Hello, today I almost finished work with the front end. I have to do the steering. I bought in speedwaymotors steering arms but are too short and too tall. Others are not sold. I don't know what to do next. Make additional steering arms (longer or lower) or just lower the bar with screws as in the Bump Steer Kit? The car is low, so I'm a bit worried about installing the steering rod under the spring. I will be grateful for any advice.
That's why some go front steer. But many don't correct the ackerman. https://www.tbucketplans.com/bending-steering-arms/
How about moving the shackle mounts closer to the axle? I personally don’t like the idea of the extensions bolts.
I would like to have a clean front, so I did not mount the bar at the front. I have measured everything and moving the shackle mounts still will be not enough for these steering arms. Maybye this could be solution: https://www.dirtcarusa.com/products/out-pace-extreme-drop-bent-tie-rod-tubes
Just a thought since I cant really judge the clearances from here.Use bolt on spindle arms from Pete & Jakes.They come in different drops.If you use these they take early Ford rod ends.Speedway sells dropped rod ends.Listed under the 48-60 truck section they also fit early Ford rods.You gain 1-1/2 inch,or so additional drop. Between the two you should be able to run the rod under the wishbone if thats the end goal.Look at their on line catalogs for photos.
I don’t know a lot about what dropped steering arms Pete & Jake’s sell but I believe those are Econoline spindles. P&J may not offer steering arms for those.
You have really built yourself into a corner. Can you just bend the arm you have downward to clear the spring? Those bolts as extensions are horrible ideas.
I would never consider those bolt on arms much less the horrible extensions. I think you need to move the spring and shackle mounts up about 4- 5 inches. You need to Z the frame. I have some cut off stock arms I salvaged from others. Free if you would use them. I hate bolt on arms where the load is only taken by bending at the bolts. I made a set for a friend where they used one of the upper bolts also.
Good eye.I figured early Ford with the arms cut off,but they are something else.I think OP would be better off with early Ford spindles just because there are so many parts to work with.If they are Econoline then factory forged arms might be the way to go.At least a Ford forging can be heated,and dropped.
Maybe lengthen the radius rods between the spring mounts and axle the tie rod and drag link would be between spring and axle. What is the axle from? It has no "smile".
The guy is in Poland. Every change he makes probably has to be shipped in on a plane and go through a stack of customs forms. Changing his axle would be a big endeavor.
I had many of the same issues you are having on my current build. I ended up having to fabricate my own steering arms and also had to put my truck back on the table and move the shackle mounts for tie rod clearance. There are a couple of things you could do to fix your issues. One option would be to kick the front rails which would allow you to raise the shackle mounts on the wishbones.. Then you can run the tie rod tight to the underside of the wishbone. Another option would be to raise your front crossmember. It looks like it is just tacked in. Doing this would also keep your stance the same but raise the shackle mount up. Don't forget to consider your scrub line in all of this. I talked with the guys at Pete & Jakes about the tie rod extension bolts and dropped tie rod ends when I was considering how to fix my issues. They said both would cause drivability and safety issues.
The steering arms on the car now will need modification, they only have 5/8” holes (or they might only be 1/2”) for heim joints. The Jeep tie rod ends have a 7 degree tapered stud so bungs will need to be fabricated and welded to those steering arms. The bungs need 7 degree through holes that are of the correct diameter to tightly hold the tie rod studs.
It looks to me there's some tail chasing going on here resulting from an initial error, in this case the crossmember height. Ignoring the steering issue and ***uming the suspension is loaded with the engine as it appears to be, I'm thinking that the spring shackle angle is wrong and will give a harsh ride as the swing of the shackle will have a jacking effect on bumps. As it is the shackle pivot points on the bones need to be higher and further inboard (or longer spring). With the crossmember raised to help the steering matter the mounts on the bones would need to be considered further, but they still need the pivots further inboard. Folks go on about the 45 degree angle but it needs to be 45 or more (closer to vertical) but I'm seeing in the region of 45 degrees but closer to horizontal. Chris
Rather than using the bolt extensions, I'd cut thick spacer bushings, and put a bolt through them. Then weld them to the steering arms also. These shouldn't be any longer than needed, as there's not that much travel in the front axle. By welding the spacers to the arm you'll eliminate tipping, and not have to bend the arms. Use the same bolts, but cut them to length once they're through the spacer bushings.
First of all, thank you very much for every thought and comment !!! I try to ****yze it and choose the optimal solution. I took measurements today and I can see that the difference between the bottom of the spring and the top of the steering arm is 2 inches (see attached picture). I would like to avoid major changes if possible. A compromise seems to be possible bending the spindle arm or welding the spacer sleeve. Happydaze, I have read that the angle of the spring shackles must be horizontal when the spring is unloaded. This was my guiding principle when creating the shackle handle. The spring has a good spacing of holes, but it can actually be too short (maybye was made too flat, too little bend). The simplest solution to this problem will probably be to make a longer spring.
A unibit makes a poor mans tapered reamer that will make quick work of those tie rod holes. Both Samiyam and I have done it in the past with great results.
@el_coyotte Consider using a tie rod that is shaped like an anti-roll bar. It would attach to a steering arm, turn toward the front a bit, then crosswise between the axle and spring, turn back a bit, to the other steering arm. EDIT: 7:58pm —— I had not opened the link in your post #4 until now. That item is similar to what I was suggesting, only it would be used ‘horizontally’, not ‘vertically’ The downside to that is the forward cross portion will want to turn down from gravity and would require a support bracket and roller (or some such) on the backside of the axle, but the tie rod remains in the same vertical plane when moving. It would need to be a stiff material to minimize flexing but will transmit the motion, be tucked up at axle height and solve your problem. Ray
Hello Guys, after a long break, I continue my fight. First I reworked the spring mounts. For now the shackle attachments are only attached to the rocker arms. They require reinforcemen. Now at first glance the suspension is working fine. I decided to make a model of the new self made steering arms - like The Ratsplit did. I wonder if the model of steering rod is set correctly under the spring and at the right height. I hope to continue my work tomorrow. Please let me know, what do you think about it, is it the right way?
New steering arm material is too thin , spring is short ,shackles are too long , spring pivot can't pivot & is too far from bone & Will cause the bone to twist in excessively IMO .
Old school right there. Willys car not jeep. The taper is the same as Ford. 37-39 Willis car off the top of my head. Might be up to 41?
The job is not finished. I try to find a good solution and not go backwards with my work as before 1. steering arms - Like I wrote, its just a model (pattern) 2. spring lenght is 27.9/16 in, so is longer that for example this one using in T-buckets: https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Forged-Mono-Leaf-T-Bucket-Front-Spring,7586.html 3. shackles are not my construction, I bought it from speedway motors, to 1942-48 Ford, You can see it here: https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Posies-2052-1942-48-Ford-Shackles-Plain-with-Shock-Pin,98468.html 4. spring pivots - like I wrote - require reinforcemen. Im gonna make m***ive mounts, something like this: About distance - you can see the mount with a similar distance here: https://www.millworkshotrod.com/pro...-spring-perches-fits-1937-1948-wishbones-pair What distance beetwen spring pivot and bone do you think it should be? I saw a lot of spring pivot mount solutions on this forum and in other. On this basis, I consider mine to be acceptable. Here you can see some examples from this forum and part of old article: https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum...-behind-the-axle-mounted-in-the-bones.449699/
Hello. I continue work with the steering system. I was able to buy the steering arms from old russian car - Wolga Gaz M24. Lowered them and made holes for heim joints very good quality from german company FLURO. The bending angle is large so I think that he steering arms could will be reinforced with a triangular plate welded between the shoulder and the spindle mount. Next I made the steering rod. Works very well. The vehicle will be raised and the spring mounting bolts shortened to avoid impact. Now I'm going to do cross-steer system. I saw that offroad builders using solution, in which the steering rod and the cross steer drag link are mounted on one hole, with one screw. Has anyone here used such a solution? can you write something about it?
I lowered the steering rod about 0,8 in. I installed the spacer bushings, Yes I know it is not the best idea but here in Poland is a big problem to buy something like Willis tie rod ends or droped spindle arms from Pete & Jakes....... So now the spacer bushings are only pattern to check out if its works. I will make thick spacer bushings which will be pressed into the steering arms and then additionally welded (tig). By the way - offroad builders recommend installing spacers between the steering arm and the heim joint (his protects the heim joint against damage with a long suspension travel). Next I make a cross steer drag link using the rolled thick wall pipe (as I made steering rod). I bent the stick to be at the same level as the steering rod. I checked that the rods wouldn't meet when the wheels were turned. It is ok. Now I'm waiting for other pitman arm to check if it will be better then this I have now. Then I will decide which one to use and will finish cross steering drag link. On this forum is a lot of very experienced builders. This is my first vehicle, so please let me know if the work is going in the right direction now. I will be very grateful for each comment. Thanks. Lukasz
If you don't need the spacer to gain clearance from your spring, I think it should be removed. You don't need it for long suspension travel like the offroad trucks do. It will induce leverage to the arm, and that should be avoided if possible. Plus, lowering the tie rod too much will put it into the scrub zone territory.
The Willy's dropped tie rod ends while they can compliment a dropped axle & a reshaped upper steering arm such as Neal Jennings & others here on the hamb have done, I'm not sure of the thread pitch, an example might be a 32 ford tie rod I believe is 11/16"x 24 fine thread others 5/8"x 18, 3/4" & so on, not a big issue perhaps as Speedway & others will custom cut & thread or do your own.
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