Technical Lincoln Versaille 9" rear conversion to Drum Brakes Question(s)

That is exactly why I'm personally leaning toward a drum brake setup.

FWIW Digging through old info, apparently I found a post on a Mustang forum that lists a required spacer to use with Wilwood brakes with the Versailles rear end as Part# 300-6355 Spacer, Bracket
https://www.wilwood.com/hardware/HardwareProd?itemno=300-6355

 

I have this kit and I'm having the housing ends cut off and the torino big bearing ends welded on, if my ch***is builder friend can ever fit me in.
I sold all the stock Versailles brakes and axles to a guy for a hundred bucks, he thinks he can retro fit it onto a dodge axle since they're both 5x4.5 bolt pattern...

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Curr...-4-Drum-Brake-Kit-5-on-4-5-4-75-BP,94354.html

 

I’ll second the comment on your shop.
Good to see someone else who appreciates what it’s like to work in a clean organized space.

I think you’re doing the right thing by switching out to the drum brakes.
Far less troublesome.

Yes, they were probably great when they were on a brand new Versailles but beyond that they are trouble.
I left at least 6 of them behind in the wrecking yard over the years because I don’t have masochistic tendencies.

 

Here are the pictures with the brake shoe width and flange dimension from a late model big bearing housing. Also remember that when you buy the drums you need to insure it has the correct bolt circle pattern. I suggest you purchase a copy of the book pictured below. Amazon was out of them a couple weeks ago, but Summit had them and they were a lot cheaper. Of course you had to pay shipping unless you had a $100 order. Very good book. Not just about setting them up. Has lots of identifying info.




This shows what the factory installed on a housing I have. So that combination will work. I can't say that is the only combination that will work with a 2 1/2 flange spacing.

 

@ekimneirbo ^^^^ thanks for the above! Do you happen to know what vehicle those backing plates are for?

 

I had same factory 9 inch disc in my 32. It totally ****ed ! The e brake set up never worked good enough to even hold at idele. no matter how adjusted. smart move you're doing going to drums.

 

I have a bunch of 9" rears and some GM 10 bolts and I do not remember or never knew where some of them came from. I know that most of them came from pick up trucks. One of the recently acquired ones has the small pattern but came from a 62 pick up according to the seller. I believe since they are referred to as "late model big bearing" that most of the later production (after maybe 65 ?) probably are the bigger bearing diameter but don't have any conclusive info to base it on. I simply believe the pick ups are probably a good source. My suggestion is to try to find another rear end that is complete or complete except for the pumpkin. Just look at the back side of the backing plate for the rectangular shape like the end on your housing. The small and the early or Torino style has a radius bottom on the flange of the housing. So if it has the rectangular shape its a big bearing housing and you get all the little parts inside each drum as well as 2 possibly usable (turnable) drums. Remove what you need and resell the rest. Then buy new springs and stuff for the inside.

Check your messages........

 

I just pulled a Versailles a 9" from storage. I will grab the full-size brakes from storage #2 tomorrow.

I plan on doing a retrofit, and write up.

 

Since spending 91-hours, over 7-days, moving into my new shop was not enough, I pulled the axle apart to start measuring (and to see what gears it has). The housing ends on these are an odd duck.

They have the rough outside shape of a late big-bearing end, but the bolt pattern of an early big bearing end.

This will likely be advantageous. Conventional early big-bearing ends are a large circle, with a chunk removed at the top. Backing plates for those have a wide pocket to fit that. Welding-up the mounting holes and redrilling them, to work with the "tilted" Versailles ends should be straightforward. I just need to confirm the offset.

 

Look on Speedway and they sell a kit with the correct backing plates included.

 

I got a set of late 90s Crown Vic/Grand Marquis disc brakes for my Granada rear end. The caliper bracket bolts right on, but you need a spacer between the mounting flange and the bearing to make up the difference.

 

That caused some confusion when I was shopping for brakes on Friday. The late Torino housing end has 3/8" bolts, this Versailles has 1/2". The vendor told me to just measure the distance between the bolts and sure enough it looks like a Torino housing end but it's really an early big bearing bolt pattern.

 

Yup. It is a strange mixture of specs. I have some late big bearing brakes. My plan is to weld up the holes in the backing plates, and re-drill them.

 

One thing about using the late brakes is it's a smaller hole to weld up. Every advantage counts.

 

That's just a few seconds of work. I still need to cut off the caliper brackets, and measure offset.

 

Digging this thread back up. I just put a Lincoln Versailles housing on the bench, and cut off all of the brackets from the car that it was in.

The plan is to check it for straightness, and correct as necessary.

Then, I will retrofit full-size p***enger car drums to it, and post the pictures.

It will then get fresh bearings and seals, and go up for sale.

 

Thanks again, I'm looking forward to seeing your solution.

 

what front brakes are you planning on running?

 

Front 11" rotor disc brakes...I believe this was the kit I bought:

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Disc...-to-Early-Ford-Spindle-5-on-4-1-2In,4575.html

 

have you had the shafts in and the wheels on with tires
or, is your axle 54/55 inches wide

p.s. I like what you have done piercing the rear leaf shackle through the rail

 

Today I dismantled the axle, and finished removing all of the brackets from its previous life.

It took longer than expected.

I will grab some gaskets tomorrow, so I can check the housing for straightness. Once I know it is straight, I will move forward with the brake install.

 

And... I have to go back to storage.

I never did fetch the brake ***emblies.

 

I've not had everything together yet...but my tape measure says I'm on track. The rear housing is 52.25"...with axles in place, wheel mount surface to wheel mount surface is 57". Hope that helps.

 

I've had those kind of days...and if you're like me, you'll get to the storage unit and think to yourself, why did I come here?

 

It does not help that the storage unit is a 34-mile round-trip.

 

I am wanting to fix the brakes on my Versailles rear axle. I intend to try one last experiment on the present disc brake system, and then I will start the process of converting it to drum brakes. I am anxiously following this post for more information. Speedway has the complete shoe brake ***emblies for $375. I know nothing about this change over. I know that I will need to cut the axle flange free and have indexed correctly and rewelded so that the backing plates will be indexed correctly. I do not know about the interchangeability of flange from disc to backing plates and the distance from this bearing flange to the wheel flange. I do not want to change the width of the rear axle. I am also wondering if the distance will be correct so that the drum and backing plate are spaced correctly. If anyone has any new information on this topic, I would welcome it.

 

I purchased the loaded backing plates and drums from Quick Performance for $300. I'll probably be cutting the bearing flange loose, rotating and re- welding them. I still need to build a truing bar and plugs.

 

Gimpy, did you ever do a write up on the conversion. I have a Versailles 9” and I’m putting drums on. Took it to a buddy to remove the caliper bracket and replace the bearings and discovered there is an oil seal in the caliper bracket that’s coming off. Not sure what to do.

 

I gave up and removed and sold the rear end. I replaced it with a shoe type Ford 8.8 out of a Ranger. It was nearly the same width, same bolt pattern, and a better ratio. I am happy. I would never mess with a Versailles rear again. They were a good item years ago but not today.