Technical Axle retainer ring failure while driving, axles slide out

Had the same trouble with the 9'' in my 39 Chev Coupe, on its first shake down cruise with a few other rodder mates.. 20 miles out of town the left hand axle walked..
We were going up a slight hill, when we lost drive (thank goodness for tandem brakes) we stopped on the roadside, pulled the axle and went back to work, where I turned up another collar and pressed it on..
Re***embled everything, carried on traveling for another 25 miles and the right axle did exactly the same trick..
Took out the axle, but this time we were in the middle of a gorge and the closest town was another 20 miles ahead..
We stopped at the first farmers workshop on the road, hammered the bearing and collar back on, borrowed his stick welder and a couple or three zaps later, problem solved, refitted to the car and completed our journey without any more drama..
I found that the original collars were cheap, (probably Chinese) 1/4'' steel, pressed in an L shape, not a solid 3/8'' square section collar..

 

The right rear axle in the 9" that I put in my '55 F100 worked it's way out until the tire rubbed the fender. Needless to say the tire eventually blew out but I got it pulled over and stopped safely. I had my car trailer behind me with my '31 Tudor on board. It coulda been a disaster. AAA towed the rig to a tire shop and while he was mounting the new tire I noticed a bunch of brake shoe showing - huh? So I pulled the axle and had the guy press the retaining ring back into position and tack weld it. I had just had new bearings installed weeks before.
I have to admit, it was the first time it ever happened to me but now I will be paying closer attention to the bearing and retaining ring quality and how it gets installed. I will also be putting a few small TIG tacks just to be sure.

 

It happened to my buddy's new Currie 9 inch. Fender kept it all together. Only had a few thousand miles on it. I was following him when it happened, it was the day Lemmy died and I was listening to motorhead, coincidence I think not.

 

Whether there is an actual "warranty" involved or not, if they've been welded on, there is no way anyone is going to stand behind their product, even if they goofed to begin with. Why complicate an already complicated situation further? Did someone say it was a racing application?
I am Butch/56sedandelivery.

 

FYI, when I spoke to Strange Engineering they told me never weld the retaining ring on your axle.

 

It sounds like the stamped retainers may be the common link in this issue. All the ones I have done used the solid retainer and those never came loose. The only factory axles I have seen that used a stamped retainer had a groove in the axle where that retainer crimped into. They were not Ford axles, however.

 

It appears that a lot of guys on here so far, either know of or have had personal experience with retainer rings coming off in their street cars. Either they're physically too small (for clearance) or too soft a material, or not enough press fit, or any combination above.

Warranty or not, it sounds like the rings are the problem and two tack welds will prevent it. Just like tack welding your oil pick up to the pump housing prevents a LOT of problems.

Let us know how you come out Norman...

 

Right way is an outside mic and a snap gauge, that way the actual measuring is being done with the same tool, eliminates any variation between inside and outside mics.

 

How do you measure internally with a micrometer, or is is a digital caliper?

5 thou interference would be MORE than enough to hold the ring on, and you'd need a ****** good press to get it on too.

I used them on my rear end, but one of them started to leak oil, so I had to fit a housing seal. The press on ring was too long for that, so I had to get the ring machined 2mm shorter. (The rings are wider than stock in this conversion) I later found out my axle is a bit bent, so I ***ume it is 'wiggling' right in the bearing area a bit as it rotates and that is what stopped it sealing. Maybe....

 

Nope never seen an axle walk


Yeah sometimes we weld them

 

Hi Dog_Patch,

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/attachments/img_0237-copy-jpg.3237961/

What are the hex head fasteners used for wheel lugs in the welded retainer picture?

regards,

Dan T

 

Those are screw in studs. That's how the axles come from Moser. It wouldn't hurt to tack those in place also. I don't always tack the retainer in place. It makes the job of replacing bearings a real h***le. Think like the other guys were saying if its not hard to press on, it might come off.

 

Guys, you see those 3 small spot welds? Thats what you need to do. Not welded on but just the spot welds.

 

If you heat the lock rings, shouldn't they try to tighten up more than original when they cool?

 

No, thermal expansion is (at least for smaller temp ranges of few hundred degrees) is linear and reversible.

 

And don't forget, on many Ford axle housings the inner seal rides on the axle right about where you'd put the tack welds.

 

Had the same problem with the LR. Rebuilt a 9in and ran it for a year and everything is fine. Put disc brakes on it and ran it a year or so and things are fine and all of sudden my LR caliper seems to be hanging up. Brake so hot you couldn't touch the rim. Start tearing things apart and find the caliper was what was holding the axle in. Retainer was spinning on shaft inside tube and bearing would slide off axle by hand. Well WTF! Being the shade tree techy that I am I decided I needed a new axel. Called John at the 9IN factory and he confirmed. Sent me a new axel, bearing and retainer, reinstalled and all is 5000 miles later.

 

That seal won't actually be needed with those sealed bearings. Theoretically. Read my post a few further up, #39, mine started to leak.

 

Got a gage block to check my micrometer on the original measurements, was a bit off so grabbed and new one still harbor freight but right on the money with a 1" gage block (1.000 reading), looks like rings are 1.377 (normal for small bearing 9") and axles measure 1.378 and 1.3785 on the ring seat, I can't find factory measurements but this seems a bit narrow,
sent the axles to currie they'll get there wednesday and I'll call to follow up, also when I got the car home I found my p***enger side lower shock eye/bolt and leaf spring retainer plate both ground down and need replacing as well

 

Hey guys for what its worth.
On my other posts I have had the LR axle walk back in June due to retaining ring failure. My rear after investigation turned out to be a 1967/8 8.2 BOP diff [ retainer rings not c clips]. I put new standard gear axles in and we pressed the retainers on after the bearings. It was a hard press with 5 thou interference [standard interference]. After reading all the pros and cons of retainer ring fitment, next time I will go the heat up and shrink way. We had a very minor pickup on the shaft from cold pressing one. The first one went on sweet the second one was the pickup. It sounds like either way works, but I have taken measurements of axle face to brake backing plate and outside of tyre to ch***is rail. Ill be watching it closely as I don't want to have it happen again ever. The inboard seal face was slightly marked by the pickup but we were able to polish it out. Only time will tell if it seals. The diff is 2.76 ratio so economical but not a lot of get up n go [350 th400]. My partners 68 Mustang 289 is a way quicker car but I guess its also lighter . The other thing I had to do was clean out the axle tube as the axle splines did a little bit of machining on their way out. Obviously retained swarf is not good for your carrier oil...

 

They are meant to be pressed on cold, the problem with heating them is when they cool off the ring shrinks, which leaves a gap between the bearing and the ring.


Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Did OP ever get a response from currie?

 

We use to spot weld the retainers for stock car use which caused the axle to break where they spot welded .They would last for awhile.

 

You also have to make sure the ring goes on straight or it can egg out and not hold.

 

Happened to me as well, brand new axles, bearings and seals.
So what's the cure?
Don't want to weaken the axle by welding on it;
considering machining a groove in the axle and adding a
spring clip but no matter what I do it may possibly weaken them.
Not a race car, street driven 30 pickup, Blown sbc, 4-speed.
Thoughts?

 

What 57 Fargo said was correct. The retainer will creep as it cools. Where I used to work building Dynamometers, we installed many bearings and retainers. We always kept the retainers pressed in place while everything cooled. We pressed some quite large bearings and retainers, and never had anything loose when we were done with the installation.

 

A small heli arc bead on the od of retaining ring if wanting to weld anywhere for more holding as ring should want to shrink from weld but chisel will still loosen it if bearing has to be replaced. Years ago I got some Strange axles and the bearings went on so hard I thought I would run out of press or split the bearing, so far so good, 49 years later.

 

No, don't machine a groove for a spring clip. With those big fat tires, any groove you machine will be a great place for fatigue crack initiation in that area.

 

Thanks for the advice fellas!
I may have just found the cure.
I just purchased some OEM Ford axle bearings, still in the box, made in USA stamped on the bearings.
I'll use my "stock" axles with these bearings, that should do it.
"Stay tuned,"
Mick