OK, so I got the door skins cut off the old doors('29 closed cab PU), Howell's patch panels on route, trying to get the frames squared up in the openings, etc....coupla spots where I need to patch the door frames before I try to re-skin em. The question I have is this: I'm running a Lincoln 215 MIG (the BIG mofo) and I only have it running .035 wire. Do I need a spool of .025 wire and some .025 tips? Am I going to burn the **** out of this metal and warp it bad if I use .035 wire? Hook me up with some of that crazy metalworkers info, bros....
You should be able to step down to .030 by fliping the feed roller. If you go to .025 you'll probably need to buy new rollers. The 030 will work fine, and be worth buying the wire and tips. I'm ***uming your welding in a partial skin? My first choice would be gas welding, but if your not up to it the MIG will be fine.
i would say use what you already have, others on here may say different. .035 isn't really that big of wire and as long as you take your time welding on the new door skin you should be fine. don't expect it to not warp, but if you do a tack, let it cool down and move on it is less likely to warp. i would take the skin and clamp in ALL of the possible spots you can, and tack it all the way around before removing your clamps and then i would start making my tacks opposite from one another
Use compressed air to cool each tack you make as you make them- pretty much eliminates any heat related problems- Good Luck...
Would I do well to run a line of Heat Fence on either side of the weld where the panels **** up against each other?
You're not talkng a lot of welding on a Model A door skin replacement.....Dollying the skin around the inner door frame will give it some strength and a few good spot welds at intervals will suffice.....should not require hardly and work on the exterior of door if done carefully. By that I meant, starting the skins flange-folded over with the hammer and dolly in about 3 stages not "all over" in one motion......
Look at some late model repair materials for this . If you believe a traditional car should be repaired with traditional methods . So be it. Technology has advanced quite alot in the last decade. Todays autos have their outer door panels bonded to the inner door frame. Why ? The auto designers have revisited the engineering in a door and asked what can we improve in this part. One of the major problems with a door ***y is the moisture that collects at the bottom of the door at the hem flange . This is the major starting point for rust thru at the lower sections of the door. Look at the lower section of a 6 to 8 year old car they have eliminated the rust problem( not applicable in any dry climate states)They reasoned if the gap could be eliminated the rust problem could be eliminated or modified . Their solution was to epoxy bond the entire outer panel to the frame . There still are some spot welds in the upper areas of the door and a couple of tacks just to keep the skin in place while the adhesive sets. This method has been around for the last decade. and is very applicable to your repair . The epoxy fills the gaps and eliminates the moisture in the seams and an added plus is increased strenth in the ***y with reduced flexing. This stuff works. The door skin bonding kits are available at any auto paint supply house 3M part # 8115 ( about $34.00 per kit) . Do read the instructions before starting as there are a couple of things you need to do for the process to work correctly. Once the adhesive is applied to the frame and skin put them together just like any other time your skinning a door. Use rubber or latex gloves when applying adhesive and hammering the hem flange into place.It doesn't come off your fingers easily. Be sure you door lines up right to the opening before the adhesive sets . Giving the door a final tweak to fit is really tough after the epoxy cures. Wipe your flanges clean with thinner after your done peening over the hem flange . Interestingly enough this family of adhesives are being used to bond wing and fuselage surfaces in aircraft and even being used in the ***y of the autos unibody . Again just a thought about updated materials. Larry
Larry's advice about using a bonding adhesive sounds like a good way to go. I've heard of this from another HAMBer years ago, Mecutem, who does this sort of collision work professionally. Thanks for the part numbers. I'll have to get some of this stuff when I get wealthy again. I was told that it's also just a matter of cutting a patch for a rusted out spot, applying the bonder, and giving it a light coat of filler over the patch. for the hobbiest who doesn't have a welder, this is a good tool to have. I've had a lot of experience, having welded for over 35 years. The inner parts of a Model A door are a bit heavier than the skins, which are .035". So using your big Lincoln with.035" wire shouldn't be a big problem when making repairs. Like others have suggested, use some air to cool the welded areas, skip around, clamp everything to keep it square, and go easy on it. One question that I'm wondering about, if you were to use the bonder, would it still be possible to spot weld around the skin to the frame as originally done?... Years back, I built the ***embly line for the new Jeep Grand Cherokee, that body uses a bonder that's applied as the parts are ***embled and then resistance (spot ) welded. The entire body ***embly then goes thru a heating chamber to harden the theroset plastic used to bond the body together. This was technology that Daimler-Benz brought to Chrysler.
Good luck with the Howells patch panels, I had no luck with the fit on them.. I would check fit first- width, radius and bead if you have to match the other panels on the same side and how close do it look????? most of there panels are hand made and not die stamped.
Hello, It's been my experience with MIG that using anything smaller than .030 wire is like trying to push a wet noodle through the liner. I'd stick with the .035, but .030 shouldn't give you any problem. Keep the leed very straight & not kinked. Stick with an Argon / CO2 mix 'cause just plain CO2 is for Beer. Carl Hagan out here in KC-KS
You should be fine with the .035 wire, just do a quick test weld on s**** metal of similar thickness to make sure your not running to much heat into the panel. When I was still in school for practice my instructors had us weld thin gauge steel togather with a .035 welder to improve our skills. I found turning down the heat and wire speed made it alot easier to get good clean welds without blowing tons of holes. Keep it cool with compressed air or water. I prefer water becasue it does a certaint level of heat strengthening of the metal. palosfv3 brought up a good point about the bonding adheasive. It will help cut down on the moisture that gets stagnant in the creases. When I change a skin at work I use a good thick coat around the entire edge letting it form a bead on the inside of the door where the two panels meet, even though it means more cleanup on the door jamb when I'm done peening the skin's edges over.
I've got a Miller 210 and have no problems running 025 wire. I do a lot of sheetmetal work and prefer to use the smaller wire on sheetmetal. There has been times when I just didn't feel like changing the wire and have used the 035 wire without problems. You just have to be more careful and quick with the trigger. Clark
When applying the adhesive follow the hints in the instructions. After removeing all paint and corrosion from the door frame edge, test fit your panel. If everything is ok, apply a bead of adhesive around the flange of the frame. Take a bondo spreader and spread the adhesive on the flange,almost like your applying bondo to fill a dent. you should not leave any bare metal in the areas that will contact the outer panel. The ideal height of this coat should be 1/16" to 1/8". Now do the same to the outer panel .You can use a little less on this step but be sure to again cover all bare metal in about 1/2" inboard of the hem . If you do this right you will have little cleanup to do after hammering the flange over but will have the correct amount of adhesive to be most effective. Larry
Sweet im going tomorrow to get that bonding agent for my non Hamb friendly project. doing outer door skin!
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