Looking ahead, I can honestly see no end to the gas prices... especially now that WWIII has practically broken out overseas. It's got me thinkin... The wife's big block 454 Suburban has been tweeked and tweeked and we are sneaking up on 11MPG, which isn't bad for a bored, stroked, balanced and blueprinted, cammed big block with a new Holley 750... but it's not enough for a travelling nurse who trips 300-400 miles three or four times a week. I've found an adjustable fuel injection unit (can be used on small or big blocks)... would this be a good thing to try for fuel economy? Even if it just squeezed another 5 MPG... it would help. She doesn't need the massive power that old gal gives her now, and we're willing to sacrifice a few horses for a few gallons of gas. I'm ready to try anything before I go swapping to a smaller engine. Input?
the yellow one? I thought it was yours? Best I ever did with a Suburban was 13-14 on the highway with my 66, with a mild 454 and a qjet, and 3.07 rearend gears. Fuel injection won't help much. Gearing might....do you know what rearend gears it has? probably kind of steep, seeing as it's a 3/4 ton, right? maybe some type of overdrive is in her future, or maybe a smaller vehicle! a $1000 beater will pay for itself in gas bills in about two months. Bottom line, don't expect to get much better mileage than you're getting now, no matter what you do.
Inertia RULES. Your fighting an uphill battle both ways with a big block powered load like a Suburban. Realistically you ought to be looking for a smaller vehicle. With the money you'd save you could literally buy a new house. Do the math.....your wife is driving 1200-1600 miles a week. Lets call it an average of 1400 miles. With 11 MPG your burning up 127 gallons of gas per week. At 3 dollars a gallon your spending 381 dollars PER WEEK on gasoline. Thats $1651 dollars PER MONTH on gasoline alone. HELLO!!!!!McFLYYYYY!!!!! If you get a car that gets 30 miles per gallon you'll be saving 1000 dollars a month. Go buy your wife a brand new gas-sipper and spend the 12,000 dollars a year you'll be saving on gas on a new shop and another hotrod, hell you could even afford a brand new girlfriend on the side AND keep a lawyer on retainer! ...and if you don't need the extra money you'd save on gas then why worry about the fuel mileage in the first place? -Bigchief.
Hmmm let's do the math: 900 miles a week / 11 MPG = 81.82 gallons per week 81.82 gallons x $2.75 (I'm being generous)per gallon = $225 / week in fuel I dunno man, I'd be looking for a little Toyota or something small to drive for work. Let do some more math with a smaller car: 900 miles week/25 MPG = 36 gallons week fuel 36 x $2.75 per gallon = $99 week in fuel cost $225 / week Suburban - $ 99 / small car _____________ $126 / week savings in fuel x 50 work weeks a year ________________ $6,300 / year in savings. How long will it take a little car to pay for itself??? The figures I used are generous figuring low cost for gas, high mileage for the Suburban nad low mileage for the small car ( I get 31-31 MPG from my Toyota - yes I know. I swear I'll paint the wheels red next weekend ) If gas goes to $3.25 / gallon thats another $160+/- month in fuel costs. I understand the joys of power and having a 'Burb to haul stuff in but your fuel costs have to be eating you alive.. Can you keep the Suburban for the fun and work stuff but afford a more efficient car for daily driving? Chasing an extra 5 MPG seems like a lot of work vs. the cost of switching to EFI hoping to gain those 5 MPG. How much will the injection swap cost you? If you can do it economically and make sure it's reliable enough for all those Kansas miles (not to mention your "moody" weather) then go for it. I personally would be looking for a daily driver that's easier on the budget.
I totally agree , I have had a few older ( mid to late 1980's ) volkswagens and its way easier than changing the "hobby car" to make it more fuel friendly. I had an 88 VW Fox with 125k and got 35 mph, I paid 200.00 for it and it was in good conditon. A/c, stereo, nice interior , it was a good deal.
Replace the Holley with a Quadrajet, 1 to 2 mpg increase for minimal cost. Pump all the tires up to the max psi rating on the sidewall, up to 1 mpg for no cost. I'd park the 'burb and buy a smaller car, unless it's needed for hauling stuff during all that driving.
Thanks for the responses... First of all - I HAVE done the math, or I wouldn't be on here trying to find out if fuel injection would save any fuel. Second - We can't afford to run out and buy a new vehicle, we have no credit, and can't afford the full coverage insurance a car/truck with a lein would require... This "Burb was practically free... no payments, and lowest insurance you can get. The wife and I were in a head-on collison five years ago, and getting her into a tiny little "gas-sipper" will be out of the question...she's scared to death of them. She likes stuff big, tall, loud (must be her attraction to me) and made of heavy metal. Yes, she honestly drives a few thousand miles a month. The 'Burb has been ideal because she can crawl in the back and sleep when she gets tired on the way home sometimes, she's got the power to blow past semi-trucks on hills, and even though it's just two-wheel drive it's a 3/4 ton and up in the air a bit so she feels a lot "safer" when it comes to encountering a deer or two on a dark highway... the 'Burb would make soup of them if they ever met. It lights up the road, which she likes. It's loud and obnoxious (which she's grown accustomed to living with me)... and the sucker was practically free. THAT is why I'm trying to squeeze some more gas mileage out of the old thing. Okay then - what kinda engine-swap would be the least trouble and best mileage, without giving up a hell of a lot of power? I could always save the 454 for something else Could you just park this creampuff?
Yeah, it was mine until she drove it once, ha. Tell me more about gears... what would a stock 3/4 ton have in there, and what could I re-gear with... or do I have to change the entire rearend assmbly? It does rap pretty loud at 75.
i'm not sure about a 3/4 ton, but i'm sure it can't be higher than a 3.73. if it's turning 3200 or so at 70 with a 3 speed auto, it's probably around that. switch that gear to no larger than a 3.08(these were stock in alot of cars around that time and won't be hard to find a chunk at a junkyard), headers and dual exhaust if you haven't already(little bit of mileage there), keep it tuned really well, new plugs and wires help, smaller carb, clean air filter, decent fuel pump, clean fuel lines, overdrive tranny. but if it were me, i'd sell the damn thing and get something smaller. i know she's scared, but jesus, that's alot of damn money!
Putting a Q-jet on it would be a great start. Consider a cam swap back to a mild RV cam. That's probably the biggest improvement you could make. Putting an O/D tranny in it would be a good idea. What intake is on it?
Greg, I respect your wife's feelings on that big ol Suburban, I couldn't imagine shelling out that kinda gas money every week - Yowch! A LOT of people are rethinking thier big gas-sucking SUV's right now - and I'd bet most of them are the folks that never go farther than the nearest mall than anyone with a real need for that type vehicle. You know the ones, they make about 15 attempts to get their Hummer into a 'compact' parking spot so they can go shoe shopping. My brother works for Carmax and said they have so many people trading their big behemoths in that Carmax is allowing a considerable amount (I think it was a full 20%?) below low wholesale on any SUV/full size 4x4. He said most people still don't hesitate to trade'em in! Back to your question, if it were me I'd look for a TBI 350 out of a 1988-up Chevy/GMC 1500 series, maybe find a wreck/theft recovery at the auction? They're fairly bulletproof and you can buy upgraded throttle bodies, header, etc. I think it'd be a relatively easy swap. According to fueleconomy.gov, a 1990 2wd Suburban with a 5.7 averages 13 city and 18 hwy MPG. Good luck on it. I'm thankful my wife's Monte Carlo and my college student daughter's Jetta average 29 and 33 MPG respectively.
I run about 18 mpg with my 93 2wd 1/2 T Burb, 350 but the 3/4t is a lot heaver truck, so I would find a 1/2T for her and trade.
guiseart, definately know alot of girls like the big tall vehicle so they don't feel intimidated on the road, but as far as safety goes, newer vehicles are much better. couple years ago I hit a pole with my 2002 nissan frontier 4x4 wasn't wearing a seat belt but the bags went off and I didn't even have a scratch. last month my mother had a stroke and hit a pole in her little hyundai with the same results. the way the math works out you can cut your costs in half including the payment for the new vehicle and the insurance. if you can afford the gas money now you can find a dealer that will give yuo a loan, even if it is a high interest rate
Overdrive, that'll make a huge huge improvement. Go crazy with it too, that 454 will haul that heavy bastard at very low RPM's. BBC's are worth a lot more than SBC's, I bet you could find someone that would trade a damn good SBC straight across for it, maybe even a tranny as well. I know ya probably wanted to hear some easier answers but man there just aren't any. BBC's are about power, not saving you money. I laughed my ass off at "HELLOO MCFFLLYYY!!" LOL
If it were mine, here's what I'd do: Transmission: Either swap in a later model overdive auto to drop the rpm, or swap the TH400 out for a TH350 with a lock-up converter. That might not be the plan everyone else would suggest, but the lock-up would drop the rpm on the highway. You could go a bucks-up route and buy a Gear Vendors, too. If it's a stick now, GM made a 4spd OD trans for their trucks when that thing was new. Find one. Get the rear gear swapped out! As said earlier, 3.08. I've talked with some guys who do open road racing, and they noticed better economy/lower rpm at speeds with an open dif instead of a posi unit, so you might think about that. Q-jet, if you can find one that isn't worn out. Aluminium intake--take 30 pounds off the nose. (That's like whizzing in the ocean to raise its level, but every little bit will help) Since we're on that subject, an aluminum intake, water pump, mini-starter, radiator and aluminum heads would shave a ton of weight off the front of the truck. Maybe 150lbs? They say every 100lbs is a tenth in the quarter mile. Obviously, if the truck is pushing less weight in the long run, you'll get a little benefit. Same with having an aluminum radiator made. These changes may not be practical, but what the hell--might as well insluce them. Find a later-model space saver spare, too--they're on a thinner rim, and are lighter. Sealed air cleaner with a cold air induction feed. Theoretically, you'll make more power with cold air, so the truck won't have to run so hard at the same RPM. Air in/air out makes power, so add headers and a free-flowing dual exhaust. Now, for the one nobody has mentioned: Aerodynamics are your friend. If that thing pushes less air, it'll get better fuel economy. Lower it 3 inches all the way around, put clear headlight covers on it, and a chin spoiler under the front bumper. Even if it's a home-made piece of thick aluminum under the bumper. Believe it or not, my kid and I did a science project with a die-cast Hummer in a wind tunnel, and there were measuerable benefits from lowering the truck, adding a chin spoiler and headlight covers. Lowering that thing 3 inches is still going to put it above everything else on the road that isn't a Kenworth. If it's got dual gas tanks, don't fill them both up: gas is heavy, and there's no sense running around with all that extra weight just so you don't have to stop and get gas. That's my nickle's worth. -brad
I'd start looking around for a donor truck with a 5.7 TBI and overdrive. The combination should almost double your mileage. I just parked my trusty old Dodge Ramcharger because the 360 was only pulling down 10-12 mpg with a three speed auto and 3.55 gear. I drive about 600 miles a week and gas was killing me. I picked up a '95 T-Bird with a 4.6 for $350 that gets 22-25 mpg about a month ago. It's paid for itself multiple times already.
what brand of gas do you buy, I think their stock should be going up. with the money you are spending on gas you could buy a little car to commute and save a small fortune, wouldnt help the stock price though Larry
If safety is a concern, later model vw's are very safe. My sister was in her 92 golf going 60 when a drunk in a 80's LTD ran a light and stopped right in front of her. She didn't even have time to react and tboned him at full speed. The golf crupled all around (even the rear hatch was twisted!) exactly as it was designed to do, and kept the cabin almost perfectly intact. The dash only got pushed back about an inch. You have to remember that modern cars are designed for crashes to protect the passengers. Not so with the suburban. Heavy and big isn't always safer. If you really want good mileage I'd look for a good used Jetta or Passat wagon TDI. Yeah, diesel. With a wagon she could fold down the seats and sleep, but you'd get over 40 mpg highway.
If you get it tweaked just right, EFI might bump you from your current 11 mpg to 13-14 mpg. EFI coupled to a decent OD transmission might make that 16-18 mpg, or about what a same size/weight Hummer gets. It's going to take a lot of miles to get a payback. Most of the energy is simply going into moving all that mass and overcoming the wind resistance of what is basically a "brick on wheels". EFI can't overcome that. The laws of thermodynamics dictate only so much efficiency with that technology. That's a nice suburban, but doing that kind of commute in that kind of car has its price. Good luck when gas goes to $5.00/gallon (and it will, soon).
thanks to everyone... might pull the 454 and save it for a "weekender", muahhaahaa! A newer smaller bronco, blazer or something is what she has in mind now, and we appreciate the help! She still has to travel a lot on shitty Kansas roads, rain or shine, so an AWD would be a plus.
. Do the math.....your wife is driving 1200-1600 miles a week. Lets call it an average of 1400 miles. With 11 MPG your burning up 127 gallons of gas per week. At 3 dollars a gallon your spending 381 dollars PER WEEK on gasoline. Thats $1651 dollars PER MONTH on gasoline alone. HELLO!!!!!McFLYYYYY!!!!! If you get a car that gets 30 miles per gallon you'll be saving 1000 dollars a month. Besides all that, you're using up a lot of gas the rest of us could could be burnin' in our rigs!! Build her a Model A coupe with an ECOTEC 4-banger(full hood, of course), 5spd, and A/C. She'll arrive at work fresh and cool, and look good doing it!
I put a Hone overdrive in my suburban behind the 454/th400, when it had 3.73 gears, and gained 1-2 mpg on the highway. I put the same overdrive in my 39 chevy with a 350/350 and 3.23 gears and gained 5 mpg. od doesn't do as much in a suburban as it does in a smaller car! something about having too much aerodynamic drag and weight to move. The 3/4 ton chevy rearends came in 3.21 as the lowest ratio, which was used in some diesels, and it is very hard to find those gears/rearends, from what I understand. I've seen a lot of that body style suburban for sale cheap lately around here...wonder why? The best bet for improving the mileage would probably be the efi 350/700 combination, it would take some time, work, knowledge, and $$$$ to get it in and working. Ever driven a crown vic? great cars...27 mpg on the road....
I have to question a couple of your statements. You can buy a used toyota for about $2000, so there doesn't have to be a note or bank involved. Those things are all over at buy here/pay here lots that won't require full coverage, but may cost a third more. The money factor is still within reason. Second, liability insurance on a burb is way higher than a compact or even a mid-sized car strictly due to the potential to do damage or harm a person. So there is more money to be saved there. Third, spend a few bucks more to get a compact with air bags and you are WAY safer than in the burb with none in any crash that gives you a chance of survival. High speed crashes kill, period. It doesn't matter what you are driving because they are so violent. Most collisions are under 50 mph, where air bags work, no question. I sold a full size truck for a Jetta and cut my liability costs by 75%. The comp and collision were peanuts. Call your agent and get a quote on a few different cars. You will be amazed. Also do some research on the injuries that people get in full size trucks without air bags. Again, you will be amazed. I wish you luck in your quest, but you need to really evaluate your needs and goals against what you are spending. I'll drive my Honda to work and save the gas sucking thrill ride for weekends and recreation. Oh, if you just have to keep driving the burb so much, think about a dedicated propane system. Same mpg, same power, 60% cheaper, under $1000 to switch. My rod will be on propane by spring and I hope for 25 mpg and 12 second ETs.
yep go with a honda toyota or a vw. i had an old dasher wagon 2 years ago that was a diseal and got 40 mpg. i wish i still had it!!!! i'm driving a 85 land cruiser and at best get 13mpg. i'm going to get something else to drive.
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