strongest choice for Model A frame- without all the new fangled garbage or brackets?

I just need to find the strongest perimiter frame available for a full fendered Model A. I don't want any brackets welded on at all- it will be running a 460/C6/9 inch, long traction bars, etc. and nobody sets them up for those anyway. Also, the steering will need to be something custom with that motor, and I don't want IFS or a kick up/out in the back.

None of the places I have browsed at list the wall thickness or box size?

So who makes the strongest frame?

Would deuce rails be a good choice, and does anybody sell just a perimiter deuce frame with x-member?

Who take orders for custom perimiter frames?

OR, would anybody here think of boxing the stock frame? I just don't think that would be a safe choice at all.......


I don't want to make my own for several reasons- I don't think I could weld it up straight given my work area or tools, the cost of steel, and the time involved. I need a good starting point ASAP!

THANKS

 

Try Total Cost Involved. K-MEMBER ran a frame from them on his A. No fenders but a 460 Ford, sometimes with a blower. We just got the basic boxed perimeter frame and it was cheap. He seemed happy with it. Rolled it over coming back from B'ville, and drove it home..........OLDBEET

 

sounds like the kind of strength I'm looking for! Power output probably won't be over 500hp, and I'll add my own x-member if I can't find one with it, just want the largest box available- 2x4? Standard is 1.5x3 right?

 

here's the plan:

 

Call Frank Borowitz at Premier Body and Frame in Phoenix. They specialize in hot rod Model T, Model A and Duece frames. Good, strong stuff at a reasonable price ( they built my '32 frame, I'm happy). Tel: 602-248-0812

 

There are quite afew places that make model A frames, TCI, Ch***is Engineering, Brookville to name a few. Most places you can buy them in any stage. A basic perimeter frame is around $500. I started with a basic TCI perimeter frame back in 1984 when I built my A, it has held up well although I'm not running a large motor. I think it is Dagels, offers an x-member that can be added if deemed necessary. 32 frames are also available in whatever configuration you want also, it depends how you want you car to look.

 

That is waaaaaay Cool !

 

thanks- the last thing to decide is whether it will be blown or not. If so, that means the expense of machine work. Right now the motor is all together and running great. But, we can figure that out later. The name is also up in the air- we have a couple floating around

 

Check with Killer (Jason) he built me a great frame for a good price. Killer job.

 

I like the concept!! Though I think you might want to stab a few louvers into the backside of the front fenders before that thing takes flight at speed!!!

 

I purchased a perimeter frame from Last Refuge Hot Rods for under $500. The frame is straight and true with tight clean TIG welds. Very good communication and nice people to boot.

 

nice! I saw that frame yesterday and liked it, good to hear a thumbs up from an owner. Looks nice and strong. Are you running fenders?

 

well, I heard back from Last Refuge, and they told me this frame:



of 2x4 box wouldn't be enough for my 460? I was quite surprised, but glad they were honest with me. Do you think maybe they underestimate the strength for liability reasons, cause if this won't hold a 460, what would?
If this won't hold, then many of the weaker perimiter frames certainly wouldn't.
Am I religated to deuce rails with a large x-member, cause if so I couldn't run fenders, which will defeat the purpose of my g***er concept

Of course I'd put some crossmembers in, but what have other 460 Model A's used?

thanks

 

Talk to LRS they supply frames to some of the big street rod builders where Liability would really be an issue. If they can't supply a frame for you ask them for a solution. The model "A" g***ers back in the 50's -60's put out some serious torque on stock (boxed & braced) frames and I didn't hear about too many problems.

Link: http://www.streetrodderstuff.com/

 

any aftermarket perimeter frame you buy is going to be made from 2x4x.120 wall rec. tubing. I don't know of any production type company who will step out of the norm and build you something out of thicker steel.

at 500 horsepower, you will need some sort of k member and a roll cage... not a "traditional" style roll bar... I mean a freakin cage!

If you go with a thicker main rail, you will add a bunch of weight. Might not be an issue for you? Are you planning on going fast or just looking the part?

The problem with alot of aftermarket tubular k members for model a frames is the lack of support..most only add support from the trans crossmember to the rear kick... what about the front???? Thats where all the twisting is happening!

I think an ideal set up for a street car would be a 2x4x.188 wall rect. tube perimeter frame with a tubular k member that goes from the bellhousing area to the rear kick... packaging would be a nightmare... especially if you want to shift it yerself or put the master cylinder under the floor....

and a cage.

Looks like a neat project BTW... good luck on it.

 

If you're going to run fenders and splash aprons, why not make the main rails from 2x6 material instead of 2x4? A lot of the strength is in the height, not the thickness of the metal.

Dan

 

that's what I was thinking, and why I was considering deuce rails- I'm just looking for a base to work off of though. I don't think my work area or skills could produce a frame that I would fully trust. If I have a known quality and squared perimiter I can add the rest though So, if anybody knows of a 2x6 perimiter available I'd appreciate the lead.

I have seen some 1.5x3 A frames, that just wouldn't cut it IMO

The motor will have between 400 and 500 horses I'd say based on my budget

I won't be racing it, but I do plan to go fast every time I drive it

And I definitely plan on at least a 6 point cage- so would that add the strength I need?

 

It won't matter if you use 6" rails or heavier material. The issue is that a flat frame won't withstand much torque without twisting. The stock type front crossmember is probably the weakest point.
To get strength and resist the twist, you need to get a 3 dimensional frame design. The most obvious way to do this is install a roll cage. That takes the geometry upward and stops any twist. If you don't want a cage, you can accomplish the same thing by using 3-D transmission K-members, engine and rear suspension crossmembers, etc. Take a look at the pic attached.
I plan to use a stout small block chevy in an A framed pickup and have the same concern. My current thinking is to hide 2 "cage" bars under the dash using 1.25" tubing and another behind the seats and within the bed. This will raise the plane of the ch***is enough to provide vertical triangulation enough to stop any twist. I don't plan to race routinely and have no interest in a roll cage.
Personally, I recommend LRS, Inc. for custom frames. I really can't say enough about the quality, on-time work that Randy delivered. He is an engineer by definition and won't steer you wrong.

Good luck!

http://streetrodderstuff.com/