Rod and Custom article on Toyota four-poppers

Maybe after I've seen a few hundred ugly Toyota powered rides (the majority so far have been teally cool track-Ts and modifieds) I won't be so open minded as to what can be done with these engines. Personally, I've seen enough ugly small-blocks to last a life time with those "Elite" dress-up kits and any piece of ball-milled crap you can think of. That's why it's my goal to run a small-block in my truck that looks cool- pretty much the way the factory dropped it in a Corvette in 1958.
Put a hood over that Toyota and who cares- my list of visual distractions are wayyy more disturbing.

 

You "disagree" with asian powered rods? Why?

If it isn't YOUR car, then exactly how does it affect you? Does it hurt your feelings or something? If you don't want one for youself, cool, then don't build one.

And as far as the "f*** Toyota" comment, dude, they're actually opening plants here in the US and providing good jobs for thousands of Americans, while the big three is simultaneously moving their operations overseas and taking our jobs to 3rd world counties where they don't have to obey our labor laws. I don't understand your mentality.

 

OK- before it gets the big lock down lets keep it on track. If you have something to add- pro or con about actually using one of these engines lets hear it. Flag waving and politics is not what this post was all about. I'm a U.S. Veteran going back through a long line of family U.S. Veterans back 200 years. I get it. Thanks Jim

 

saw this a while back on ebay truck was made from a bantam sedan body motor is a 22r i thik it is pretty good looking maybe its just me?

 

I'd run it. I actually prefer the nissan KA24de with sidedrafts, they're practically free because everyone swaps in a JDM turbo in 240sx's and they came in trucks, as well. Lots of aftermarket support, too. Never noticed more vibration than any small block I ever had, modern fours are pretty smooth out of the box. Grind and polish the valve cover, looks good, 200hp easy, run forever, 30 mpg in a light car with hard driving.

Cause Ford and GM are so in tune with the current market? 97 different Trucks and SUVs, 3 fun cars between them.

 

I like it. Needs a nose like the Jim Bell '34. If you cover the engine no one will know and a small engine would allow you to get away with a cheap surplus fork lift rad and a small grille. Plus Toyota PU's had a trans with the shifter up front so you don't have to put it between the seats.

 

I'd rather keep the thread on topic. If you'd like, PM me and we can discuss further. Thanks in advance.

 

Traditional hot rods are built to look like something from the hey-day of our roots. A 'Yota 22R doesn't fit the bill if you're after that look.

The tradition of hot rodding is to build a fast car with what you want or have available to you, no matter who manufactured it. A 'Yota 22R fits that bill perfectly.

They are 2 completely different ways of building.

Now then, my buddy had an '84 Celica w/ the 22R back in the early '90s. We swapped on a Weber carb, & lemme tell ya, the little SOB would fly. 1st & 2nd were white smoke, then 3rd would grab........... we were impressed as Hell. Great motor, great MPG- I'd build one & drop it in a hot rod in a heartbeat. I think the majority of the HAMB would accept one as long as we didn't see a crapload of 'Yota tech on the board.

 

one side note to this ......if the valve cover was bare.....and there were no marking on the motor.....how many would even know what it is.........let alone , if some valve cover mods were made.....if ya have a good story ready ....you could fool most of the people ....all the time.......brandon

 

This Model A based modified has been running around San Antonio for several years. A regular at the Roundup. And a Goodguys "traditional" hot rod pick. You can argue that it is not fully up to "traditional" HAMB standards but it is hard to find fault when the execution is otherwise right on. Incidentally, I know the owner is building a 283 for his other ride because I gave him a set of heads when we hooked up at the Chickasha swap meet last month.

 

you ain't gonna believe this but here goes.

a 3-tc will run up to 8500rpm without anything more than a good rebuild, a cam kit,headers, & 350cfm 2bbl.
you cannot hurt these things.
you can make 150 hp easy. they don't weigh anything at all & the SOUND of one spinning 8500 will rock your world.
they sound like indycar motors(well almost)
when stripped of all the factory bullshit they look like 1/2 of a chrysler hemi.
i'm lookin for a morris pickup body to put my 200hp race 3-tc in with a straight axle under it.

 

If you wanted to build a "traditional" later model four banger for a Hot Rod, Offenhauser still makes ALOT of manifolds for the Chevy Luv, Chevy Vega, Nissan (Datsun),Ford/Mazda, Ford 2.0 & 2.3, and Toyota 1600, 1800, 18rc, 20r, 22r, and 6 cylinder Land Cruiser. What's more "traditional" than Offenhauser? They make stock replacement, Holley 5200, Weber 32/36 conversions, and four barrel manifolds for all of the engines listed above. I sell alot of the Toyota 22r 4 barrel manifolds.

 

Not my thing!

 

Here's a full race toyota 22R with a 20 R head.
Go to LC engineering for more info.
http://www.lcengineering.com/

I used to be a rock crawler before my back injury, and ran a 22r
in my rock buggy. The motor had 26?,000 miles on it and ran like a top.
Great gas mileage and easy to keep running.

Under a hood top with no sides, 4 intake stacks out one side and a header out the other, why not put it in a lite car and have a blast? I know it doesn't
fit what a lot of people think of as a "trad." car. But, if your not claiming it to be "trad", who cares?


I guess I'm just a "different strokes for different folks" kinda guy.
So what if some don't like it, they don't have to.


Build it, drive it, and smile fuckers! Thats why we do this, correct?

 

Right on bro. And alot of Pre-60 year olds as well!

 

now that is a great looking modified.

 

What he said wast of effort

 

I read this article last night at work...pretty cool...I wouldnt run it myself( I am going all Herny Ford on my rig)....but I don't see it as any worse than putting a Chevy motor in a Ford car.....actually I think the old 350/350 is much less inovative and inventive then this Toyota set-up and it looks cooler to boot!

Run it if you like it....it is YOUR car , not any of ours...hell if you do it will probably last you 10x's as long as most these guys(and my )old motors!

LoL

 

With gas in my area quickly getting to the $4.00/gallon mark (and I know it will be by Memorial Day, and I also suspect it will keep climbing from there), I'm actually glad I have opted for a GM 4.3 V6 in my 26 T Sedan... with the hood sides on and closed, who is gonna know? It fits a lot better without recessing the firewall, it should have plenty of power to move the See-Dan around, parts are plentiful, and I got it for basically free with the 700R-4 Overdrive trans.. If I could have found a Capri V-6 with the distributor in front, I would have, and kept it all Ford, but I have always felt that the basic premise of Hot Rodding was to use what you have or can scrounge, improve upon it, and make something out of it... Traditional? No, it isn't. But then again, neither was that newfangled 265 Chevy V-8, back in the "Traditional" days...

 

i like the idea of "modern" 4 bangers in rods....

personally, i want to put a mazda b2200 engine in a lightweight rod.....even if i could only get 110-125 hp out of it, it would still be getting 30+ mpg and have enough power to put a grin on mot anyones face....they get about 25 mpg in the truck, so a rod thats almost half the weight should get better mileage....

if that isn't enough power, a 88-92 probe GT turbo engine will bolt to a b2200 transmission and with a few upgrades will put out 200+ hp on mostly stock components and still get 30+ mpg with the boost turned down.......

 

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=97362

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18580

couple of threads we have had on 4 cylinders

 

Elcornus, cool pic of the little 4 banger.

In stock, but stripped form what kinda weight are we talking about for engine and trans?
A five speed would be nice.

How about horsepower and torque ratings?

Since a lot of late models have electronic, computer controlled spark modules - for want of a better word - what's the biggest problem with adapting distributors to the little fours?

Lessee . . . a Deuce roadster with an SBC, T-350 and nine inch, along with standard hot rod suspension front and rear comes in at about 2300#.

Looking from here you could get yourself a 4 cylinder stick shift Deuce roadster - or similar - to come in at 1900# or so if you really paid attention.

Since 200 HP isn't too hard to come by in these engines, performance would be on a par - or better - than the old standby 350-350-9".

My calculations show a 1/4 mile time of 112 mph @ 11.8 ET with the little 4 banger.

If only 150 HP was available, times would be right around the mid twelves at 104 mph.

I've seen a couple of steel Deuce roadsters running the SBC, T-350 etc. and they crank off ET's in the twelves @ 112 mph so the four ought to be able to take care of itself on the track.

As far as the gas pumps go . . . pretty is as pretty does....

 

I think it all boils down to a matter of taste and symantics. While having a 70 or 80 something Toyota, or Honda, or whatever from that time period, is not a "Traditional Rod" I can agree with that. Then is something with a 92 350/350 "Traditional"?

I think it is still "Traditional Rodding", in the sense that people are using what is available to them. In 1955 I'm sure a Model A was very cheap to buy and get running with a Nailhead or whatever.

If it's not your cup of tea, that's fine. I like to see the stuff that is a little off of the beaten path, even if I wouldn't prefer to have one of the same. (And can you really say some of Ed Roth's designs and cars and art were "Traditional"? Man, somebody is gonna flame me for this one.) I say kuddo's to the Hot Rod Spirit in it all, "Traditional" or otherwise.

 

That would be FREAKIN" HILARIOUS Ryan!

Seriously, I have a thing for water cooled VW's. I'd like to put a rabbit motor in a little roadster. I already have a spare carb manifold. I could paint swastikas all over it and put a German helmet roof on... Nads, Do you still have that gas pedal??

 

I have been to their site and also emailed them for additional questions I had. No replies yet, but they are likely busy selling and not answering questions for a living.

Dick Walter's 27 looked very good and he used the 3T-C engine from an '82 Corolla on his. The Nissan 240Z carbs looked great in the pic of it. He used the three-speed Corolla automatic. He used a Nissan truck rear end. Not sure what his MPG or HP is, but the engine only took a small amount of freshening up and puts out enough to spin his rod nicely about the neighborhood.

I am interested to find out which year model would work best if you were more inclined to be looking for economy, dependability, enough power to get you around town and just a fun car. Not looking for break-neck speed or much more than a good little daily driver. Is there a particular year model engine that is best to look for when hoping to not have all the computer gizmo crap on it? Would it be best to stick to a Toyota truck rear end or a Corolla rear end? What tranny was used with these?

I used to be a rock crawler before my back injury, and ran a 22r
in my rock buggy. The motor had 26?,000 miles on it and ran like a top.
Great gas mileage and easy to keep running.

Under a hood top with no sides, 4 intake stacks out one side and a header out the other, why not put it in a lite car and have a blast? I know it doesn't
fit what a lot of people think of as a "trad." car. But, if your not claiming it to be "trad", who cares?

I hope to run the sedan as a fenderless tudor. Not sure if the engine bay will be fully opened. I have seen some that look great buttoned up and some that just have the side panels on. At Pate today, I saw some of the worst excuses for street rods I have ever seen in my life. Rat Rods can be nice, but even as such, safety has to be a consideration. Some of the stuff I saw was gosh awful and some was pretty neat. Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder when it comes to what a street rod is or is not. Me, I have no problems at all in swapping out a stock A engine for one of these. Tradition, smadition. My car and my pleasure to do as I please in that regard.

I'd love to see some more pics of the r20 or r22 engines in Model A's or even in the actual Toyotas they came in. I'd really love to get more info from someone who has worked with them and used them in a street rod.

I still believe that the current rod group will age and, eventually, many of what some call traditional rods today will have Junior out there putting any sort of Jap engine in them that he pleases. Since so many are very comfortable with rice rockets, and the popularity of them is much greater with the younger crowd these days, then this is a very likely swap of the future. Junior may love Dad's ol' jalopy, but less and less folks will actually know how to baby a big block or replace parts to a blower and such. They will indeed end up going with the knowledge base they have and street rods will take on a different route as to what is and what is not traditional.

Me, I like the swap and feel very comfortable in thinking of going that route on my sedan. After what all I saw at Pate today, I sure could not muck it up any worse than the so called street rodders who butchered the machines I saw at the swap. Rat Rod or not, many were P.O.S. once finished.


I can see the fellows point of not liking the looks or even the basic idea of such swaps, but to each his own. As I said at the begining of the post, I'd like to hear the positive instead of the negative on it.

 

I've gathered up an Alfa Romeo 2.0L twin-cam four for my project.... no pics, but it's another alternative.

 

I like to see some tech info on the Toy motors. All I lnow about them is that a Celica will likey blow the Pintos off the track at the mini-stock races. I think there is a place today for small. light, ecco-rods. They could be biult using traditional styling cues and be a fun entry level rod.

I can vouch for the Probe GT. I had a new one fifteen years ago. It would smoke the average Camero or 5.0 in town. Wish I still had it but the girlfriend totaled it for me. I'm sure there is another one like it in a cheap car lot or salvage yard nearby. The Probe motor is a Mazda so a pickup trans should bolt right up.

I've got a traditional motor sitting on my garage floor right now. It will contunie to ocupy that space until I can rasie the funds for that cool stroker crank, awsome finned heads and perfect three two setup. I could have a complete running ecco-rod Model A or wait for the perfect dream. What would you do?

 

I drive an 87 Toyo pickup, It has a full frame, and I keep thinking about lifting the cab and bed off and building some kind of Rothesque body on it. Hmmmmm.

 

I'm sure it would work just fine! A few weeks ago I saw a red model A pickup just outside of Benson in Mescal at a car show. The hood side panel was up & of course I looked & looked again "A Chevy v-6" I was amazed at just how well that fit in there. If I were to build something like that I guess I would be thinking about a Chevy V-6 as well. Gary 4T950 Chevy Guy

 

I think its a great idea, Ive been kicking this idea around for the last 4 or 5 years. Granted its not traditional by todays standards but really the whole premise of building hotrods originated around what was available at the specific time. The whole idea of hotrodding from my stand point is drivablity, these little motors are rock solid and you cant destroy one without working at it. I drove a track roadster a couple years ago that had a Toy 4 witha 5 speed and it run like a wildcat, I feel in love plus it got about 30 miles to a gallon, no cooling issues, and fit well between deuce rails no real clearance issues.

Im currently planning a 40s style roadster pickup with the later toy motor and a 5 speed for use around town as well as long hauls.

Im glad to see some new innovation.................Thanks RP