My taste in old cars is to make modifications subtle enough that the body & chassis appear to be near stock. Even an engine swap should look like a factory installation. With this in mind, I’ve been considering swapping out the original steering box in my survivor ‘33 Ford 3 window. I’ve a friend with a ‘32, which utilizes a Hudson steering box. Since the Hudson box closely resembles the early Ford box, this swap appeals to my taste. While walking the Hershey swap meet, I found & purchased a nice condition steering box assembly. Other than the large 4 bolt mounting flange, it looked like the photos found of the 1937 Hudson box. Since I didn’t find a true Hudson box and I’ve read that they can be really expensive, I gambled and bought the unknown heritage box/column (under $100). Once I got my experiment back home, I cleaned away most of the accumulated grease coating and found a series of numbers which I found to be associated with the ‘39/‘47 Dodge truck. My research on the Hudson box indicated that Gemmer made steering boxes for Ford, Nash, Hudson, and some Chrysler products. This “Hershey” steering box accepts a ‘33/4 Ford pitman arm & steering wheel. The steering shaft is hollow, like the original Ford shaft. When compared to the original’33/4 Ford steering assembly, the Dodge appears to be an alternative worth considering. Both the Dodge & F1 steering columns are approximately 2” longer than the original Ford column. The Dodge sector is approximately 1” longer than the F1 & original’33/4 Ford. The F1 box is approximately an inch bulkier than either the Dodge & original ‘33/4 Ford. Both the F1 & the Dodge sector housing diameter are larger than the early Ford. According to my research, the Hudson box mounting flange has nearly the same bolt pattern as the original Ford - but the flange angle requires shims to match the early Ford frame. Since none of these alternatives are an exact swap, all require mounting flange shims/replacement & enlarged sector housing hole in the frame, and the columns are longer, the Dodge looks like a logical consideration. An offset late ‘30’s Ford pitman arm compensates for the longer sector. The Dodge gives you more available engine space, compared to the F1 box. Have any of y’all used/researched/considered this option? I’m including photos of the steering boxes & columns.
Here are a few photos of a Hudson steering box, which I found on the Internet. The Dodge version looks very similar to the Hudson.
Have a gemmer Ford, Dodge, Hudson also, ( different projects) don't beat me up ! The dodge included a top of the frame mount similar to some of the G.M. units otherwise all very much alike.
Oh yeah ! Right you are, NealinCa is the man, actually my 32 dirt car was first built in 1956 using a gemmer Dodge truck steering box & had an f-100 in a 31 Chevy in 1958, so been in & around em too !
I am doing a RHD Hudson into RHD 34 at the moment, you can see in my thread below. The Dodge Gemmer you have is very similar in the fact it is overslung like the Hudson as opposed to underslung column on the F1 so its a good candidate. Your Dodge will likely use RHD Ford Internals (the hudson I have uses LHD) worm and roller or very similar anyway, possibly sector shaft length differences but close. I did an early Gemmer awhile back that was 17:1 and was able to put the 18:1 worm and roller in it, (Thanks to Neal Jennings for the advice) no problem as the datums allow it. For the Hudson conversion into the 34, its utilising F1 LHD sector shaft into the RHD Hudson to get a closer to stock pitman arm position. (shorter sector shaft) and is being machined for a recessed outer bushing to allow for a 1-1/8 ID x 1-1/2 OD lip seal (the hudsons had an external seal held by a spring.) The plan is to utilise the original 34 worm shaft, fitted with the 37-48 (F1)Worm and Roller and 34 pitman arm, column jacket, steering column drop lock and wheel. Good thing it seems with the Gemmers there are lots of options to explore to get what you want. I also want it to look as stock as possible but with the benefits of the Gemmer 3 ratio.
Fairlane500, your feedback & information are quite helpful & encouraging. I’ve not disassembled the Dodge box, but suspected that the sector shaft could be swapped for a F1 version- or simply re-machined to make it shorter. Since I already have an offset pitman arm, I’ll first try using it “as is”. The Dodge box utilizes a sector seal, similar to what you describe. The exterior diameter of the Dodge sector housing is approximately 2.125” - larger than both the F1 & original ‘33/4 box. I'm curious about what kind of bearing/bushing & seal I’ll find.
From my limited experience, and I say limited being 5 steering box rebuilds, the Gemmer 3 offerings share many common parts across the Ford, Dodge, Hudson variants. They all have their unique mountings but for the most part share common hardware and bearings seals where used. Most Early Ford parts suppliers can supply the wearing parts as 37 - 48 Ford compatible items. If you are in need of a RHD sector let me know and I will likely have one here. The sector roller is clocked left or right depending on the application (LHD, RHD, Cross Steer or Traditional Steer)
There are various Gemmer boxes that work well in old Fords, including Nash, Hudson, Dodge and Chris Craft to name a few. The Dodge pickup box you found is late 46 and 47. 39-early 46 used a Gemmer I box similar to a stock 32-34 Ford box. These boxes all share the same bearings, bushings, gaskets, etc as Ford boxes of the same era. Here are some old pics of Dodge boxes converted for 32-34 Fords... Let me know if you need any more info. Neal
Beautiful workmanship, Neal. I appreciate your willingness to share your expertise with us. I’m interested in becoming a customer and have sent you a message containing my specifics.
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