this story. Fraud, misrepresentation, bad toupe', something...

 

it was back in the '80s, i think. the car was worth maybe 25 k and was sold for 100k.

 

............That don't make him a crook,....shyster maybe, but not a crook.

 

If anyone wants a "Bad Taste In Their Mouth" just call Gateway Classics and tell them your interested in a car they have on consignment. After listening to their BS you to will see what they are all about. Just don't give them your credit card number unless you want to lose your $1000.00 non refundable deposit. Why would anyone deal with them?

Gary

 

.........................................I don't know how they manage to stay in business. In this day and age what with all of the social media, word of how folks operate spreads pretty quickly.

 

As I mentioned previously in this thread (post #41) I bought my Edsel from them. I bought it because it's a very rare car and almost completely restored for what I considered a reasonable price. They say that the deposit is non-refundable but if a complaint is filed with the BBB they will refund the deposit. They are unscrupulous though as shown in several other complaints to the BBB. One involved a couple who paid $85,000 for a '41 Willys without ever driving it or hearing it run in person. Gateway told them that they couldn't start it because the oil filter that they ordered 3 weeks earlier hadn't arrived yet which is obviously BS. They bought the car anyway because the salesman told them it ran great when in fact it didn't. Also, they cheated the 88 year old owner (career Army guy) of my Edsel out of $3k. I will not be purchasing another vehicle from them and I urge everyone I know to do the same....

 

Just like "Fear & Loathing" #1 about half of the posters don't have a problem with someone buying a car with reselling it for a profit in mind even without spending a dime on it. Some guys enjoy having more cars than others. In most states a dealer license is required if you legally buy and sell a certain number of cars in a year, some single digits. How much is made on a car should not matter at all as long as the car is correctly represented. We all hope our vehicle(s) will be worth more tomorrow than today.
Car dealers have had a bad reputation since there has been cars. There have always been crooked dealers in every kind of merchandise. But there has always more honest businessmen than dishonest. It's a shame the few dishonest are the ones responsible for warning labels on almost everything we buy.

 

Right on Frank

 

Hnstray is a retired used car salesman that just got severely outclassed by Ryan and I don't even think he realizes it!

 

I also hate sushi. One of the few foods I don't enjoy

 

My take is that Ryan wrote an editorial to get people thinking and reflecting on a particular situation.
Some people land on one side of the argument, others on the other side.

Mission accomplished Ryan, well done.

 

Yes there are bad sales people no matter what the product. If you really want to see unscrupulous hard sell sales people go to a time share presentation. They make car dealers look like angels. I think one of the big problems is that so many people today don't pay attention to details and expect the sales person to be on the up and up. They have forgotten or never knew the old saying "BUYER BEWARE" A guy I know bought a late model truck off a dealers lot and seeing it was parked in the front row assumed it was in top shape. So he was foolish enough to bargain the price down by asking to buy as is. Shortly after he started having problems and of course wanted the dealer to fix them at no charge. Well you can guess what the dealer told him. He did receive some compensation after taking them to court but in the end he probably lost after all the hassle and lawyer fees. As I recall he spent somewhere around 6-8K in repairs

 

That statement right there is where you're going wrong Ryan. If this were still a hobby, I could see your point. But it isn't just a hobby any more, it is an industry and the scale involved is such that a 'pure-at-heart' hobbyist will likely be overwhelmed if success strikes in a business endeavor. And sadly, the problem is probably only going to get worse just because of the demographics involved. Many here are older retireds and as they die off, many of the ones that own multiple cars will present their heirs (and even just the single-car ones) with the task of selling off the inventory to settle the estate. Many will turn to dealers or auction houses rather than deal with it themselves, even if they're capable of accurately representing the cars for sale and most won't be.

And this is a problem even for the reputable dealers; many of these cars aren't stock. They've been modified, and unless there's a build log from the original (and any subsequent) builder, figuring out what been done, what parts were used, and whether they were new, used, or rebuilt parts can be a puzzle for even the best of us, not to mention if the workmanship is adequate. The better dealers will try to avoid the 'iffy' ones, but these cars will still get sold by someone to someone. If dealer A comes in and tells the heirs that Grampa's old hot rod is realistically worth $10K but dealer B says he can get $20K, who do you think is going to get the sale?

Utopia is, and will remain for the foreseeable future, a small town in Texas....

 

HUH? WHY would he "lose his license" over a sale...because HE MADE TOO MUCH MONEY?????
Sounds like BS to me!
This whole thread is just RIDICULOUS, the only reason it still exists is because of Ryan.
Jezzz people, WTF are you complaining about?
Don't like dealers, don't buy from one.
SIMPLE AS THAT! Really bad, stupid thread!

 

The problem arises when the passion and love of the "old car hobby" meets the cold hard reality of making money (often without any scruples) from the "old car industry".

Its true for puppies (puppy mills), horses (horse meat slaughterhouses), even babies (adoption scams) and more things than I care to think about.

Its what happens when a society has no moral limits on the value of money and the means of attaining it, as the saying goes "the end justifies the means". Its a cold, hard cruel world out there and sooner or later you learn the hard way. Such is life, it just depends on the individuals morality, humanity and whether they believe in the Golden Rule - "Treat others as you would like to be treated".